• Our booking engine at tickets.railforums.co.uk (powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!

When Will It All Go Wrong For The Tories/ Johnson?

Status
Not open for further replies.

The Ham

Established Member
Joined
6 Jul 2012
Messages
10,283
Just before the last song on Radio 2's lunchtime show (normally hosted by Vine), was a 8 year old saying that Johnson should go to prison.

If you find the right threads on Twitter there's lots of comments about the woke BBC, if you find the left threads on Twitter there's comments about the BBC cutting the kid off with the presenter saying "oh, OK, em, that's a bit extreme" and going to the next song. (Clearly another case where both the left and right claim BBC bias!).

Anyone interested it's on BBC Sounds, so you can judge for yourself:
At 1:56:56.
 
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R

RailUK Forums

Xenophon PCDGS

Veteran Member
Joined
17 Apr 2011
Messages
32,269
Location
A semi-rural part of north-west England
Can anyone find a link that will allow a YouTube song to be played on this thread that our folk group sang very many years ago.

It is called "What did you learn in school today". Both Tom Paxton and Pete Seegar recorded it. It makes an apt addition to this thread as one line makes reference to the belief that George Washington never told a lie.
 

AntoniC

Member
Joined
28 Dec 2011
Messages
862
Location
Southport
Can anyone find a link that will allow a YouTube song to be played on this thread that our folk group sang very many years ago.

It is called "What did you learn in school today". Both Tom Paxton and Pete Seegar recorded it. It makes an apt addition to this thread as one line makes reference to the belief that George Washington never told a lie.
What did you learn in school today

As requested my friend
 

nw1

Established Member
Joined
9 Aug 2013
Messages
6,865
Just before the last song on Radio 2's lunchtime show (normally hosted by Vine), was a 8 year old saying that Johnson should go to prison.

If you find the right threads on Twitter there's lots of comments about the woke BBC, if you find the left threads on Twitter there's comments about the BBC cutting the kid off with the presenter saying "oh, OK, em, that's a bit extreme" and going to the next song. (Clearly another case where both the left and right claim BBC bias!).
It would have been funny if "I Fought The Law" was the next song. I presume it wasn't.

While we're on the subject of songs, how about a "Do They Know It's Christmas" style charity collaboration called "Save Big Dog", in which Tory and Brexiter celebs raise funds to help poor, victimised Boris stay on as PM. ;)
 

brad465

Established Member
Joined
11 Aug 2010
Messages
6,969
Location
Taunton or Kent
Just when Johnson thought he'd delayed a challenge to his leadership, William Wragg comes out and accuses Ministers of blackmailing Tory party MPs who are threatening to force Johnson out:


A senior Tory has accused the government of trying to "blackmail" its own MPs against plotting to remove Boris Johnson.
William Wragg, who is among those calling on the PM to resign, said rebels had faced "pressures and intimidation" from ministers.
And he accused No 10 of promoting embarrassing stories about those suspected of joining their ranks.
The PM's allies say he has seen off a plot to remove him for the time being.
It comes after Tory grandee and one-time ally David Davis joined calls for Mr Johnson to quit over lockdown parties in Downing Street.
Mr Johnson has called on potential rebels to wait for the outcome of Sue Gray's inquiry into parties before passing judgement on him.
The senior civil servant is set to publish her findings on accusations of Covid-rule breaking in Downing Street next week.

But in a sign of worsening relations between Mr Johnson and his backbenchers, Mr Wragg launched a stinging attack on the way the government has handled dissent among Tory MPs.
Speaking during a Commons committee that he chairs, the MP for Hazel Grove accused government whips - MPs in charge of discipline - of threatening those suspected of plotting with the removal of government investment in their constituencies.
He also said he had received reports of government ministers, advisers and staff at No 10 "encouraging the publication of stories in the press seeking to embarrass" those suspected of lacking confidence in the PM.
He claimed the reports "would seem to constitute blackmail" - and encouraged MPs targeted in this way to contact the Commons Speaker and the Metropolitan Police.
It follows a dramatic day in Westminster on Wednesday, when Tory MP Christian Wakeford defected to Labour, describing the PM as incapable of leading.
Speaking to the Today programme on Thursday, Health Secretary Sajid Javid said: "If there were people at the heart of government who were not following the rules they should be disciplined and I look forward to that disciplinary action taking place" but added it was "right to wait for the outcome" of the investigation.
He added that the emergence of stories about parties inside No 10 had been "damaging" to the country's democracy.
 

Busaholic

Veteran Member
Joined
7 Jun 2014
Messages
14,029
Just when Johnson thought he'd delayed a challenge to his leadership, William Wragg comes out and accuses Ministers of blackmailing Tory party MPs who are threatening to force Johnson out:

Perhaps worth mentioning that Wragg is Deputy Chairman of the 1922 Committee, and generally regarded as more impartial on the subject of BJ than the Chairman Graham Brady. This government is apeing Trump's administration more and more with huge consequences for future democracy.
 

bspahh

Established Member
Joined
5 Jan 2017
Messages
1,727
Robert Peston says that Sue Gray has "found" an email warning Boris Johnson's principal private secretary against holding a lockdown-breaching party

https://www.itv.com/news/2022-01-20...warning-against-no10-drinks-party-in-may-2020 says:
A top civil servant investigating alleged law-breaking in Downing Street has found a email warning Boris Johnson's principal private secretary against holding a lockdown-breaching party in Number 10, ITV News understands.

The discovery by Sue Gray, who has been appointed by the PM to investigate numerous allegations of illegal behaviour in the heart of government, was revealed by ITV News Political Editor Robert Peston.

He said it leaves a "huge question" hanging over Mr Johnson's claim he hadn't been warned the May 20, 2020 party was against the rules and that he only attended because he thought it was a work event.

The warning email - sent by a senior official - told Mr Johnson's principal private secretary Martin Reynolds, the party "should be cancelled because it broke the rules", according to Peston.
 

WelshBluebird

Established Member
Joined
14 Jan 2010
Messages
4,923
All being set up for someone else to take the fall isn't it! (in this case the principal private secretary).
 

bspahh

Established Member
Joined
5 Jan 2017
Messages
1,727
All being set up for someone else to take the fall isn't it! (in this case the principal private secretary).
If I was a principle private secretary, and I received an email for my boss, warning them against breaking the law, I think I would mention it
 

WelshBluebird

Established Member
Joined
14 Jan 2010
Messages
4,923
If I was a principle private secretary, and I received an email for my boss, warning them against breaking the law, I think I would mention it
The issue is proving that.
At the moment with that email, all the government / Boris can do is say but I wasn't told about it. Even the PPS could probably be "persuaded" to say that they didn't tell him for whatever reason (by being promised a cushy job after they step down as PPS etc).
What needs to be found is irrefutable proof that he personally was told about it and ignored it.
 

dgl

Established Member
Joined
5 Oct 2014
Messages
2,391
If he's at least opened it then they'll know, he could bluster and say he must have clicked "mark all as read" but that would just highlight his incompetence.
 

bspahh

Established Member
Joined
5 Jan 2017
Messages
1,727
The issue is proving that.
At the moment with that email, all the government / Boris can do is say but I wasn't told about it. Even the PPS could probably be "persuaded" to say that they didn't tell him for whatever reason (by being promised a cushy job after they step down as PPS etc).
What needs to be found is irrefutable proof that he personally was told about it and ignored it.
On the balance of probabilities, what is more likely, that a senior civil servant would do the basics of their job, or that Boris Johnson would tell the truth?
 

MattRat

On Moderation
Joined
26 May 2021
Messages
2,081
Location
Liverpool
On the balance of probabilities, what is more likely, that a senior civil servant would do the basics of their job, or that Boris Johnson would tell the truth?
According to Yes Minister and Yes Prime Minister, the former is actually more likely.
 

WelshBluebird

Established Member
Joined
14 Jan 2010
Messages
4,923
On the balance of probabilities, what is more likely, that a senior civil servant would do the basics of their job, or that Boris Johnson would tell the truth?
The most likely scenario in my eyes is that the PPS did make sure Boris was aware but decided to ignore it, there will somehow be no evidence that he was actually told, Boris will lie his face off saying he wasn't told, and the PPS will take the fall for it (either voluntarily if giving a nice incentive or by being pushed). Or am I just too cynical?
 

MattRat

On Moderation
Joined
26 May 2021
Messages
2,081
Location
Liverpool
The most likely scenario in my eyes is that the PPS did make sure Boris was aware but decided to ignore it, there will somehow be no evidence that he was actually told, Boris will lie his face off saying he wasn't told, and the PPS will take the fall for it (either voluntarily if giving a nice incentive or by being pushed). Or am I just too cynical?
I'm sure Dominic Cummings is aware of what happened, so if Boris lies, we'll find out soon after. Then he will most certainly have to be found in contempt of parliament.
 

AM9

Veteran Member
Joined
13 May 2014
Messages
14,191
Location
St Albans
According to Yes Minister and Yes Prime Minister, the former is actually more likely.

Even thogh Anthony Jay had experience working at the highest level under Thatcher and Geoffrey Howe, I doubt he could imagine a character like Johnson in No. 10. Just imagine how yes minister plots could develop now! :)
 

MattRat

On Moderation
Joined
26 May 2021
Messages
2,081
Location
Liverpool
Even thogh Anthony Jay had experience working at the highest level under Thatcher and Geoffrey Howe, I doubt he could imagine a character like Johnson in No. 10. Just imagine how yes minister plots could develop now! :)
Humphrey would have him wrapped around his little finger. It wouldn't actually be that entertaining to watch.
 

AM9

Veteran Member
Joined
13 May 2014
Messages
14,191
Location
St Albans
I'm sure Dominic Cummings is aware of what happened, so if Boris lies, we'll find out soon after. Then he will most certainly have to be found in contempt of parliament.
Who would have imagined that one day, a great many people in the UK might actually be grateful to that obnoxious character.
 

SteveM70

Established Member
Joined
11 Jul 2018
Messages
3,802
I'm sure Dominic Cummings is aware of what happened, so if Boris lies, we'll find out soon after. Then he will most certainly have to be found in contempt of parliament.

This is the thing I still can't get my head round - surely everyone in number 10 will have realised when Cummings fell out with Johnson / Carrie Antoinette and left his job that he's the kind of bloke who'll have carefully collated loads of evidence of what was going on, and be prepared to use it. It feels like number 10 are now reduced to trying to deny / deflect each accusation, whilst knowing there's more and more to follow. Surely the better media strategy is to get it all out there in one go and deal with it? (Or better still, not have behaved like that in the first place)
 

brad465

Established Member
Joined
11 Aug 2010
Messages
6,969
Location
Taunton or Kent
I'm sure Dominic Cummings is aware of what happened, so if Boris lies, we'll find out soon after. Then he will most certainly have to be found in contempt of parliament.
I'm confident he'll be found in contempt of Parliament, but that won't necessarily stop him brushing it aside like with just about everything else bad he's been involved with/responsible for. I'm starting to think if someone actually shot him with a gun the bullet will just bounce off him (tempting as it is, I'm not advocating anyone tries this).
 

WelshBluebird

Established Member
Joined
14 Jan 2010
Messages
4,923
I'm sure Dominic Cummings is aware of what happened, so if Boris lies, we'll find out soon after. Then he will most certainly have to be found in contempt of parliament.
Do you think that will actually change anything? He'll just lie about that too. And as he still has a majority it doesn't matter.
It used to be that if a Prime Minister (or any minister actually) was found to have lied or acted improperly, they'd either resign or be forced out by their own party. I think we are well passed that now. Some of the things Boris has already got away with would have easily resulted in previous PM's resigning or being pushed out had they been accused of the same things!
 

43096

On Moderation
Joined
23 Nov 2015
Messages
15,164
Just when Johnson thought he'd delayed a challenge to his leadership, William Wragg comes out and accuses Ministers of blackmailing Tory party MPs who are threatening to force Johnson out:

Even better, Johnson - with a spectacular lack of self awareness - is saying there hasn't been any blackmail ("I have seen no evidence [and] heard no evidence.").

Given that he doesn't realise he's at a party when there's tables of food and booze there, it's not exactly surprising he isn't aware of blackmail.
 

MattRat

On Moderation
Joined
26 May 2021
Messages
2,081
Location
Liverpool
Who would have imagined that one day, a great many people in the UK might actually be grateful to that obnoxious character.
This is the thing I still can't get my head round - surely everyone in number 10 will have realised when Cummings fell out with Johnson / Carrie Antoinette and left his job that he's the kind of bloke who'll have carefully collated loads of evidence of what was going on, and be prepared to use it. It feels like number 10 are now reduced to trying to deny / deflect each accusation, whilst knowing there's more and more to follow. Surely the better media strategy is to get it all out there in one go and deal with it? (Or better still, not have behaved like that in the first place)
I'm confident he'll be found in contempt of Parliament, but that won't necessarily stop him brushing it aside like with just about everything else bad he's been involved with/responsible for. I'm starting to think if someone actually shot him with a gun the bullet will just bounce off him (tempting as it is, I'm not advocating anyone tries this).
Do you think that will actually change anything? He'll just lie about that too. And as he still has a majority it doesn't matter.
It used to be that if a Prime Minister (or any minister actually) was found to have lied or acted improperly, they'd either resign or be forced out by their own party. I think we are well passed that now. Some of the things Boris has already got away with would have easily resulted in previous PM's resigning or being pushed out had they been accused of the same things!
I'm thinking someone has a strategy while the other side doesn't. And even if you disagree with someone, most of us can respect someone who, dare I say, is level headed. I don't think lawful evil quite works, but that's the best analogy I can think of.
 

Busaholic

Veteran Member
Joined
7 Jun 2014
Messages
14,029
''Reggie, remember when we were invited to that party in Downing Street when you got to have a long chat with that scruff who claims to run the country?''
''Yes, Ronnie, when I persuaded him it'd be a good idea to get us to help keep an eye on those scummy MPs who only got elected because of him?''
''Well, Reggie, it seems Boris wants the contract started as some of these scum are getting a bit too big for their boots and have the temerity to threaten his position''
''They need reminding on which side their bread is buttered, don't they?''
''Time to get stuck in, brother. Let's pick off the weakest first, so any women or Northerners, let them know who's boss, but we're prepared to protect them if they get in line''
''Piece of cake, Ronnie, if anyone complains to Boris he'll say he doesn't know what they're talking about, in fact he's not quite sure he even knows who they are''
''That's a good one, Reggie. If anyone's stupid enough to try whingeing to Old Bill, we'll get the nod first anyway, and what we've got on some of that lot it'd never get anywhere''
''Hey, Ronnie, if we get any trouble from the other side of the river we can always sub-contract to Charlie and Eddie, they'd love to get stuck in, if you know what I mean!''
''Reckon it'll be Sir Reginald and Sir Ronald anytime soon, brother''
 

DelayRepay

Established Member
Joined
21 May 2011
Messages
2,929
Even better, Johnson - with a spectacular lack of self awareness - is saying there hasn't been any blackmail ("I have seen no evidence [and] heard no evidence.").

Given that he doesn't realise he's at a party when there's tables of food and booze there, it's not exactly surprising he isn't aware of blackmail.

Next week: "Nobody told me blackmailing was not allowed"
 

AM9

Veteran Member
Joined
13 May 2014
Messages
14,191
Location
St Albans
''Reggie, remember when we were invited to that party in Downing Street when you got to have a long chat with that scruff who claims to run the country?''
''Yes, Ronnie, when I persuaded him it'd be a good idea to get us to help keep an eye on those scummy MPs who only got elected because of him?''
''Well, Reggie, it seems Boris wants the contract started as some of these scum are getting a bit too big for their boots and have the temerity to threaten his position''
''They need reminding on which side their bread is buttered, don't they?''
''Time to get stuck in, brother. Let's pick off the weakest first, so any women or Northerners, let them know who's boss, but we're prepared to protect them if they get in line''
''Piece of cake, Ronnie, if anyone complains to Boris he'll say he doesn't know what they're talking about, in fact he's not quite sure he even knows who they are''
''That's a good one, Reggie. If anyone's stupid enough to try whingeing to Old Bill, we'll get the nod first anyway, and what we've got on some of that lot it'd never get anywhere''
''Hey, Ronnie, if we get any trouble from the other side of the river we can always sub-contract to Charlie and Eddie, they'd love to get stuck in, if you know what I mean!''
''Reckon it'll be Sir Reginald and Sir Ronald anytime soon, brother''
In a slightly different context, London Live* is showing some old 'The Thick Of It' episode at the moment. I wonder ....

* apologies to anyone outside the London Live broadcast area but it is really a surrogate local news programme
 

Jimini

Established Member
Joined
8 Oct 2006
Messages
1,387
Location
London
In a slightly different context, London Live* is showing some old 'The Thick Of It' episode at the moment. I wonder ....

* apologies to anyone outside the London Live broadcast area but it is really a surrogate local news programme


When I'm at our house up north I use the above link to access London Live when not in town. Only takes a minute or so.
 

Gloster

Established Member
Joined
4 Sep 2020
Messages
8,289
Location
Up the creek
Many thanks. In another verse, it says...
"Our leaders are the finest men,
And we elect them again and again"
Curious difference between the visual and the audible. The words scrolling up the screen say ‘murderers pay for their crimes’, but he sings ‘murderers die for their crimes’.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Top