Advance Single refund policy

[Fyldeboy]

I bought a GWR Advanced ticket on 5/9 for travel 28/9 - which I was then not able to use due to local lockdown.

Acting on a suggestion above, I have used the WayBackMachine to view GWRs cancellation policy at the time of booking.
There are only 3 caches - one before pandemic and 2 recent - as such no mention of allowing refunds on Advanced . . . . BUT
On 14 Aug, their website stated "On 7 September we will be reverting to our normal refund policy" - does this mean Advance Tickets were refundable up to 7 Sept? So my ticket bought on 5th Sept?

Replies to the above post made it clear that GWR Advance Singles were not refundable after March 2020 - which was a pain because I bought my £70s worth in September
HOWEVER
I am pleased to report that I have today received a full refund through the booking site TrainPal, having requested a refund and citing the fact that the contract had been 'fustrated' as a result of lockdown.
I don't know if I was lucky the tickets had been purchased through a 3rd party agent, or if GWR would react in the same way, but others seeking refunds might want to try the 'fustration' argument

frustration

Definition of frustration in the Legal Dictionary by The Free Dictionary

legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com

In the law of contracts, the destruction of the value of the performance that has been bargained for by the promisor as a result of a supervening event.

 

[trei2k]

I'm not sure if it will be any help but this was posted today by Grant Shapps:

Covid has seen massive disruption to our way of life and rail passengers shouldn't be penalised for cancelling plans to follow advice.

That's why I am temporarily scrapping admin fees on Advance rail tickets when rebooking due to changes in Covid restrictions

#TravelSafely

https://twitter.com/grantshapps/status/1320338210132721664

 

[father_jack]

I'm not sure if it will be any help but this was posted today by Grant Shapps:

https://twitter.com/grantshapps/status/1320338210132721664

Help in the form of a chocolate teapot there minister.

How can you change an advance ticket anyway when
1) you don't know when you're going to need to go again at present, say gig or appointment cancelled
2) it has to be changed before the departure date and time
3) services are in some cases only open a week in advance so there's little that you can change them to, see here https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/can’t-buy-tickets-more-than-about-two-weeks-ahead.210621/

 

[gray1404]

As per usual, announce it on social media before any such information is released or available from the TOCs, retailers or National Rail website.

 

[Haywain]

3) services are in some cases only open a week in advance so there's little that you can change them to

On the bright side, that must reduce the risk of booking something that you don’t need due to events being cancelled etc.

 

[gray1404]

Fees for rearranging advance rail journeys disrupted by Covid-19 to be scrapped

The Department for Transport said the measures ensure passengers affected by changing restrictions will not be left out of pocket.

www.shropshirestar.com

Still can't find anything offical from a TOC, retailer or National Rail. No details in the press article as to the implementation date.

 

[CyrusWuff]

Still can't find anything offical from a TOC, retailer or National Rail. No details in the press article as to the implementation date.

Not entirely surprising given it's a Sunday, though RDG have retweeted Shapps' Tweet.

 

[infobleep]

As per usual, announce it on social media before any such information is released or available from the TOCs, retailers or National Rail website.

Funny you should say that because the other day on National Rail Enquiries I came across this:

PLEASE NOTE: Retailers are offering a fee free refund on all Anytime, Off-Peak and Advance tickets purchased before 07:00 on Monday 23 March 2020, for a future journey. Contact the retailer who sold you the ticket for more details.

Advance Train Tickets | National Rail

Book ahead and save money with Advance tickets. They are great value, and ideal for saving money on long journeys. They must be bought in advance and are only valid on the date and train specified.

www.nationalrail.co.uk

Note that was before Grant Shapps announcement.

 

[CyrusWuff]

Funny you should say that because the other day on National Rail Enquiries I came across this:

Advance Train Tickets | National Rail

Book ahead and save money with Advance tickets. They are great value, and ideal for saving money on long journeys. They must be bought in advance and are only valid on the date and train specified.

www.nationalrail.co.uk

Note that was before Grant Shapps announcement.

The key date there being 23rd March. That was superseded for tickets purchased on or after 7th September (14th September for tickets sold by ScotRail), where normal rules regarding admin fees and refunds apply.

The relevant page on NRE being https://www.nationalrail.co.uk/stations_destinations/coronavirus_refunds.aspx

UPDATE: The Staff Brief has now been issued, and the NRE page updated. Here's a Summary:

• Normal rules continue to apply for walk up fares, season tickets and carnets, and for Advance tickets for journeys between Tier 1 (Medium) areas.
• The change of journey fee is waived for Advance tickets purchased before an area moves to Tier 2 (High) or Tier 3 (Very High) - this includes Wales and the Scottish central belt. This is backdated where restrictions are already in force.
• Alternatively, TOCs can issue discretionary refunds but only in the form of Rail Travel Vouchers. The normal 12 month validity applies to vouchers issued in this way.
• Refunds under Condition 30.1 of the National Rail Conditions of Travel are, of course, still available if the booked train is cancelled, delayed or the reservation will not be honoured and you abandon your journey.

 

[gray1404]

Admin fees removed for COVID disrupted rail travel on Advance tickets

Administration charge fees removed from rail Advance tickets.

www.gov.uk

The post above however on this page on the forum is useful as it gives more details as to the implementation.

 

[infobleep]

The key date there being 23rd March. That was superseded for tickets purchased on or after 7th September (14th September for tickets sold by ScotRail), where normal rules regarding admin fees and refunds apply.

The relevant page on NRE being https://www.nationalrail.co.uk/stations_destinations/coronavirus_refunds.aspx

UPDATE: The Staff Brief has now been issued, and the NRE page updated. Here's a Summary:

• Normal rules continue to apply for walk up fares, season tickets and carnets, and for Advance tickets for journeys between Tier 1 (Medium) areas.
• The change of journey fee is waived for Advance tickets purchased before an area moves to Tier 2 (High) or Tier 3 (Very High) - this includes Wales and the Scottish central belt. This is backdated where restrictions are already in force.
• Alternatively, TOCs can issue discretionary refunds but only in the form of Rail Travel Vouchers. The normal 12 month validity applies to vouchers issued in this way.
• Refunds under Condition 30.1 of the National Rail Conditions of Travel are, of course, still available if the booked train is cancelled, delayed or the reservation will not be honoured and you abandon your journey.

I taka your point. Makes sense. I didn't read it correctly.

What is a credit note? Can that be issued electronically?

I am considering buying a train ticket or I would if tickets were avilable.

However Cross Country don't seem to have much confidence and are only issuing tickets a week in advance.

 

[father_jack]

I taka your point. Makes sense. I didn't read it correctly.

What is a credit note? Can that be issued electronically?

I am considering buying a train ticket or I would if tickets were avilable.

However Cross Country don't seem to have much confidence and are only issuing tickets a week in advance.

It seems then that Advance tickets will be "refunded" through TOC customer services as rail travel vouchers. Not ideal when booking office sales could easily be "non issued" at point of sale and also many of the TOC call centres are on reduced staff.

 

[infobleep]

It seems then that Advance tickets will be "refunded" through TOC customer services as rail travel vouchers. Not ideal when booking office sales could easily be "non issued" at point of sale and also many of the TOC call centres are on reduced staff.

I must correct my point on Cross Country Trains. They have issues with their reservations system as opposed to deciding for policy reasons to only issue tickets a week in advance. I suspect it won't be resolved anytime soon. By that I mean not resolved within the coming month.

 

[Wallsendmag]

Nobody has any issues with RARS2 as far as I'm aware, XC haven't gone live with the new system yet AFAIK.

 

[infobleep]

Nobody has any issues with RARS2 as far as I'm aware, XC haven't gone live with the new system yet AFAIK.

So why doesn't their existing system allow them to sell tickets sooner than a week in advance I wonder? Are they having to do some complicated time consuming workarounds in the mean time?

 

[Am Broc]

Hi all, this thread is really useful - thanks!

I'm very interested as I have £250 worth of advance tickets for travel from Glasgow to Cornwall next Wednesday, returning the following week.

I live in Glasgow and it's expected that we will be in a tier 3 lockdown next week. Unfortunately this hasn't been confirmed as yet and I can't find the regulations to see exactly what it says about travel! I'm a bit worried as I also have a hotel booking which I would need to cancel by the end of this month or will have to pay!!

Anyway, my question is - I bought my tixx from online providers (RailEasy's ticket splitting site and the Split my Ticket site). Do I need to get my credit note/ rebooking from them or can I take them into my local major station, for example?

Also, do you think it will be a case of having to rebook or do you think that they will offer time limited travel vouchers/credit notes? The news release from the Government isn't clear on this point... (I'd be very happy with a credit note/travel voucher valid for a year but I don't think that rebooking within the current ticket window would be wise for Covid and weather reasons!

Any help appreciated!

Thanks,

Alasdair

 

[Wallsendmag]

So why doesn't their existing system allow them to sell tickets sooner than a week in advance I wonder? Are they having to do some complicated time consuming workarounds in the mean time?

Ask Network Rail

 

[Haywain]

Do I need to get my credit note/ rebooking from them

Yes, you're dealings will be with the retailer.

The news release from the Government isn't clear

Nothing unusual in that, perhaps in Scotland you get shielded from some of the vagaries of pronouncements from Westminster.

 

[Am Broc]

Thanks @Haywain! That clears things up.

Usually the Scottish Government stuff is clearer. Having said that I've still not found the exact rules from the Scottish Government about the new tier system. The main report is easy to find but not the actual subordinate legislation that will bring it into force..... It is to be debated tomorrow in the Scottish Parliament so hopefully things will be clearer then....

 

[221129]

So why doesn't their existing system allow them to sell tickets sooner than a week in advance I wonder? Are they having to do some complicated time consuming workarounds in the mean time?

Because the timetables havent been finalised yet!

 

[infobleep]

Ask Network Rail

Because the timetables havent been finalised yet!

Is it only Cross Country Trains where timetables haven't been finalised. For example East Mindland Trains, South Western Railway, Avanti and Great Western Railway are all selling advanced tickets for more than 2 weeks in advance. I'm mean Monday to Friday tickets. I don't mean weekend ones.

How are they able to do it?

 

[Wallsendmag]

Is it only Cross Country Trains where timetables haven't been finalised. For example East Mindland Trains, South Western Railway, Avanti and Great Western Railway are all selling advanced tickets for more than 2 weeks in advance. I'm mean Monday to Friday tickets. I don't mean weekend ones.

How are they able to do it?

Maybe they only have to deal with one region

 

[infobleep]

Maybe they only have to deal with one region

Surely Avanti crosses regions. I mean don't they run into Scotland? Of course I must admit i'm not up on region boundaries.

Also when I look uo tickets online, there is nothing to say the timetable hasn't been confirmed yet. There is a bulletin but all it says is rhat you need to have reservations.

I would kind of hope that if the timetable hasn't been confirmed, they would have a note saying so. They would then clearly explain the issue.

 

[Fyldeboy]

Hi all, this thread is really useful - thanks!

I'm very interested as I have £250 worth of advance tickets for travel from Glasgow to Cornwall next Wednesday, returning the following week.

I live in Glasgow and it's expected that we will be in a tier 3 lockdown next week. Unfortunately this hasn't been confirmed as yet and I can't find the regulations to see exactly what it says about travel! I'm a bit worried as I also have a hotel booking which I would need to cancel by the end of this month or will have to pay!!

Anyway, my question is - I bought my tixx from online providers (RailEasy's ticket splitting site and the Split my Ticket site). Do I need to get my credit note/ rebooking from them or can I take them into my local major station, for example?

Also, do you think it will be a case of having to rebook or do you think that they will offer time limited travel vouchers/credit notes? The news release from the Government isn't clear on this point... (I'd be very happy with a credit note/travel voucher valid for a year but I don't think that rebooking within the current ticket window would be wise for Covid and weather reasons!

Any help appreciated!

Thanks,

Alasdair

Yup, your contract is with the retailer. I had success with TrainPal citing frustration of contract and it worked. If they deny, you might try the same with your CC, presuming you paid by Credit Card.

 

[island]

Yup, your contract is with the retailer. I had success with TrainPal citing frustration of contract and it worked. If they deny, you might try the same with your CC, presuming you paid by Credit Card.

Yes, claiming via a credit card provider under S75 CCA would be a possibility presuming Am Broc is travelling alone.

 

[Am Broc]

Hi all! The plot thickens!

I ordered the tickets out with RailEasy and the tickets back from Split my Fare. I asked if I could get a credit note or a travel voucher.

Both said they were unable to issue these as only TOCs could do so but offered me a free rebooking.

However, Split my Fare said the following:



The plot thickens!

Do you guys think that I might have any luck if I contact the TOCs? (Avanti West Coast x2, GWRx2).

Alasdair

 

[221129]

Do you guys think that I might have any luck if I contact the TOCs?

Unlikely, they will correctly direct you back to the retailer, who cannot issue a credit note. So you would need to rebook for a future date I think.

 

[Am Broc]

@221129 You are absolutely correct! They directed me back to the retailer as I strongly suspected they would.

I'm going to rebook now.

Raileasy said that even though I couldn't travel in the booking window, it was worth rebooking for the furthest away date and they could then rebook again later assuming that the Covid restrictions are still in place... Also part of my return split ticket was an anytime ticket so I can always get that refunded if I can't come up with a suitable date in the end so it won't be a complete loss.

 

[Kite159]

Sorry to bump an old(ish) thread, but what is the current rule if you purchased tickets before lockdown for an area now in tier 3 where travel to that area is being advised against (and not like I could use the ticket as all the hotels are closed)?

(Purchased from TrainSplit)

 

[Trackman]

Sorry to bump an old(ish) thread, but what is the current rule if you purchased tickets before lockdown for an area now in tier 3 where travel to that area is being advised against (and not like I could use the ticket as all the hotels are closed)?

(Purchased from TrainSplit)

If this helps:
Avanti told me I'd be OK if I purchased tickets before the Tier 3 restrictions for my area were announced. I've emailed the lockdown tickets department over a week ago and I'm not holding my breath. But I have proof of what they said.