LNER Class 91/Mk4 service status/withdrawals/2021 refurbishment

[BigB]

Is NH correct - this is Newton Heath vs NL which is Neville Hill?

 

[DanNCL]

Seems very unrailwaylike to stand down the remaining fleet for a period for overhauls. I'd wager that Neville Hill would be unlikely to tackle more that one or two locos at a time, so may as well keep the rest of the fleet at work, and rotate - obviously with correspondingly fewer diagrams during the overhaul period. That would keep the fleet active and maintain crew competencies.

Only my opinion though.

The overhauls have been contracted out to Wabtec in Doncaster. Neville Hill would only be taking over the day to day maintenance of the sets.

 

[IanXC]

I posted in the Other Class 91 thread this little nugget.

See there, but 91s will be headquartered at NL and not BN.

I see you have edited this post now.

Putting my old hat on....

...codes and abbreviations must not be made up.

 

[Mack91]

I saw 91127 at York on Friday. Crap picture, however it has a shed sticker for Neville Hill now, as opposed to Bounds Green...

 

[59CosG95]

Current disposition of Mk4s (8/12/2020):

Depot code key:
ZB - Wabtec Doncaster
WS - Worksop (Harry Needle)
LM - Long Marston
WB - Wembley IC Depot

Text/Colour Code Key
Plain - stored
Struck through - Scrapped
Italic - in service

Black - LNER/VTEC livery
Red - TfW livery
Orange - Grand Central (debranded) livery

Set	B	C	D	E	F	H	K	L	M	DVT	Status
BN01	12207	12417	12415	12414	12307	10307	11298	11301	11401	82207	Stored, WS
BN02	12232	12402	12450	12448	12302	10302	11299	11302	11402	82202	Stored, WS
BN03	12201	12401	12459	12478	12301	10320	11277	11303	11403	82219	Stored, WS
BN04	12202	12480	12421	12518	12327	10303	11278	11304	11404	82209	Stored, WS
BN05	12209	12486	12520	12522	12300	10326	11219	11305	11405	82210	Stored, WS
BN06	12208	12406	12420	12422	12313	10309	11279	11306	11406	82208	In service, LNER
BN07	12231	12411	12405	12489	12329	10323	11280	11307	11407	82204	Stored, WS
BN08	12205	12481	12485	12407	12328	10300	11229	11308	11408	82211	In service, LNER
BN09	12230	12513	12483	12514	12308	10304	11281	11309	11409	82215	Stored, WS
BN10	12200	12419	12488	12443	12305	10331	11282	11310	11410	82224	Stored, WS
BN11	12203	12437	12436	12484	12315	10308	11283	11311	11411	82218	Stored, WS
BN12	12212	12431	12404	12426	12330	10333	11284	11312	11412	82212	In service, LNER
BN13	12228	12469	12430	12424	12311	10313	11285	11313	11413	82213	In service, LNER
BN14	12229	12410	12526	12423	12312	10332	11201	11314	11414	82206	Stored, WS
BN15	12226	12442	12409	12515	12309	10306	11286	11315	11415	82214	In service, LNER
BN16	12213	12428	12445	12433	12304	10315	11287	11316	11416	82222	Stored, WS
BN17	12223	12444	12427	12432	12303	10324	11288	11317	11417	82225	In service, LNER
BN18	12215	12453	12468	12467	12324	10305	11289	11318	11418	82220	Stored, WS
BN19 (GC01)	12211	12434	12400	12470	12310	10318	11290	11319	11419	82201	Stored, WB
BN20 (GC02)	12224	12477	12439 (ZB)	12440 (ZB)	12326	10321	11241	11320	11420	82200	Stored, WB/ZB.
BN21 (GC03)	12222	12461	12441	12476	12323	10330	11244	11321	11421	82227	Stored, WB
BN22 (GC04)	12210	12452	12460	12473	12316	10301	11291	11322	11422	82230	Stored, WB
BN23 (HD01)	12225	12454	12456	12455	12318 (WS)	10325	11292	11323	11423	82226	Holyhead based TfW training set.
BN24 (HD02)	12219	12447	12425	12403	12319 (WS)	10328	11293	11324	11424	82229	Crewe based TfW training set.
BN25 (HD03)	12217	12446	12519	12464	12322 (WS)	10312	11294	11325	11425	82216	Cardiff Canton based TfW training set.
BN26	12220	12474	12465	12429	12325	10311	11295	11326	11426	82223	In service, LNER
BN27	12216	12449	12466	12538	12317	10319	11237	11327	11427	82228	Stored, WS
BN28	12218	12458	12463	12533	12320	10310	11273	11328	11428	82217	Stored, ZB
BN29	12204	12462	12457	12438	12321	10317	11998	11329	11429	82231	Stored, WS
BN30	12227	12471	12534 (LM)	12472 (LM)	12331	10329	11999 (ZB)	11330	11430 (ZB)	82203	Stored, WS/ZB/LM
Spare	12214									82205	In service, LNER

 

[greyman42]

There is a 91 at Doncaster with its nose cut off for some reason.

To spite its face!

 

[Mack91]

The table showing the status of the Mk IVs is really helpful, thanks for posting!

 

[59CosG95]

11410, 12445, 12321, 12331 & 12471 are also likely to be roaded to Sims sites in Hull this week. Possibly also 82203.

Additionally, Mk4s 11430, 11999, 12439, 12440, 12463 & 12533 are still confirmed as being in Doncaster.

 

[DJ_K666]

I've just found an interesting Equinox episode on the railways and keeping to time, with a lengthy piece on the class 91 (or 'Electra' as it was known at the time) plus its development and manufacture, as well as a rather vampiric looking project director seen at Bounds Green...

 

[ecml_trains]

does anyone know where LNERS 91s will be refurbished now that they have all being withdrawn till march ?

all I know is that 110 and 111 are at doncaster having an g exam done

 

[Mack91]

91130 seems to be travelling from Neville Hill to York tonight, and on an early service to King's Cross tomorrow morning

Realtime Trains - 5Y00 2223 Neville Hill T&R.S.M.D to York

Realtime Trains provides live realtime running information for the Great British railway network using open data.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

From what I've read I understand that the 91s will receive their G exams at Doncaster, like 110 and 111 currently, whilst the Mk IVs are refurbished at Neville Hill?

If anybody knows, what does the work happening to the stock consist of?

 

[swt_passenger]

does anyone know where LNERS 91s will be refurbished now that they have all being withdrawn till march ?

all I know is that 110 and 111 are at doncaster having an g exam done

Welcome to the forums.

Overhaul is at Wabtec, Doncaster.

 

[ecml_trains]

91130 seems to be travelling from Neville Hill to York tonight, and on an early service to King's Cross tomorrow morning

Realtime Trains - 5Y00 2223 Neville Hill T&R.S.M.D to York

Realtime Trains provides live realtime running information for the Great British railway network using open data.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

From what I've read I understand that the 91s will receive their G exams at Doncaster, like 110 and 111 currently, whilst the Mk IVs are refurbished at Neville Hill?

If anybody knows, what does the work happening to the stock consist of?

that's strange cause 91114 running the other day should have been the last class 91 but for a fair while. but 130 is at Leeds so unless they are taking it to b green in preparation for its g exam but using it for a day of service

 

[43094]

There’s 91s planned in service for a few more days yet.

 

[HarryL]

If they are to return back to service, how long would they be back for? If they're coming back for a while yet can we possibly expect to see a proper LNER livery on them when they return? The current vinyls are getting quite faded (compare the original VT red to the later LNER stickers) and the front's are getting quite grubby.

 

[clagmonster]

that's strange cause 91114 running the other day should have been the last class 91 but for a fair while. but 130 is at Leeds so unless they are taking it to b green in preparation for its g exam but using it for a day of service

15th January should be the last day for a few months. 91114's couple of days were vice 80x.

If they are to return back to service, how long would they be back for? If they're coming back for a while yet can we possibly expect to see a proper LNER livery on them when they return? The current vinyls are getting quite faded (compare the original VT red to the later LNER stickers) and the front's are getting quite grubby.

Assuming that they do come back as is currently expected and that the December 2021 timetable enhancements go ahead in full, the current plan is for the 91s and mark 4s to be withdrawn in 2023. I don't think any replacements have been ordered as yet however.

 

[ecml_trains]

15th January should be the last day for a few months. 91114's couple of days were vice 80x.


Assuming that they do come back as is currently expected and that the December 2021 timetable enhancements go ahead in full, the current plan is for the 91s and mark 4s to be withdrawn in 2023. I don't think any replacements have been ordered as yet however.

Dont think they are going to get replaced just a full azuma fleet

 

[DB]

Assuming that they do come back as is currently expected and that the December 2021 timetable enhancements go ahead in full, the current plan is for the 91s and mark 4s to be withdrawn in 2023. I don't think any replacements have been ordered as yet however.

And there may well not be any new repalcements, given the financial issues the country is going to be facing!

Wonder whether the Mk4s will get a proper repaint? Their vinyls are starting to look pretty tatty now, although the interiors are mostly OK.

 

[ecml_trains]

If they are to return back to service, how long would they be back for? If they're coming back for a while yet can we possibly expect to see a proper LNER livery on them when they return? The current vinyls are getting quite faded (compare the original VT red to the later LNER stickers) and the front's are getting quite grubby.

No they will all have the same paint no exterior work is getting done outher than the under frame

 

[DB]

No they will all have the same paint no exterior work is getting done outher than the under frame

It's mostly vinyls rather than paint, and they do indeed look pretty tatty now.

 

[Mack91]

105, 114 and 130 all out today

 

[Peter Mugridge]

Has 91 105 replaced 91 127? I have the below...

91 130

1Y00 04:40 York to Kings Cross
1D06 08:33 Kings Cross to Leeds
1A26 11:15 Leeds to Kings Cross

91 114

1A04 06:05 Leeds to Kings Cross
1N81 09:06 Kings Cross to York
1Y84 12:02 York to Kings Cross
1N87 15:06 Kings Cross to York
1Y90 18:02 York to Kings Cross

91 127

1D17 14:03 Kings Cross to Leeds
1A41 16:45 Leeds to Kings Cross
1D30 19:33 Kings Cross to Leeds

 

[Mollman]

Dont think they are going to get replaced just a full azuma fleet

LNER have put out a tender for 10 bi-modes, no idea why they want more expensive bi-modes rather than full electrics to replace 225s

 

[supervc-10]

Operational flexibility perhaps? But yes. That does seem odd to me. Going by Wiki, they had 14 HST sets, and have 13 nine-car sets and 10 five-car, effectively the equivalent of 18 HSTs assuming the 5-car bi-mode sets operate in pairs.

Is the tender for full length units or 5-cars?

 

[Mollman]

Operational flexibility perhaps? But yes. That does seem odd to me. Going by Wiki, they had 14 HST sets, and have 13 nine-car sets and 10 five-car, effectively the equivalent of 18 HSTs assuming the 5-car bi-mode sets operate in pairs.

Is the tender for full length units or 5-cars?

Don't recall it saying the length but I would assume 9-car if they are replacing 225s

 

[swt_passenger]

Don't recall it saying the length but I would assume 9-car if they are replacing 225s

For confirmation of above, the Prior Information Notice just reads as follows, no specific length was specified:

Network Rail are undertaking several infrastructure projects on the East Coast Main Line to increase the number of available train paths between London and Edinburgh. As a result of this, London North Eastern Railway (LNER) will be able to operate 6.5 trains per hour in each direction between London and Doncaster. The infrastructure that enables the timetable to be implemented is expected to be completed prior to the May 2022 timetable change.

Initially, LNER will retain a fleet of IC225 trains to provide the seating capacity required by the new timetable. However, this will be an interim measure until an additional fleet is procured which will replace the IC225 fleet. LNER is seeking to procure a minimum fleet of ten (10) InterCity trains based around specific technical and operating characteristics.

The trains shall be fully rated for operation on 25 kV Overhead Line Equipment (OLE) and with significant self-power capability for operation away from the OLE. On Board Energy Storage (OBES) for traction will be specified as a mandatory requirement to reduce, and wherever practicable eliminate, diesel usage where it would otherwise be necessary. LNER anticipates that some degree of diesel traction may be required to supplement the OBES to meet all the self-power requirements.

Rolling Stock [PIN]

Network Rail are undertaking several infrastructure projects on the East Coast Main Line to increase... A Prior Information Notice by London North Eastern Railway.

bidstats.uk

 

[ian94]

The 16:30 to Edinburgh has had a set swap and is now a 91! I’m onboard now.

 

[skyhigh]

The 16:30 to Edinburgh has had a set swap and is now a 91! I’m onboard now.

Only as far as York.

 

[ian94]

Only as far as York.

You sure? they haven't made any annoucements about people having to change

 

[skyhigh]

You sure? they haven't made any annoucements about people having to change

Last I heard the plan was to swap it with 801216 at York. I believe this is the path for the 801 to York: https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/87220/2021-01-05

And then the 91 heads back on this: https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/87234/2021-01-05/detailed