Advance Single refund policy

[js517]

Some more rule changes were announced today (see Gov.uk: Christmas travel measures to help passengers plan their journey and travel safely).

When changing an advance ticket purchased on or before 26th November 2020 for travel between 2nd December 2020 and 2nd January 2020 inclusive the admin fee will be waived.

 

[Kite159]

Some more rule changes were announced today (see Gov.uk: Christmas travel measures to help passengers plan their journey and travel safely).

When changing an advance ticket purchased on or before 26th November 2020 for travel between 2nd December 2020 and 2nd January 2020 inclusive the admin fee will be waived.

Free amendments is as much use as a chocolate fireguard in some cases as who knows when that area will drop to tier 2, or when advance tickets will go on sale to allow existing tickets to be amended to a new date.

Own goal by the DFT, at least allowing advance tickets to be exchanged for credit notes (in the form of vouchers) keeps the money within the industry to be used at a better time.

 

[infobleep]

Free amendments is as much use as a chocolate fireguard in some cases as who knows when that area will drop to tier 2, or when advance tickets will go on sale to allow existing tickets to be amended to a new date.

Own goal by the DFT, at least allowing advance tickets to be exchanged for credit notes (in the form of vouchers) keeps the money within the industry to be used at a better time.

A sensible idea but those with the powers have otherwise decided..... I wonder if anyone suggested this and if so, what was the reason for not doing it?

 

[ValleyLines142]

You should be entitled to a full refund. I purchased tickets to Brighton on 30th August for travel on 28th October and I received a full refund in the form of RTVs.

On another note, CrossCountry also gave me a refund via bank transfer but said that normally with advance tickets being non-refundable as per the T&Cs, that 'as a gesture of goodwill' they'd honour a refund for me....

 

[221129]

You should be entitled to a full refund.

Not the case. See above. The rules have changed.

 

[CyrusWuff]

With the Christmas travel window now being restricted to just Christmas Day, RDG have issued yet another revised briefing.

Fee-free changes of journey and RTV/eVoucher refunds are now extended to Advance tickets booked on or after 24th November for travel between 23rd and 27th December. As usual, requests must be submitted before the departure time of the first reserved train.

In addition, you may claim a full refund, with no admin fee, for ANY ticket type booked on or after 24th November for travel between 23rd and 27th December.

NB: Different rules MAY apply for journeys sold by ScotRail for travel wholly within Scotland, and by Transport for Wales Rail for travel wholly within Wales.

 

[Haywain]

With the Christmas travel window now being restricted to just Christmas Day, RDG have issued yet another revised briefing.

Fee-free changes of journey and RTV/eVoucher refunds are now extended to Advance tickets booked on or after 24th November for travel between 23rd and 27th December. As usual, requests must be submitted before the departure time of the first reserved train.

In addition, you may claim a full refund, with no admin fee, for ANY ticket type booked on or after 24th November for travel between 23rd and 27th December.

NB: Different rules MAY apply for journeys sold by ScotRail for travel wholly within Scotland, and by Transport for Wales Rail for travel wholly within Wales.

This applies to tickets bought on or before 14 December which are for travel between 16 December and 2 January inclusive.

Edit: Incorrect information - @CyrusWuff has given the correct information regarding actual refunds, the details I incorrectly added apply to credit vouchers for tickets for a wider range of dates. For context, there has been a series of staff briefs over the last week making things confusing, especially for front line staff. It seems the attempt at issuing a simplifier didn't have the desired effect in my case!

 

[CyrusWuff]

This applies to tickets bought on or before 14 December which are for travel between 16 December and 2 January inclusive.

My bad...I was just going from the latest announcement rather than the full decision tree!

Here's the full thing for Advance tickets. Normal refund rules applied to walk up tickets before the latest update.

1. Was the ticket purchased on or before 26/11/2020?
   • If Yes, go to 2.
   • If No, go to 3.
2. Is the ticket to travel on or before 02/01/2021?
   • If Yes, go to 9.
   • If No, go to 10.
3. Was the ticket purchased on or before 14/12/2020?
   • If Yes, go to 4.
   • If No, go to 6.
4. is the ticket to travel on or after 16/12/2020?
   • If Yes, go to 5.
   • If No, go to 10.
5. Is the ticket valid to travel to or from a station that has changed to Tier 3 or Tier 4?
   • If Yes, go to 9.
   • If No, go to 10.
6. Was the ticket purchased on or before 17/12/2020?
   • If Yes, go to 7.
   • If No, go to 10.
7. Is the ticket to travel on or after 19/12/2020?
   • If Yes, go to 8.
   • If No, go to 10.
8. Is the ticket to travel between 23/12/2020 and 27/12/2020?
   • If Yes, go to 9.
   • If No, go to 5.
9. Ticket can be changed without a fee, or credit issued.
10. Ticket cannot be changed without a fee. No credit issued.

Remains to be seen at what point RDG give up and just say to use discretion rather than trying to keep up with all the changes!

 

[island]

5. confuses me. Why is a ticket to/from a newly tier 3 or 4 station not changeable or refundable? Have you possibly reversed 9 and 10?

edit: looking at iKB page 246452 I think you have reversed those two in what was an otherwise excellent transcription of the flowchart of 20•DMR•20, but there has been yet another new flowchart

 

[Haywain]

Deleted.

 

[CyrusWuff]

5. confuses me. Why is a ticket to/from a newly tier 3 or 4 station not changeable or refundable? Have you possibly reversed 9 and 10?

edit: looking at iKB page 246452 I think you have reversed those two in what was an otherwise excellent transcription of the flowchart of 20•DMR•20, but there has been yet another new flowchart

Mea culpa. Fixed!

 

[Trackman]

Quick question, if you go for a free amendment, is there a time limit?

 

[Philip]

If someone has an advance ticket to travel before 23rd December, I'm assuming the normal rules apply and the ticket is non-refundable?

 

[CyrusWuff]

Quick question, if you go for a free amendment, is there a time limit?

Other than the normal "prior to the departure of the first reserved train", no limit has been specified that I can see.

 

[Haywain]

Other than the normal "prior to the departure of the first reserved train", no limit has been specified that I can see.

That will be the usual limit of the period for which reservations are open.

 

[father_jack]

If someone has an advance ticket to travel before 23rd December, I'm assuming the normal rules apply and the ticket is non-refundable?

Won't say what TOC but the briefing I had yesterday said all tickets purchased after 23rd November can be refunded to original method of payment with no admin fees.

 

[alistairlees]

Won't say what TOC but the briefing I had yesterday said all tickets purchased after 23rd November can be refunded to original method of payment with no admin fees.

This is universal. All Advance tickets purchased on or after 24th November, for travel on 23rd to 27th December inclusive, can be refunded by the retailer from which you bought the ticket. There are no fees to pay.

This doesn't seem to be captured in CyrusWuff's summary above.

 

[Haywain]

This doesn't seem to be captured in CyrusWuff's summary above.

To be fair, there have been so many changes and it has become so complex that it's almost inevitable something would be missed.

 

[Trackman]

Other than the normal "prior to the departure of the first reserved train", no limit has been specified that I can see.

The reason I ask I have an Avanti e-ticket, a couple of weeks ago (under the old rules) the e-ticket was marked as 'free amendment' on the system (I was unable to obtain RTV's). Oddly enough this was after departure date, but they made a note of my email date-stamp. I can remember some problem with Avanti with free amendment time limits a while back, that's why I asked. As it stands at the moment they obviously cannot enforce a time limit if you are unable to travel so I'll wait until things quieten down a bit.

 

[XmaX]

This is universal. All Advance tickets purchased on or after 24th November, for travel on 23rd to 27th December inclusive, can be refunded by the retailer from which you bought the ticket. There are no fees to pay.

This doesn't seem to be captured in CyrusWuff's summary above.

I have an advanced single ticket on CrossCountry, purchased 6/12 for travel on 24/12 which I wasn't able to use. Contacted XC via email on 22/12 requesting a full refund without a fee.

XC response:

The tickets which you have purchased are Advance Single, which are non-refundable, valid for the date, time and train specified. We are complete aware of the on going situation around the global, I personally would like to process refunds for the booking, but unfortunately we are tied with the terms and conditions.

The cost of your ticket is less than £10, I'm really sorry to inform you that, We cannot process a refund on this ticket.

I replied, pointing out that according to their own rules stated on their website, they should refund me, as well as to the government announcements, but XC still won't budge:

Sorry for the miscommunication.

The tickets which you have purchased are Advance Single, which are non-refundable, valid for the date, time and train specified. However, Understanding the situation here, You can book new set of tickets for the same stations. When you book new tickets, Help us with the new reference number and we will process a full refund on the existing booking.

I am now getting slightly annoyed. Mind you, this is for a £4.55 ticket so it's not exactly a matter of life and death, but it's more about the principle.

 

[alistairlees]

I have an advanced single ticket on CrossCountry, purchased 6/12 for travel on 24/12 which I wasn't able to use. Contacted XC via email on 22/12 requesting a full refund without a fee.

XC response:


I replied, pointing out that according to their own rules stated on their website, they should refund me, as well as to the government announcements, but XC still won't budge:


I am now getting slightly annoyed. Mind you, this is for a £4.55 ticket so it's not exactly a matter of life and death, but it's more about the principle.

Although it doesn't mention Advance tickets specifically, the DfT's announcement on this is reasonably clear:

Government announces refunds for rail and coach journeys booked for previous Christmas travel window

Refund guarantee for cancelled Christmas rail and coach trips.

www.gov.uk

Perhaps you could send them that?

I'm assuming you purchased from XC? The DfT announcement is a bit unclear, by referring to "operators" rather than "retailers". You should be seeking a refund from wherever you purchased it.

 

[CyrusWuff]

I have an advanced single ticket on CrossCountry, purchased 6/12 for travel on 24/12 which I wasn't able to use. Contacted XC via email on 22/12 requesting a full refund without a fee.

XC response:


I replied, pointing out that according to their own rules stated on their website, they should refund me, as well as to the government announcements, but XC still won't budge:


I am now getting slightly annoyed. Mind you, this is for a £4.55 ticket so it's not exactly a matter of life and death, but it's more about the principle.

I suggest you point them at https://www.nationalrail.co.uk/stations_destinations/coronavirus_refunds.aspx where it quite clearly states that fee-free refunds are available for ALL ticket types purchased on or after 24th November for travel between 23rd and 27th December, though they need to be requested through the original retailer.

 

[XmaX]

Although it doesn't mention Advance tickets specifically, the DfT's announcement on this is reasonably clear:

Government announces refunds for rail and coach journeys booked for previous Christmas travel window

Refund guarantee for cancelled Christmas rail and coach trips.

www.gov.uk

Perhaps you could send them that?

I'm assuming you purchased from XC? The DfT announcement is a bit unclear, by referring to "operators" rather than "retailers". You should be seeking a refund from wherever you purchased it.

Yes, I sent them a link to that exact announcement, and quoted the relevant bits. The second email from XC was already after I sent them that.

And yes, I bought the ticket directly from CrossCountry website.

 

[Alex C.]

Yes, I sent them a link to that exact announcement, and quoted the relevant bits. The second email from XC was already after I sent them that.

And yes, I bought the ticket directly from CrossCountry website.

I know it's not much but if you have the time, ask for a deadlock letter to take it to the Rail Ombudsman. I suspect someone with a bit of authority will review it and agree to your refund quite quickly.