Jamesrob637
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A Hull diagram is showing 3-car all day on Journey Check for tomorrow! Advance planning at its finest! What's the betting TP do actually put a 6-car on after all?!
A good chance that this is to do with the fatality on the south route earlier today (Monday). Most likely messed up the unit diagrams so a spare is being pinched off the Hull circuit to plug a gap.A Hull diagram is showing 3-car all day on Journey Check for tomorrow! Advance planning at its finest! What's the betting TP do actually put a 6-car on after all?!
A good chance that this is to do with the fatality on the south route earlier today (Monday). Most likely messed up the unit diagrams so a spare is being pinched off the Hull circuit to plug a gap.
Refreshing Journey Check periodically the past two weeks, it seems like short-forms have been occasional but certainly could have been worse.
I am personally booked on the 09:11 Manchester to Sheffield next Monday and the 22:11 return. I believe that the 22:11 might lose a unit at Cleethorpes but shouldn't be an issue on a Monday night (probably wouldn't justify a double on a Monday night even under normal circumstances).
I caught the Cleethorpes - Piccadilly service at Dore this morrning, 6 coaches at 8.14 that picked up 2. It was very easy to count the 17 of us who alighted in Manchester. A 153 would probably have sufficed even with distancing.
At this rate it's going to be a long time before we really need double units. One has to wonder how much longer they'll be sent out.
That one only went double relatively recently. Think it was only last year (but produced a single pre-COVID often enough although it got better this year, or what we had of it prior to lockdown!)
Incidentally that'll be my 09:11 outbound Monday so had better be on time into Manchester then I see it was more or less on time today.
Sorry if I’ve missed this in all that’s gone on recently but are TPE keeping the extra 185s. Most Huddersfield and Hull services ex Piccadilly seem to be 6-car at the moment.
So after December:
All Redcars remain booked 6-car
All South TPE remain booked 6-car with the exception of the always very lightly-loaded 20:26 Cleethorpes to Manchester Airport which poses no problem for social distancing
All Hulls remain booked 6-car
Most if not all of the Manchester to Huddersfield stoppers remain booked 6-car
A couple of Scarboroughs which aren't operated by the new trains remain booked 6-car
Leeds to Huddersfield locals can't be booked 6-car because of the short bay platform at Huddersfield
Please feel free to correct me on any of the above.
The Manchester to Huddersfield stopper (daytime, Mon-Sat) is reverting to 3 car. The evening and Sunday stops are being inserted into Hull services so may be 6 car.
The wording for Redcar, South TPE and Hull services is "most, or majority" of services will be 6 car, so there will still be a few 3 car services on those routes.
Of course, with pax numbers declining again who knows if the December timetable will come to fruition as it has been planned.
So after December:
All Redcars remain booked 6-car
All South TPE remain booked 6-car with the exception of the always very lightly-loaded 20:26 Cleethorpes to Manchester Airport which poses no problem for social distancing
All Hulls remain booked 6-car
Most if not all of the Manchester to Huddersfield stoppers remain booked 6-car
A couple of Scarboroughs which aren't operated by the new trains remain booked 6-car
Leeds to Huddersfield locals can't be booked 6-car because of the short bay platform at Huddersfield
Please feel free to correct me on any of the above.
Stopper routes are ALL 3 car
Redcar and South route will see some 3 car service but mostly 6 car.
That’s IF the new timetable actually comes into place with the latest lockdown announcement. There is a plan B timetable with reduced services.
A Manchester to Huddersfield was saying 3-car instead of 6 all day on Journey Check yesterday. A guess told me that it was the same (pair) shuttling back and forth. Was that an error?
There’s a schedule clash with Northern on a Sunday which means that only half of Platform 4 is available so the stopper has to be reduced to 3 vice 6.A Manchester to Huddersfield was saying 3-car instead of 6 all day on Journey Check yesterday. A guess told me that it was the same (pair) shuttling back and forth. Was that an error?
There’s a schedule clash with Northern on a Sunday which means that only half of Platform 4 is available so the stopper has to be reduced to 3 vice 6.
It remains to be seen what will happen in December. Reductions of the stoppers in the evening and returning to 3 coaches was on the basis of significant enhancement to the base timetable. If this doesn’t happen, I would be surprised if the current TT doesn’t just carry on with minimal tweaks.
Weren’t the Leeds-Huddersfield stoppers doing the Marsden ECS shuffle to get around that problem?There’s a schedule clash with Northern on a Sunday which means that only half of Platform 4 is available so the stopper has to be reduced to 3 vice 6.
It remains to be seen what will happen in December. Reductions of the stoppers in the evening and returning to 3 coaches was on the basis of significant enhancement to the base timetable. If this doesn’t happen, I would be surprised if the current TT doesn’t just carry on with minimal tweaks.
There was an issue to do with the timings of the ECS and how long train crew had to dispose of a unit which lead to that plan being binned if I remember correctly.Weren’t the Leeds-Huddersfield stoppers doing the Marsden ECS shuffle to get around that problem?
There’s a schedule clash with Northern on a Sunday which means that only half of Platform 4 is available so the stopper has to be reduced to 3 vice 6.
It remains to be seen what will happen in December. Reductions of the stoppers in the evening and returning to 3 coaches was on the basis of significant enhancement to the base timetable. If this doesn’t happen, I would be surprised if the current TT doesn’t just carry on with minimal tweaks.
Thought there was a logical reason for those ECS moves disappearing after the last timetable change. Thank you.There was an issue to do with the timings of the ECS and how long train crew had to dispose of a unit which lead to that plan being binned if I remember correctly.
Weren’t the Leeds-Huddersfield stoppers doing the Marsden ECS shuffle to get around that problem?
The Marsden ECS shuffle was mandated by the LDS-HUD stopper being too long for Platform 6. Once you cut it down to 3, there’s no impact M-Sa whether the LDS-HUD stopper uses Platform 6 or runs to Marsden, but on a Sunday the Northern to Bradford is extended to Leeds. This requires different platform occupancy at HUD and if Platform 6 is not available it must use Platform 4a, resulting in a clash with the MAN-HUD stopper if it is 6 car.There was an issue to do with the timings of the ECS and how long train crew had to dispose of a unit which lead to that plan being binned if I remember correctly.
It was planned as evenings and Sundays. There’s adequate planning capacity to make all the Hull services into a stopper. The challenge to the plan will come from the DfT/RNP who will need to ratify it first. The premise around removing the stoppers was to provide additional capacity (resource) to run more express services at the right times, rather than wasting resources running too many empty trains into the night. I somehow doubt the DfT will accept a further reduction in the current overall service level - redistribution yes. Remember we are talking about post-December, until next May potentially.The Hull services are meant to be replacing the Manchester stopper in December on Sunday’s so this won’t be an issue as we’ll be using platforms 8 and 1.
Even if there is a reduction in the new timetable with the recent lockdown announcement, I can still see this happening as it reduces the number of trains and traincrew required whilst not affecting the amount of passenger services for the intermediate station and the Hull service has large amounts of layover either end of the service
08:07 Redcar to Manchester Airport is only booked a single, however it's a double upon return from the airport.
Woth the other unit coming off a Cleethorpes services that comes ECS from Piccadilly. But this leaves a gap of an hour on South TPE.
Just one 3-car diagram during the day, and that one's booked a double. All 6 others (hourly frequency has now resumed) are doubles as booked.Looks like most South TPE are only 3-car today for the eastern section Doncaster to Cleethorpes.