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Heinz Factory near Wigan to get its own siding?

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CHAPS2034

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Serious investigations afoot for the Kitt Green factory in Wigan (producer of baked beans and other things) to get it's own siding to move things in and out.

Story here


For the past year, bosses have been looking at the possibility of delivering and picking up freight from the Kitt Green plant using trains travelling along the Manchester to Southport line which, handily, runs down the side of the site.

Earlier this year a nocturnal experiment - after the last passenger trains until morning were safely past - was held which examined the feasibility of stopping a locomotive and carriages there for loading and unloading purposes. It was later declared a “complete success.”

It would form part of a rail route all the way from Holland (where Heinz has another major factory at Elst) via Hull and supporters of the scheme say it would speed up the transporting of products and be much better for the environment.

As the Wigan Observer recently reported, Heinz management and workers have been locked in a dispute over alterations to contracts which the company wants to bring in if it decides to expand its operations in Wigan and bring sauce production back the UK.

The Unite union recommended its members back the changes but a majority of the workers voted against them and Kraft-Heinz is now saying it may take this business elsewhere, although talks to find a compromise are continuing.

Company bosses, however, say the sauce deal has no bearing on whether the rail project goes ahead or not - the latter being more about the company’s carbon footprint.

Locals in Kitt Green have not been asked for their opinions on the railway scheme at this stage but certainly one of the local beefs is about the large amounts of lorries toing and froing along Spring Road from the M6, so anything to reduce road traffic in the area could well be welcomed.

The company is still at the stage of deciding whether the creation of a “pad” or siding is viable. If it is, then detailed plans will be drawn up.

Of the experiment, a Kraft-Heinz spokesman said: “The trial was a simulation which involved a locomotive and 30 unloaded cradles.

“There was no need to run actual containers as there were no means to unload at this stage.

Prof Amar Ramudhin, director of the University of Hull’s Logistics Institute,

“The train was scheduled to arrive just after the last passenger train of the day had passed through the piece of railtrack next to the National Distribution Centre.

“This was around 23.30. There was a series of locomotive moves and the testing of safety procedures like signalling, points management, level crossings etc and then a simulated shuffle (six cradles at a time) every 30 minutes.

“The warehouse teams also simulated and timed internal site movements to ensure that the target timings per container move was within requirements.

“The trial was a complete success in both timings and the testing of our safety procedures and the next stage will be to work with commercial partners to build a business case together.

“The project is around the feasibility of creating a ‘rail-pad’ on the land between the railway line itself and the National Distribution Centre.

“This will progress if a commercially viable business case can be put together.”

Kraft-Heinz is being helped by the University of Hull’s Logistics Institute to improve its freight movement across Europe. The Liverpool-Humber Optimisation of Freight Transport scheme is designed to help haulage of Heinz products from the Netherlands to Kitt Green.

As part of the project products have been moved by rail via the Humber port complex.

Prof Amar Ramudhin, director of the University of Hull’s Logistics Institute, said this was done to make the scheme as “green” as possible.

“The University of Hull is at the forefront of accelerating a net zero future,” he said.

“The Wigan rail route opens up new opportunities for goods owners and service providers to collaborate to develop new, lower carbon transport routes.”

The project also partners with Oxford Rail Strategies, with the aim to develop a rail freight solution for the haulage of products from Elst to Wigan. The night-time experiment followed consultation with UK rail freight operator Freightliner, and Network Rail.

Emma Dempsey, from Freightliner, said: “As the largest operator of carbon neutral traction, we are continually developing solutions to deliver decarbonisation targets, working in collaboration with business partners and customers, and we were delighted to be part of the team to trial this potential modal shift to rail.”

Karla Jakeman, from Connected Transport at Innovate UK, added: “This is a very positive development of the project. It is always exciting when projects can demonstrate innovation in practice.

“I am looking forward to watching how this develops in the future.”

The Heinz spokesman said that he hoped to be able to deliver an update in 2022.
 
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diffident

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It will be a pad once they see how much a siding will cost them.

They could fashion something out of Spaghetti Hoops, surely??

All joking aside, surely it would have to be a siding? I can already picture the scene, delays in loading the freight/issues with the traction/other unforeseen problem, and the whole show is knackered the next morning!
 

karlos

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It will be a pad once they see how much a siding will cost them.

Anyone care to estimate the cost of a siding?

The only thing I've got to go on is that 500 yards of sidings at Buxton cost £14 million, though that was for two roads and was little more complex with it being built on a refuse tip with needing a footbridge as well.
 

gingertom

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Anyone care to estimate the cost of a siding?

The only thing I've got to go on is that 500 yards of sidings at Buxton cost £14 million, though that was for two roads and was little more complex with it being built on a refuse tip with needing a footbridge as well.
Highland Spring recently had a siding connected at Blackford for the same purpose. If spec'd similar I'd expect price to be similar.
 

Gathursty

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Depending on where this siding is, it may cause environmentalists to kick off royally.

It might be the other side of the line to the River and associated habitats but because its been about 40 years since the land was cleared for a siding that wasn't built, nature has reclaimed it and the fauna can regularly be seen hopping or flying or if you are lucky, whatever a deer does, across the tracks.

I know Heinz is doing this to reduce its carbon footprint so its a double edged sword.
 
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tbtc

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Of course this project can only work if the Government urgently fund curves at Burscough in every direction to provide diversionary resilience between the factory and the Skipton-Colne line that will be needed to take it over the Pennines to/from Hull...

(am I doing this right?)
 

DerekC

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Depending on where this siding is, it may cause environmentalists to kick off royally.

It might be the other side of the line to the River and associated habitats but because its been about 40 years since the land was cleared for a siding that wasn't built, nature has reclaimed it and the fauna can regularly be seen hopping or flying or if you are lucky, whatever a deer does, across the tracks.

I know Heinz is doing this to reduce its carbon footprint so its a double edged sword.
There is what looks like a nature reserve on the other side of the tracks, but I don't see a real problem if a new siding is put on the side adjacent to the plant, which is where it obviously needs to be. Interestingly the curving boundary fence on the east side of the plant follows the line of "Branckers Siding" which linked the Manchester to Southport line with the LNWR Pemberton branch now followed by footpath which presumably goes under the current railway via the bridge which carried the branch line down to a wharf on the Leeds & Liverpool Canal.
 

muddythefish

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It will be a pad once they see how much a siding will cost them.

Aren't there government grants for small "green" projects such as this which take traffic off the roads? One would have thought so if the government were serious about its climate targets
 

fgwrich

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what traction would they use to get stuff in and out- class 57? I'll get my hat!
Which ones, there's plenty of variety (but not 57 versions though!). They've got a good choice if they need to though - VT 57/3 - Tomato, DRS /0 - Low sugar, GW /6 - Organic - DRS, WCRC - erm, HP Sauce? :lol:

(In all seriousness, good luck to them if they do chose a siding, I hope it works out quicker than Highland Spring's painfully slow effort at Blackford)
 

DerekC

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Judging by the pre-WWI map there were (and presumably still are) four occupation bridges under the line within the section directly adjacent to the plant, which are likely to complicate things for a siding parallel to the main line.
 

Grumpy

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Why do you need to spend millions to provide a siding? Cant they just stop a train on the running line at night and load directly onto it, as per the trial?
 

The Planner

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Why do you need to spend millions to provide a siding? Cant they just stop a train on the running line at night and load directly onto it, as per the trial?
You can, engineering periods permitting, which is why I said it will likely end up as a pad.
 

AntoniC

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Any disruption to the train service will have the Southport to Manchester commutors up in arms and sniffing a plot (see what I did there ?) to negatively affect their precious lifeline to Manchester Airport.
 

D6130

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Of course this project can only work if the Government urgently fund curves at Burscough in every direction to provide diversionary resilience between the factory and the Skipton-Colne line that will be needed to take it over the Pennines to/from Hull...
All joking aside, I would expect the traffic to be routed via the Calder Valley Line and Manchester Victoria.
 

randyrippley

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Ironic
Closure of that site has been announced at least twice in the last 25 years
Now they want to invest...........
 

OverSpeed

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Which ones, there's plenty of variety (but not 57 versions though!). They've got a good choice if they need to though - VT 57/3 - Tomato, DRS /0 - Low sugar, GW /6 - Organic - DRS, WCRC - erm, HP Sauce? :lol:

(In all seriousness, good luck to them if they do chose a siding, I hope it works out quicker than Highland Spring's painfully slow effort at Blackford)
When it happens, Heinz are going to charter a train from Manchester Piccalilli to the new siding :D
 

godfreycomplex

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Of course this project can only work if the Government urgently fund curves at Burscough in every direction to provide diversionary resilience between the factory and the Skipton-Colne line that will be needed to take it over the Pennines to/from Hull...

(am I doing this right?)
Ha!!
 

tbtc

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When it happens, Heinz are going to charter a train from Manchester Piccalilli to the new siding :D

And when they find they've not got a driver, it will get canned.

I don't know that this needs to be on Network Rail metals, isn't there a niche for a Preserve Railway to accommodate it instead?

Plus, with the slow speed of 769s to Southport, isn't there a chance that any freight will just ketchup with the train in front of it?
 

swt_passenger

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I don't know that this needs to be on Network Rail metals, isn't there a niche for a Preserve Railway to accommodate it instead?

Plus, with the slow speed of 769s to Southport, isn't there a chance that any freight will just ketchup with the train in front of it?
Can you cite an authoritative sauce for that? As they’d say on wiki…
 

fgwrich

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When it happens, Heinz are going to charter a train from Manchester Piccalilli to the new siding :D

Will that service be calling at Manchester Beansgate by any chance?

Plus, with the slow speed of 769s to Southport, isn't there a chance that any freight will just ketchup with the train in front of it?

At this rate, I think most of those 769s will be passing through the factory. Anybody need some new Tins?
 

Mollman

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We all seem to have missed the announcement of a new Boris bridge from East Yorkshire to the Netherlands, given that the article sates (my bold):
It would form part of a rail route all the way from Holland (where Heinz has another major factory at Elst) via Hull and supporters of the scheme say it would speed up the transporting of products and be much better for the environment.
 

terryc

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Wouldn't a simple loop be more efficient than a siding, and take up minimal space, with a load / unload facility adjacent?
So a 50% width increase on the permanent way for a few hundred metres, and the loading facility on Heinz land?
That would also provide a run-round option for eastbound exit.
Wouldn't require additional cross-overs if the Down Southport could be made bi-directional for the ~2km or so to the crossover at the wallgate carriage sidings.
Or am I living on fantasy island?
 

Eccles1983

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Wouldn't a simple loop be more efficient than a siding, and take up minimal space, with a load / unload facility adjacent?
So a 50% width increase on the permanent way for a few hundred metres, and the loading facility on Heinz land?
That would also provide a run-round option for eastbound exit.
Wouldn't require additional cross-overs if the Down Southport could be made bi-directional for the ~2km or so to the crossover at the wallgate carriage sidings.
Or am I living on fantasy island?
Absolutely.

The line is AB controlled from Wigan Wallgate.

The Bi-Di would be very complicated, where as a siding with a lock-in facillity fully signalled and a crossover would be far easier to work with than Bi-Di.

The overlaps needed would come close to blocking the junction outside the signal box, in turn blocking the station.
 

The Planner

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Wouldn't a simple loop be more efficient than a siding, and take up minimal space, with a load / unload facility adjacent?
So a 50% width increase on the permanent way for a few hundred metres, and the loading facility on Heinz land?
That would also provide a run-round option for eastbound exit.
Wouldn't require additional cross-overs if the Down Southport could be made bi-directional for the ~2km or so to the crossover at the wallgate carriage sidings.
Or am I living on fantasy island?
All adds cost. Heinz would be paying for it.
 

Brush 4

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We've bean here before, all these half baked ideas and numerous spaghetti hoops to jump through. More fibre is needed before beanz meanz trainz and it does what it says on the tin. Maybe it will be canned.

Sorry........:oops:
 

tbtc

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Wouldn't a simple loop be more efficient than a siding, and take up minimal space, with a load / unload facility adjacent?
So a 50% width increase on the permanent way for a few hundred metres, and the loading facility on Heinz land?
That would also provide a run-round option for eastbound exit.
Wouldn't require additional cross-overs if the Down Southport could be made bi-directional for the ~2km or so to the crossover at the wallgate carriage sidings.
Or am I living on fantasy island?

You've got to be careful not to go overboard with the pointwork - one loop here and another loop there and soon it'll resemble spaghetti junction
 
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