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Your pub and hospitality experience as the Covid restrictions ease

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takno

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I'm sure people said the same when supermarkets came along, electric trains first used.

Things move on and this is nothing to do with Covid. Was all happening before and if anything covid sped it up. You can still order at a till or ask for help with the touch screens.
I'm aware of that thanks. There's been almost no actual innovation related to Covid. It's all just people who had a pre-existing blue tape factory, aversion to people, curious hatred of cash, or some other ghastly technical solution to a problem nobody had
 
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_toommm_

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Went to The Station Inn at Ribblehead on Sunday. Weirdly they don’t take orders at the bar, instead requiring table service with tablets and mobile card machines.

It was very busy with walkers but they’ve installed a tent outside with more tables. The experience was great though, I was there for two hours after doing the Yorkshire Peaks. Good food, good pints, great experience.
 

NorthOxonian

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Went to The Station Inn at Ribblehead on Sunday. Weirdly they don’t take orders at the bar, instead requiring table service with tablets and mobile card machines.
Unfortunately that's the case virtually everywhere - it's certainly required by law in England.

I can't remember if I mentioned it in this thread but a few weeks back I got served at the bar in a pub in Gretna - I assume there are/were different rules there.
 

_toommm_

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Unfortunately that's the case virtually everywhere - it's certainly required by law in England.

I can't remember if I mentioned it in this thread but a few weeks back I got served at the bar in a pub in Gretna - I assume there are/were different rules there.
I thought we could now order at the bar, and that table service wasn’t required anymore in England?

(I might be wrong though).
 

D6130

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I thought we could now order at the bar, and that table service wasn’t required anymore in England?
Not yet......table ordering and service are still required by law in England - until 21st June at the earliest - whether seated inside or outside.

They do the best deep-pan.
That's not pizza....it's a pie! ;)
 
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MikeWM

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Things move on and this is nothing to do with Covid. Was all happening before and if anything covid sped it up. You can still order at a till or ask for help with the touch screens.

In theory you can still order at a till, yes. [1] But after a couple of experiences of standing at the remaining ‘order’ till for 10 minutes or so, and no staff bothering to show up to take my order, I’ve pretty much given up on McD’s too.

But yes, this was before Covid. Now McD’s looks so annoying that I’ve not even attempted to go in one since last March. Which is probably not such a bad thing, but still... :)

[1] though doing so effectively means queueing twice, whereas previously you queued once. Not exactly what I’d call an improvement.
 

kristiang85

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I went to a lot of bars and pubs in Manchester at the weekend. The atmosphere was great, but I think I spent about 10% of my time fiddling about with apps to order. I can't wait to see the back of these.

One pub I went to didn't even have the app working for the first half hour, but said they couldn't take orders manually. So they had a whole pub of people waiting with no food or drink, then obviously couldn't cope when the app finally started working...
 

Jamiescott1

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One pub i went to at the weekend had a member of staff walking around taking orders and payment on an ipad. With drinks and food dispensed by other staff.
Unfortunately there was only 1 ipad, for a packed pub and it took 20 minutes to order
 

WelshBluebird

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In theory you can still order at a till, yes. [1] But after a couple of experiences of standing at the remaining ‘order’ till for 10 minutes or so, and no staff bothering to show up to take my order, I’ve pretty much given up on McD’s too.

But yes, this was before Covid. Now McD’s looks so annoying that I’ve not even attempted to go in one since last March. Which is probably not such a bad thing, but still... :)

[1] though doing so effectively means queueing twice, whereas previously you queued once. Not exactly what I’d call an improvement.
It may depend on the restaurant (I hate calling fast food places a restaurant but I'm not sure of the correct work otherwise!).
Certainly down this way, before they put the touchscreens in place you still had to queue twice. Once at the till to order and pay and then to actually pick up your food. Its been a long long time since I've been to any fast food place that still worked on the "one queue" method where you'd wait at the till whilst the person who just took your order actually went to get your food - even if there isn't an actual separate queue most places now will just ask you to step aside and wait for your food whilst they serve the next person in the queue.
I went to a lot of bars and pubs in Manchester at the weekend. The atmosphere was great, but I think I spent about 10% of my time fiddling about with apps to order. I can't wait to see the back of these.
Is that really any different to spending about 10% of your timing at a bar trying (and often failing if it was that busy) to get served? Certainly for busy places I quite like the table service stuff because it means I can stay at the table and continue chatting to my friends whilst I am waiting to get the drink!
One pub I went to didn't even have the app working for the first half hour, but said they couldn't take orders manually. So they had a whole pub of people waiting with no food or drink, then obviously couldn't cope when the app finally started working...
But that is just poor form. Always have a backup option for technology!
 

LowLevel

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In theory you can still order at a till, yes. [1] But after a couple of experiences of standing at the remaining ‘order’ till for 10 minutes or so, and no staff bothering to show up to take my order, I’ve pretty much given up on McD’s too.

But yes, this was before Covid. Now McD’s looks so annoying that I’ve not even attempted to go in one since last March. Which is probably not such a bad thing, but still... :)

[1] though doing so effectively means queueing twice, whereas previously you queued once. Not exactly what I’d call an improvement.

At McDonald's I can now either order on the app or do exactly what I want on a screen with customisation, hang on for a couple of minutes and walk out with my food.

The old system with a queue out the door at busy times, people shouting at each other and trying to work out where to be to get served or collect food should be left in the 90s where it belongs.

I get the argument about not removing work from people but the old way in McDonald's was just horrible.
 

MikeWM

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At McDonald's I can now either order on the app or do exactly what I want on a screen with customisation, hang on for a couple of minutes and walk out with my food.

Not if you want to pay with cash, you can't.

I understand this is the 'modern world' and people who prefer to use cash are no longer of interest, indeed nuisances, to most businesses. But personally, if I feel a business is deliberately making life difficult for people who want to use cash, like myself, then I'll take my business elsewhere - for now, at least, there are still more than enough places that are happy to take my cash (or indeed are 'cash only').

It may depend on the restaurant (I hate calling fast food places a restaurant but I'm not sure of the correct work otherwise!).
Certainly down this way, before they put the touchscreens in place you still had to queue twice. Once at the till to order and pay and then to actually pick up your food. Its been a long long time since I've been to any fast food place that still worked on the "one queue" method where you'd wait at the till whilst the person who just took your order actually went to get your food - even if there isn't an actual separate queue most places now will just ask you to step aside and wait for your food whilst they serve the next person in the queue.

I think it depends on what you were ordering - if you were just ordering say a portion of fries and a drink, you'd normally get served immediately by the person taking your order. If you were ordering something 'bespoke' or unusual, then yes, you'd have to go off to one side and try not to get in the way until your order was ready.
 

LowLevel

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Not if you want to pay with cash, you can't.

I understand this is the 'modern world' and people who prefer to use cash are no longer of interest, indeed nuisances, to most businesses. But personally, if I feel a business is deliberately making life difficult for people who want to use cash, like myself, then I'll take my business elsewhere - for now, at least, there are still more than enough places that are happy to take my cash (or indeed are 'cash only').



I think it depends on what you were ordering - if you were just ordering say a portion of fries and a drink, you'd normally get served immediately by the person taking your order. If you were ordering something 'bespoke' or unusual, then yes, you'd have to go off to one side and try not to get in the way until your order was ready.

Therein lies your problem - the number of people still wanting to pay cash for a McDonald's are so small that it doesn't really matter to them if you do just that.
 

duncanp

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I went to a lot of bars and pubs in Manchester at the weekend. The atmosphere was great, but I think I spent about 10% of my time fiddling about with apps to order. I can't wait to see the back of these.

One pub I went to didn't even have the app working for the first half hour, but said they couldn't be bothered to take orders manually. So they had a whole pub of people waiting with no food or drink, then obviously couldn't cope when the app finally started working...

I have updated your post to more accurately reflect the reality.

There is of course no reason why orders can't be taken manually, and it shows a certain amount of contempt for the customers if they treat them in this way, leaving them waiting for ages with no food or drink.

Any competent manager would have checked that the App was working properly before the pub opened, and put in a manual system of ordering if the App was found to be faulty.

Some pubs and bars seem to think that the world owes them a living, and are going to be in for a rude shock when they find out that this is not the case.

If I were you, I would name and shame the pub, and find somewhere else in future.
 

gordonthemoron

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Independent pubs seem to be more likely to take your order personally, whereas chains seem to use apps. Apps can be great sometimes, or largely useless as at the Cardigan Arms in Leeds, where the wifi doesn't work and the 4G is crap

I have updated your post to more accurately reflect the reality.

There is of course no reason why orders can't be taken manually, and it shows a certain amount of contempt for the customers if they treat them in this way, leaving them waiting for ages with no food or drink.

Any competent manager would have checked that the App was working properly before the pub opened, and put in a manual system of ordering if the App was found to be faulty.

Some pubs and bars seem to think that the world owes them a living, and are going to be in for a rude shock when they find out that this is not the case.

If I were you, I would name and shame the pub, and find somewhere else in future.

Spot on, the app at my local doesn't work quite a lot of the time, and they take orders manually
 
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MikeWM

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Therein lies your problem - the number of people still wanting to pay cash for a McDonald's are so small that it doesn't really matter to them if you do just that.

Intuitively, I'd have thought given the McDonalds demographic they'd have rather more people than average wanting/needing to pay in cash. Though perhaps my intuition is wrong on that one. Either way, I'd say it is their problem, not mine - they're no longer getting my money, and I'm probably eating better food :)

Anyhow, on a different note, do cinemas count as hospitality? I've found them to be a lot busier this time around than they were last year (with the exception of when Tenet first came out), even though the slate of films on reopening hasn't been especially inspiring. I've encountered a lot of (Covid-capacity) sold-out screenings - I had particular trouble in Derby a couple of weeks back, eventually having to walk a couple of miles to the out-of-town Odeon and watch an animated Japanese film, because pretty much everything else everywhere else was sold out!

In terms of track-and-trace, some chains seem more strict on it than others. I was particularly disappointed with Showcase, who not only took name/phone number on the door (fair enough) but then *required* an email address to be input before printing a ticket. (I didn't have time to argue about it because I was late, unfortunately). Cineworld/Vue/Odeon haven't noticably changed in procedures since last year.

At least my local cinema (Cineworld in Ely) is back. When it closed last October, I wasn't confident it would ever open again. Happily it has.
 

island

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Not if you want to pay with cash, you can't.
Ah, but you can. You punch in your order the usual way and press cancel on the PIN entry device when prompted to pay by card. It will then spit out a docket which you can take to the counter to pay there. Whether it’s faster or not is debatable, but…
I understand this is the 'modern world' and people who prefer to use cash are no longer of interest, indeed nuisances, to most businesses. But personally, if I feel a business is deliberately making life difficult for people who want to use cash, like myself, then I'll take my business elsewhere - for now, at least, there are still more than enough places that are happy to take my cash (or indeed are 'cash only').
…ultimately, choosing to be awkward and not use card payment facilities available to you is only going to inconvenience one person, and it isn’t the business.
I think it depends on what you were ordering - if you were just ordering say a portion of fries and a drink, you'd normally get served immediately by the person taking your order. If you were ordering something 'bespoke' or unusual, then yes, you'd have to go off to one side and try not to get in the way until your order was ready.
Yes, my most common order at McDonald’s is a single McFlurry and historically the person taking my order would go off and make it right away. Nowadays it goes in the queue with everyone else and inevitably gets made quite quickly by someone stood over at the ice cream machine then set on a stand and left to melt whilst the 10 people before me get their big complex orders passed out.
 

kristiang85

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Is that really any different to spending about 10% of your timing at a bar trying (and often failing if it was that busy) to get served? Certainly for busy places I quite like the table service stuff because it means I can stay at the table and continue chatting to my friends whilst I am waiting to get the drink!

I see your point, but generally you can see at a glance if a pub is too busy or not and decide to walk on. With table service only, you just don't know how long it will take (on top of the app fiddling). I also actually like being at the bar, striking up conversations, and - given I drink a lot of craft beer - I like chatting to the barman about their reccomendations and sampling if it's not too busy. I miss all that.

But there is definitely room for the apps to stay for those that prefer them and have a hybrid system, like Spoons did already pre-2020.

I have updated your post to more accurately reflect the reality.

There is of course no reason why orders can't be taken manually, and it shows a certain amount of contempt for the customers if they treat them in this way, leaving them waiting for ages with no food or drink.

Any competent manager would have checked that the App was working properly before the pub opened, and put in a manual system of ordering if the App was found to be faulty.

Some pubs and bars seem to think that the world owes them a living, and are going to be in for a rude shock when they find out that this is not the case.

If I were you, I would name and shame the pub, and find somewhere else in future.

We would have left, but we were there to watch the F1 and didn't want to miss any of it by opting to go elsewhere.

I'm not going to name and shame, but I won't be going back.
 

greyman42

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Is that really any different to spending about 10% of your timing at a bar trying (and often failing if it was that busy) to get served? Certainly for busy places I quite like the table service stuff because it means I can stay at the table and continue chatting to my friends whilst I am waiting to get the drink!
With many of the pubs i go in, you are lucky to get a seat and many people are standing. How is the app going to work for them?
 

nlogax

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With many of the pubs i go in, you are lucky to get a seat and many people are standing. How is the app going to work for them?

Usually it's a fudge. Many apps have a free text field that can be used for orders (ie for indicating allergies), easy enough to stick in a 'stood in the corner by the wall' or whatever.

Roll on being able to have the actual choice of ordering at the bar or via the app.
 

island

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With many of the pubs i go in, you are lucky to get a seat and many people are standing. How is the app going to work for them?
For the time being it is illegal in England for pubs to allow anyone to be served or consume drinks whilst standing up so the matter doesn’t arise.
 

greyman42

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For the time being it is illegal in England for pubs to allow anyone to be served or consume drinks whilst standing up so the matter doesn’t arise.
Yes but that is the last thing anyone wants for more than a couple of more weeks, including many pubs that will go under if capacity restrictions restrict them to table service.
 

WelshBluebird

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I see your point, but generally you can see at a glance if a pub is too busy or not and decide to walk on. With table service only, you just don't know how long it will take (on top of the app fiddling).
I am somewhat surprised we haven't seen any of the apps get updated to include a "busyness" feature.
At least for some of the apps that should be possible as in some of the systems the orders get added to a queue for the staff to deal with and then get cleared away by staff once they have been deal with - so it shouldn't be that hard to link that queue back to the app and just show something like a traffic light view of how long that queue is!
Of course it isn't quite as easy as I make it sound (given software development is my career, there's quite often times I see something that sounds like it should be easy but actually isn't), but I am still surprised at least someone hasn't tried it.

You can at least use how full the pub is as a rough measure though - if most / all tables are full then expect a wait, if most are empty expect a quick pint! If you are having multiple drinks you can order slightly earlier than you would otherwise so your next pint gets to you just as you are finishing the previous one (although from personal experience the other week - that can get pretty messy quickly haha).
I also actually like being at the bar, striking up conversations, and - given I drink a lot of craft beer - I like chatting to the barman about their reccomendations and sampling if it's not too busy. I miss all that.
It really depends on the type of place you are in.
Certainly there are some pubs I go to where that is part of the fun, but there are others where I know what I want as they don't have much choice anyway, or they just aren't that type of place (certainly say a Spoons - which these days I do try to avoid, but if I were to go to one I'd just use the app).
But there is definitely room for the apps to stay for those that prefer them and have a hybrid system, like Spoons did already pre-2020.
It will actually be quite interesting to see what places keep the option. Some places seem to have invested more time and effort than others so I can certainly see them keeping it (Youngs pubs for example).
With many of the pubs i go in, you are lucky to get a seat and many people are standing. How is the app going to work for them?
Then you probs don't use the app? No different to how say the Spoons app worked when they had it before COVID.
 

kristiang85

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It will actually be quite interesting to see what places keep the option. Some places seem to have invested more time and effort than others so I can certainly see them keeping it (Youngs pubs for example).
.

One of my locals just uses SMS - you just text the bar what you want and they bring it over with a card reader to your table. Certainly its a lot more efficient than most of these apps, and no investment needed so it can be scrapped the moment restrictions are needed. It wouldn't work in a bigger pub though.
 

Dai Corner

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One of my locals just uses SMS - you just text the bar what you want and they bring it over with a card reader to your table. Certainly its a lot more efficient than most of these apps, and no investment needed so it can be scrapped the moment restrictions are needed. It wouldn't work in a bigger pub though.
Nothing so technical at the pubs I use most. You just hold up your nearly empty glass and the staff ask you 'same again Dia?'
 

Tracked

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Had the week off, so managed a couple of days out;

Leeds;
The White Swan - other than the slightly more spaced out tables, mask and (paper) T&T sign in it was business as usual. Table service for food, which was the same as pre-Covid, fairly busy for a Monday lunch.

North Brew Tap Rooms - Again, business as usual, on the one occasion I went in pre-Covid they were Card Only anyway.

Tapped - Haven't been in before, fairly busy, the food looked good although the service was a bit slow

Assembly Underground - Another new one for me, good choices of different food outlets in there too (not sure if these will manage to make money given current restrictions), not too busy at first (16:30) but it started picking up an hour or so later.

Hull;
Lion & Key - Always start with this one for the food, went a couple of times last summer and the beer choice was greatly reduced, yesterday they'd even taken the pump clips off so people didn't know what beers were on (Two pales and a mild), they'd managed to put buzzers on every table for service though, but a beer list would've been helpful. The Fretwells and Hawkes pubs nearby have the same owner, could only see in Fretwells but it looked like they were doing the same thing with the pump clips, so didn't bother.

Whalebone - It's a bit of a trek, but surprisingly busy considering its location. They'd done same as last summer; a few seats taped off and one person in the toilet at a time (with engaged sign).

Atom Brewery Tap - A new one, so couldn't compare seating arrangements with previous visits. Not too many in, but it was late afternoon, seemed well organised.

Scale and Feather - been in a couple of times last summer and surprised it was still open, never seen more than a handful in. Shame, because the choice of drink's really good, think I was the only person in by the time I left.

Hop and Vine - Only a tiny place, and it was full when I got there

Doncaster;
The Draughtsman (3b) - Another tiny place, got back on the train and saw it was deserted so gave it a try. Lots of reserved signs on tables, but no times on them and all were empty when I left. There's a couple of single chairs on one side of the room, which weren't reserved, so I sat there. I was there an hour and there was only one other customer in at the non-reserved table, plus another getting something for their journey. It was full last time I tried on Bank Holiday Sunday, keep trying to look when I'm catching the train home but the Hull-Sheffield train's usually in front, so I'm not sure whether I just happened to drop on at a quiet time yesterday.

Friday - Doncaster

The Glass Strawberry - already filling up at 08:30, went in for a substantial breakfast before heading to Lincoln and knew from last summer about it filling up quickly in a morning. Fast service, had an hour before the train when ordering and left with about 25 minutes to fill afterwards.

Lincoln;
The Strugglers Inn - There for opening time (as usual), about a dozen customers inside/outside which is pretty similar to when I've been previously at that time (except during the Christmas Market). Good choice of beer on and fast service.

Bentley's (formerly The Jolly Brewer) - Under new ownership, though apart from the name change it looked the same inside. Only 2 cask ales on, didn't try the food but it smelt Ok, only about half a dozen in but this didn't seem much different to previous visits at this time.

Treaty of Commerce - this one was lot quieter than previous inside, although a few were out in the garden at the back, don't remember ever having such a choice of place to sit.

King William IV - last one, and probably about 3/4 full by the time I left. Service was fine, had one of their baguettes too.

Saturday;

The Market, Chesterfield - Another one where past Saturday experience has taught me to turn up at opening time. Quite a few reserved tables and the rest were filling up nicely by the time I left, around 11:40. Good choice of beers, the Steak and Stilton pie they do is excellent (it's been 9 months since I last had one), and the other than getting a choice of seat the good thing about being in early is that it wasn't too long a wait for the food.

The Neptune, Chesterfield - Got there just before it opened, thought as the football was on it might have been busier, but I was the only one sat inside and only the barman was keeping an eye on the match. Maybe half a dozen people were outside, not unusual, I just thought the football might bring in more (pre-covid when I've been on Saturday it's usually around 3-4pm when it's started getting busy).
 
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Ediswan

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I went rafting at the Lee Valley White Water Centre yesterday. Numerous signs. Masks when indoors, for the brief periods you might need to go inside. No alcohol on sale as that allows the cafe to operate more freely. Other than that, much the same as usual. People everywhere.
 

jon0844

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Ah, but you can. You punch in your order the usual way and press cancel on the PIN entry device when prompted to pay by card. It will then spit out a docket which you can take to the counter to pay there. Whether it’s faster or not is debatable, but…

Most people wouldn't know that 'hack' and it's ridiculous when the exact same machine with the same software in a Spanish McDonald's (and probably elsewhere) will ask if you want to pay by cash, and then give the receipt for you to go and pay at the counter. After all, who would even select paying by card if they don't have one?

I have no idea why UK ones hide the cash option, but wonder if it is because I assume the order only starts getting processed once you've gone to the till and paid - pushing you down the queue (effectively).

The advantage is of course that you could order in your own time, customise items and be assured of the cost as you went, but I can imagine that many Brits might kick off when their food isn't ready at the same time as people who ordered after them and paid by card.

Perhaps Johnny Foreigner is more accommodating! :D

Likewise, they could seek to allow the mobile app to allow cash payment too - allowing you to order in advance (even at home, with favourites stored for easy ordering again and again) and then go in to pay.

Someone needs to ask McDonald's why they do it this way because I believe the company making the machines is British and the developers are based here, and if you select English on a foreign machine it works just the same - but with a few other 'tweaks' that we've opted out of for whatever reason.
 

kristiang85

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I had an interesting one yesterday where a pub allowed us to order at the bar (behind a perspex screen). I ordered my pint, paid up, and by the time I paid my pint was placed on the bar. I naturally went to pick it up, whereupon I was told I couldn't - it had to be brought to the table I was sat at.

Cue a slightly farcical scene where I walked to the table and three steps behind was the barman carrying my pint.

I'm not sure how this stopped the spread of a deadly virus, but oh well.
 

DelayRepay

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I had an interesting one yesterday where a pub allowed us to order at the bar (behind a perspex screen). I ordered my pint, paid up, and by the time I paid my pint was placed on the bar. I naturally went to pick it up, whereupon I was told I couldn't - it had to be brought to the table I was sat at.

Cue a slightly farcical scene where I walked to the table and three steps behind was the barman carrying my pint.

I'm not sure how this stopped the spread of a deadly virus, but oh well.

I had a similar experience at a Carvery. You go up to the counter as normal. The chef fills your plate (including the bits that are normally self service live veg and spuds). Then the chef hands the plate to the waiter, who carries it back to your table. I suggested this was a crazy arrangement but they said they have to do it that way in order not to break the 'table service only' rule. The madness is that it actually means more people walking about and an extra pair of hands touching your plate - things that we are always bring told to avoid to help minimise the spread of Covid.
 
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