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Berlin Brandenburg Airport opens after being nine years late.

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Acc3lerat1on

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Originally expected to open in October 2011, the airport will open tomorrow (Sunday 25th October). After several problems, including a malfunctioning fire system, and several controversies the airport will replace the old Tegal, Schönefeld and Templehof (which closed in 2008) airports.
 
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LOL The Irony

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Originally expected to open in October 2011, the airport will open tomorrow (Sunday 25th October). After several problems, including a malfunctioning fire system, and several controversies the airport will replace the old Tegal, Schönefeld and Templehof (which closed in 2008) airports.
Oh, finally.
 
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TheEdge

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Not quite there yet.

Tomorrow marks the day Schönefeld ceases to be an airport in it's own rights and begins operating as a terminal of BER. Its next Sunday the "new" airport opens.
 

XAM2175

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Last flights out of Tegel are scheduled for 8th November, though apparently it will remain capable of receiving flights for emergency purposes until 3 May 2021.
 

STEVIEBOY1

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That is a co-incidence, I was only thinking about The Berlin Airports a few days ago. Is the New Airport linked to the city centre by S or U Bhan, I presume it will be a bit dearer as I think it would be in Zone C? I wonder what will happen to the Tegel site. I was on a train that stopped by Templehof and it seemed to be party used as a park.
 
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XAM2175

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I wonder what will happen to the Tegal site. I was on a train that stopped by Templehof and it seemed to be party used as a park.

I don't know anything about a Tegal site, but the Tegel site ;))) is apparently being redeveloped for offices, research and development firms, light industry, etc. I understand also that Beuth University of Applied Sciences will be opening a science and technology centre in the central terminal building.
 

JonathanP

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That is a co-incidence, I was only thinking about The Berlin Airports a few days ago. Is the New Airport linked to the city centre by S or U Bhan, I presume it will be a bit dearer as I think it would be in Zone C? I wonder what will happen to the Tegal site. I was on a train that stopped by Templehof and it seemed to be party used as a park.

It is indeed dearer to travel to Zone C - by 64 pence. However, Schönefeld was also in Zone C.

The future of Tegel has been subject to controversy. There was even a referendum which returned a majority in favour of keeping it open. However, like any sensible country, since the result was "wrong"(contrary to the plans of the government) it was simply ignored ;) :lol:
It will become a research and development centre for future technology. As far as I know this does not include retaining the runway as an active aviation facility.
 

LNW-GW Joint

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I see from the DB planner that the new Rostock-Berlin-Dresden IC service calls at BER T1/2 en route.
This is the fastest service from Hbf to BER at 28 minutes, although the other two RE routes are only 34 minutes.
The IC service uses Stadler KISS (ex-Westbahn) EMUs and runs in the opposite hours to the EC service to Dresden/Prague (which doesn't divert via BER).
 

nlogax

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I know Tegel was cramped and unsuited to the sort of traffic growth we were seeing before the pandemic but damn, I'll miss it. It certainly had character and a twenty minute cab ride to central Berlin was pretty nice.
 

CarltonA

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I flew into Tegel in 1982. It was dark as we landed and the runway lights were spectacular. They were no doubt making sure no mistakes were made landing on the wrong side of the wall. The D shape of West Berlin was easy to pick out as the border was well illuminated.
 

LSWR Cavalier

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From Berlin a single ticket to BER costs €3.60 (zones ABC), from Potsdam on the RB22, outer ring, only €3.30 (zones BC)
FEX Flughafen Express runs half-hourly from 0330 to 2330, from Hauptbahnhof via Gesundbrunnen, Ostkreuz
Transfer between T1+2 and T5 costs €1.60 by S-Bahn or bus
Source: punkt 3, VBB publication
..
Some of the planes shall be making interesting manouvers shortly before or after landing, sharp turns, to avoid making so much noise over residential areas

Englebert Luedtke Daldrup, who managed to bring the whole circus to completion, is 64 on 31 October, he looks about 35 to me, I guess the hard work kept him young
 

1D54

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T5 (schönefeld) is reported to be closing for a year due to the lack of traffic and may never reopen. Only a couple of airlines are using it, including Ryanair, and they will be moved over to the new hall.
 

Ianno87

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T5 (schönefeld) is reported to be closing for a year due to the lack of traffic and may never reopen. Only a couple of airlines are using it, including Ryanair, and they will be moved over to the new hall.

I used Schönefeld in 2018 and it was a cramped, outdated mess.

The gate departure boards still had a line for "Via" on them, for crying out loud.
 

Cloud Strife

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I thought I'd leave some comments here about Berlin-Brandenburg, based on my experience of it a couple of months ago:

- It is very, very badly designed from a user perspective. For instance, there are pillars right in front of some check-in desks, and there's simply not enough space to queue for...anything.
- There are very few moving walkways, which means that there are lengthy walks.
- Signage is very poor and unclear.
- The gate areas are just too small, especially if flights are departing from adjacent gates.
- There's a lack of seating, especially in the central airside part of T1.
- The observation deck is frankly awful and paid for.
- There's nothing to eat in the restaurants airside (in this sense, it's comparable to the New Istanbul Airport).
- Security lines are a mess at peak times, not helped by the stubborn refusal to open up the security checkpoints before 4am when there are flights departing from 5:40am.
- Getting through security is incredibly slow.
- There's no possibility to pay for fast track security, which is insane.
- The actual design of the security checkpoints is poor, as someone being stopped holds up the rest of the queue.

I miss Schönefeld. I never waited more than 5 minutes there to go through security, there were reasonable places to eat, and although small, the security checkpoints were well designed.

I have absolutely no idea who designed BER, but it's painfully obvious that they had never done such a job before. Or, as I suspect, Wowereit and friends had no idea what it was like to use an airport as an ordinary civilian.
 

KeithMcC

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I have absolutely no idea who designed BER, but it's painfully obvious that they had never done such a job before. Or, as I suspect, Wowereit and friends had no idea what it was like to use an airport as an ordinary civilian.
I read somewhere that the Architect didn't think that retail outlets were required in an airport, so put very few in. Also it was designed before the rise of the budget airlines, so inherently out of date. I haven't been to Berlin recently, but I quite liked Tegel!
Anyway the Architect was GMP https://www.gmp.de/en/projects/512/berlin-brandenburg-willy-brandt-airport
 

Cloud Strife

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Another update on BER:

T2 is now open and in use, and interestingly, they seem to have understood the 'less is more' concept of a low cost terminal. It's a few short steps from kerbside to the check-in desks, there's plenty of security controls and it's much, much quicker to get through to airside. It's also much friendlier for people with limited mobility, and it's very quick to access the gates from kerbside.

It is, admittedly, very poor in terms of facilities, but there's really not much need for anything landside there. Unlike T1, it actually is fit for purpose, with some catering outlets airside and a reasonably sized duty free shop.

Another black mark against BER is the total lack of catering outlets open at 4am. It's nearly impossible to get anything to eat airside at 4-4:30am, with the exception of one small shop in T1 airside where they sell reasonably priced sandwiches. Getting a hot breakfast is impossible, which is really a large oversight in a supposedly major airport.

IMO, if BER reopens T5 and opens a new T3 in the same style as the existing T2, it will be perfectly adequate for the next 30 years. T1 is a huge white elephant, but it will do the job catering to the flag carriers. The bulk of the flights at the airport will continue to be low cost flights, and T2/T5 cater perfectly for them.
 

Bletchleyite

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Another black mark against BER is the total lack of catering outlets open at 4am. It's nearly impossible to get anything to eat airside at 4-4:30am, with the exception of one small shop in T1 airside where they sell reasonably priced sandwiches. Getting a hot breakfast is impossible, which is really a large oversight in a supposedly major airport.

To be fair hot breakfasts are not really a German thing and you won't really find them anywhere in Germany other than the likes of McDonalds where they are an American incomer. A bakery basket with butter, meat, cheese and jam (not all at once :) ) is the normal German breakfast, of which a packet sandwich is a vaguely reasonable approximation. You might very occasionally see scrambled egg with ham bits at best.
 

1D54

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Yes but i thought the plan was for them to go to the T5 (Schönefeld) if it ever reopened. Probably best to stay in T1 and wait to see if anything happens in the future with the old terminal.
 

ChrisRS

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For a multi billion pound airport I was shocked when I got to the gate to find enough seating for no more than 12 people. I think they forgot that a 737-800 can hold over 180 people.
 

Cloud Strife

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To be fair hot breakfasts are not really a German thing and you won't really find them anywhere in Germany other than the likes of McDonalds where they are an American incomer. A bakery basket with butter, meat, cheese and jam (not all at once :) ) is the normal German breakfast, of which a packet sandwich is a vaguely reasonable approximation. You might very occasionally see scrambled egg with ham bits at best.

Even that would have been fine! It was immensely frustrating, because I could have gone to any number of kebab shops to get something breakfast-ish, or I could have eaten breakfast at the border crossing in Olszyna before getting to the airport. I was convinced there'd be at least somewhere open to eat something reasonable, but nope, nothing. There was just nothing beyond that one shop, so I contented myself with beer and a wrap.

What was interesting was that there was no shortage of people heading up to the food court to find food.

For a multi billion pound airport I was shocked when I got to the gate to find enough seating for no more than 12 people. I think they forgot that a 737-800 can hold over 180 people.

That's another story in itself. The lack of capacity at the gates is absolutely criminal, and shows that it was designed with the pre-September 11th mentality towards airports in mind. It wouldn't be so bad if there were plenty of seating elsewhere in the airport, but even the T1 airside shopping/restaurant area seems to be criminally lacking in seating.

Yes but i thought the plan was for them to go to the T5 (Schönefeld) if it ever reopened. Probably best to stay in T1 and wait to see if anything happens in the future with the old terminal.

T2 is already crowded in the morning, so there may not be room for Easyjet there on top. There's not many check-in desks, and definitely not enough to accommodate Easyjet's previous operations in T5. I suspect that Easyjet are waiting to see what happens with T5, because they would more than likely prefer to return to their old terminal A than to move into T2.
 

Bletchleyite

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For a multi billion pound airport I was shocked when I got to the gate to find enough seating for no more than 12 people. I think they forgot that a 737-800 can hold over 180 people.

Depends how you operate it. You don't need gate seating if you don't call for boarding until close to when the aircraft is actually ready. Most gates at Luton have no seating at all or only one row for people requiring assistance.
 

cactustwirly

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Depends how you operate it. You don't need gate seating if you don't call for boarding until close to when the aircraft is actually ready. Most gates at Luton have no seating at all or only one row for people requiring assistance.

Where as civilized airports such as Heathrow have plenty of seating....

It does take a while to board an aircraft so it is nice to have somewhere to sit until your boarding group is called.
 

Cloud Strife

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Depends how you operate it. You don't need gate seating if you don't call for boarding until close to when the aircraft is actually ready. Most gates at Luton have no seating at all or only one row for people requiring assistance.

This is true, but BER is really lacking in seating full stop. The food court area is woefully inadequate for the amount of people travelling, and the other food businesses also have very limited seating. The other issue is the sheer distance in the terminal, so if you waited until boarding was called, you'd be in danger of missing your flights.

As much as I don't like T1 in Munich, there's a substantial amount of seating space available throughout the terminal.
 
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