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Vegetation management issues across the network?
- Thread starter londonmidland
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Sleepy
Established Member
Did they go for a trip to Moorswater ??
61653 HTAFC
Veteran Member
Latest plan is that the tram is moving to the front of the station and the current space it occupies will be used for a dual carriageway "relief road"... so it'll be a 38-ton Artic in platform 8, or Daz in his Asbo!
GRALISTAIR
Established Member
Good lord that is unbelievable unless it there before one's eyes.
Annetts key
Established Member
Although BR and then Railtrack reduced the budget for lineside vegetation control. It was the reorganisation in 2010 (when a lot of staff were let go) that really cut the resources for both vegetation control and drainage and other lineside maintenance. Network Rail have acknowledged that there is a problem and have increased the number of permanent staff, plus they hire in contractors. But it’s debatable whether this is enough…
As said above, they still do run. But the railway are restricted on the type of weed killer they can use. Plus, they don’t remove the dead remains, so then leave tripping hazards. Again, do they run the weed killer trains often enough is also debatable…
Unfortunately I fear the financial pressure that the railways are currently under means the situation overall is not likely to improve.
Oxfordblues
Member
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- 22 Dec 2013
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- 661
Another area of concern is Grand Junction and Proof House Junction "jungle" just south of Birmingham New Street. Unless tackled soon there will be serious signal-sighting issues, autumn adhesion problems and structural weakening of lineside walls, viaducts and cutting-sides. It's in stark contrast to the adjacent Curzon Street HS2 station site which is completely vegetation-free.
paul1609
Established Member
Ive just driven 70 miles along the south coast trunk road I reckon over 50% of the road traffic signs are unreadable because of vegitation. Some of the Red Light/ speed cameras can only be taking pictures of bushes.
fishwomp
Member
It was on the Penistone line on Sunday night: https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:U02076/2021-07-18/detailed
Disappointingly not a loco with 715t trailing load as advertised, but it sure did run slow - must've been doing about 20mph or less, to spread properly.
Reminds me of a story the old lag who trained me in my first signal box told me.
One evening years ago he had a knock on the box door, its a lad from PWay asking if they can do a controlled burn to clear some vegetation.
"OK, but watch my cables"
"Yeah no problem mate!"
About half an hour later he was making a cup of tea at the back of the box, turned away from the windows. He turned round when the kettle was boiled and it looked like the end of days outside the box; fire and smoke everywhere. He gave the call attention to the next box, no response. He went outside to discover that his cables had been melted into a black carbonised lump.
He instigated Time Interval Working shortly after...
One evening years ago he had a knock on the box door, its a lad from PWay asking if they can do a controlled burn to clear some vegetation.
"OK, but watch my cables"
"Yeah no problem mate!"
About half an hour later he was making a cup of tea at the back of the box, turned away from the windows. He turned round when the kettle was boiled and it looked like the end of days outside the box; fire and smoke everywhere. He gave the call attention to the next box, no response. He went outside to discover that his cables had been melted into a black carbonised lump.
He instigated Time Interval Working shortly after...
Parham Wood
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In days of yore the vegetation on railway property was properly controlled. It had to be otherwise it would be set on fire by embers from the steam engines. Many a length was controlled burned each year by the length gangs so tree saplings were not an issue as they did not get a chance to grow.
Look at pictures of lines in the 50s, there is very little vegetation.
As many have said if you let things get out of hand there is more work to be done and trees/saplings will just regrow when cut off.
Of course burning is not environmentally acceptable these days, and would not be safe given the amount of vegetation these days. I cannot recall vegetation killing chemicals being used generally on trackside so it is down to manual labour with power tools.
Even without it being out of hand the labour required to do vegetation management would be significant and access to the lineside is now more difficult as more possessions for safety reasons would be required.
Look at pictures of lines in the 50s, there is very little vegetation.
As many have said if you let things get out of hand there is more work to be done and trees/saplings will just regrow when cut off.
Of course burning is not environmentally acceptable these days, and would not be safe given the amount of vegetation these days. I cannot recall vegetation killing chemicals being used generally on trackside so it is down to manual labour with power tools.
Even without it being out of hand the labour required to do vegetation management would be significant and access to the lineside is now more difficult as more possessions for safety reasons would be required.
Annetts key
Established Member
Generally speaking, the freight only lines are even worse than some of the passenger lines. Which themselves are rather poor in places. It’s not uncommon to see lineside vegetation shaped by the passing trains….
D6130
Established Member
I noticed that when I was in Scotland a couple of weeks ago....not only leaves, but quite large branches as well, the noise of which hitting the sides of the train was quite alarming for some passengers, my wife included. We also encountered similar issues on parts of the West Highland Line, the Largs and Ardrossan Harbour branches, Ayr-Stranraer and Ladybank-Bridge of Earn. We also noticed that a lot of Scotrail units had fine horizontal scratch marks in the bodyside paintwork. When I took early retirement from driving nine years ago, the Network Rail Group Standard for lineside vegetation control stipulated that trees and bushes should not come any closer than 5 metres/15 feet from the cess rail. Perhaps if ScotRail were to invoice Network Rail for the periodic repainting of their units it might concentrate a few minds....although with the imminent creation of GBR (if that is going to include Scotland), I doubt that it will happen.
I can’t comment on Scotrail policy, but most TOCs do exactly what you suggest.
Envoy
Established Member
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This neglect to deal with vegetation is appalling. Trees may be blown onto rail lines, leaf fall causes sludge to form that affects traction and passengers can’t see views.
The situation on the scenic Heart of Wales Line can be seen in this video of the Blue Pullman’s recent trip along that route - (2 minutes in) :>
The situation on the scenic Heart of Wales Line can be seen in this video of the Blue Pullman’s recent trip along that route - (2 minutes in) :>
Grumpy Git
On Moderation
i think theres even something that looks like a christmas tree growing further down thats overhanging the track a bit st brockenhurst
Not a "Christmas tree", but the ubiquitous buddleia.
There is a section of the Newquay branch that looks just like that, near the Par end.
Annetts key
Established Member
To be fair, in some places, vegetation clearance does get done. For example, last year in the Keynsham area. This year, on the main line between Bristol Temple Meads and Yatton. I’ve seen contractors working in this area over the last four weeks.
They may be clearing elsewhere in my area, but as my travel has been limited due to COVID19 Corona virus, I’ve not seen it.
The problem is that because only a limited amount has been done over the last twenty odd years, when Network Rail does arrange for vegetation clearance, it takes a lot longer, needs more work and hence costs more.
They may be clearing elsewhere in my area, but as my travel has been limited due to COVID19 Corona virus, I’ve not seen it.
The problem is that because only a limited amount has been done over the last twenty odd years, when Network Rail does arrange for vegetation clearance, it takes a lot longer, needs more work and hence costs more.
Don’t forget they have to avoid nesting season now as well
Annetts key
Established Member
Yes, especially as in most cases, all wild birds should not be disturbed while nesting.
However, permission may be granted if it’s a safety of the line issue.
Grumpy Git
On Moderation
If the maintenance of the line side vegetation had been kept-up (take a look at any 1950's-1960's railway photograph), there wouldn't be trees/bushes of a size suitable for birds to nest anywhere near the line.
It doesn’t need to be kept like that, and don’t have the manpower or the ability to burn it.
alxndr
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In the case of buddleia it grows so fast. While you're tackling one place it's all growing back in another. It's now had a century or so to proliferate in the wild and I don't know how we're going to get rid of it now that it's everywhere. It grows too fast for cutting it back to last any length of time, and that might be helping out to spread... Awful plant.
nlogax
Established Member
Are certain island platforms on the SWML (Walton, New Malden etc) required to be usable for emergency situations? These days they resemble RSPB reserves.
Lloyds siding
Member
In bygone days I believe the highly effective sodium arsenite was used...frowned on now, I mean what could possibly go wrong?
Glyphosate can still be used.
I've used it on brambles, but you have to spray the leaves well whilst it's the growing season, & do multiple doses.
One quick pass with a weedkiller train isn't going to do it, it needs 2 slow passes in a week.
Pre-Covid, there was a lot of complete clearance work happening on the CrossCity line, trees felled etc.
I wonder if that's the approach now; complete clearance of routes instead of just trimming back everywhere.
Glyphosate is a really effective weedkiller, but as you say for certain weeds it needs to be applied directly to be most effective. For brambles I've found chopping them then dipping the raw end into the Glyphosate is a sure fire way to kill them. But with brambles and any other woody weed, all you do is stop it growing. A dead bramble isn't going to go anywhere without mechanical intervention later on, they're tough buggers!
The weedkiller trains only really focus on spraying the ballast to stop a mini forest from growing up between the tracks. Overspray is generally frowned upon with any herbicide, they kill nice things too and Maureen in number 30 will have a right old go if a bit of wind blows your weedkiller trains emissions all over her prize winning Petunias.
The weedkiller trains only really focus on spraying the ballast to stop a mini forest from growing up between the tracks. Overspray is generally frowned upon with any herbicide, they kill nice things too and Maureen in number 30 will have a right old go if a bit of wind blows your weedkiller trains emissions all over her prize winning Petunias.
Mcr Warrior
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Indeed. And dead brambles, if not cleared, also form a rather handy "trellis" for the next season's growth to attach themselves to.
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