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Brexit matters

AY1975

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I wonder if Ms Sturgeon and her successors will subscribe to that idea if or when Scotland votes for independence? My feeling is that the SNP regards "no" to independence as a temporary decision, but will regard "yes" as permanent and never to be questioned again.
Just as Nigel Farage said before the Brexit referendum that "a 52% win for Remain would be unfinished business by a long way", yet the Brexiteers regard a 52% win for Leave as a permanent decision and never to be revisited, and from 1975 until Cameron called the 2016 referendum pro-EU politicians complacently believed that the 1975 referendum had settled the matter once and for all and that no government would ever want to revisit the issue.
 
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edwin_m

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Of course the question will be whether that many will want to come?
Indeed. The driver shortage is evident to varying degrees across Europe, so a driver who is willing to work abroad has plenty of countries to choose from. Will they choose to move somewhere probably further from home and certainly with a lot more paperwork needed than elsewhere, and which is probably going to sling them out as soon as the problem recedes.
 

WestCoast

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Indeed. The driver shortage is evident to varying degrees across Europe, so a driver who is willing to work abroad has plenty of countries to choose from. Will they choose to move somewhere probably further from home and certainly with a lot more paperwork needed than elsewhere, and which is probably going to sling them out as soon as the problem recedes.

EU drivers also to have consider their partners and children if they have them, will temporary visas permit family accompanying them? Unlikely I would say. Why go for a job in the UK when the Dutch or Germans will make you and your family more welcome as a skilled driver.

I would guess the UK may have more luck with non-EU drivers e.g. Ukrainians and Turkish for instance as they don’t enjoy automatic access to the EU employment market.
 
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edwin_m

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I would guess the UK may have more luck with non-EU drivers e.g. Ukrainians and Turkish for instance as they don’t enjoy automatic access to the EU employment market.
...and the 2016 campaign raised the threat of Turkish immigration as a reason to leave...
 

XAM2175

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Interesting bit of news here (from 21/9) on the carbon dioxide shortage:

The article is behind a paywall so I can't quote it in full, but I think the subheading illustrates the point sufficiently:
Northern Ireland bottlers are getting their carbon dioxide from EU countries while GB remains paralysed by the closure of huge fertiliser factories
 

class ep-09

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The Johnson blinked.




Of course the question will be whether that many will want to come?
No.
Why bother for few months till visa expires ?
Btw. Germans pay HGv drivers similar or better money and provide MUCH better facilities , so anyone with half brain will go yo Germany .
 

Gostav

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No.
Why bother for few months till visa expires ?
Btw. Germans pay HGv drivers similar or better money and provide MUCH better facilities , so anyone with half brain will go yo Germany .
UK has received many Afghan refugees and is there has any plan to train them to engage in relevant work to better integrate into the society?
 

XAM2175

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UK has received many Afghan refugees and is there has any plan to train them to engage in relevant work to better integrate into the society?
Leaving aside the "many" part, the current HGV driver shortage is caused in no small part by the fact that the training and licensing process is so badly backed up. The immediate solution needs drivers that are already trained, and ideally already licensed.
 

najaB

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UK has received many Afghan refugees and is there has any plan to train them to engage in relevant work to better integrate into the society?
Why do you assume that they are untrained and unable to work?
 

najaB

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Plus hell lot less of the ref tape
Not to mention that where cross-border deliveries are concerned a single driver can be as productive on an intra-EU run as two or three drivers doing deliveries between the UK and the EU.
 

johncrossley

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Yes .
400,000 lorry drivers needed in the EU .

Which pro rata is less that UK but still , no problems with getting job as HGV driver.

Plus hell lot less of the ref tape .

Precisely. So the visa will only be attractive to those outside the EU. Why bother to get a UK visa when you can work anywhere in the EU without a visa and be allowed to live there as long as you like? The only way the UK will attract EU HGV drivers would be to offer a lot more money than they could get in the EU.
 

REVUpminster

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Netherlands and Germany are training refugees. Spain has reduced the age for HGV drivers to 18; this may help there youth unemployment rate as well. Don't know if 18 year olds will be able to drive HGV lorries in other parts of the EU.

One advantage the UK has over the rest of Europe and why so many try to cross the channel illegally is they often speak English from watching American and English TV and films. The big countries such as Spain, Germany, Italy, and France can afford to dub films and TV while smaller countries use sub titles which I suppose is a good way to learn a language.
 

class ep-09

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Precisely. So the visa will only be attractive to those outside the EU. Why bother to get a UK visa when you can work anywhere in the EU without a visa and be allowed to live there as long as you like? The only way the UK will attract EU HGV drivers would be to offer a lot more money than they could get in the EU.
To add to that - is anyone from outside of the EU be interested ?
I doubt it either , just to think about the cost of a plane ticket say from Africa or Asia ( I very much doubt anyone would fancy to come from S and N America or Australia ) .
Then you are allowed to work for few months and then you have to ho back .

Typically this government is pretending is doing something and they are afraid to admit that because of brex**** they screwed the whole country .
 

najaB

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One advantage the UK has over the rest of Europe and why so many try to cross the channel illegally is they often speak English from watching American and English TV and films.
It's interesting that migrants don't integrate because they can't speak the language and at the same time want to come here because they speak English...
 

DelayRepay

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I guess the Visa scheme is something, but I really doubt 10,000 drivers until Christmas Eve will make a huge difference when reports say we are 100,000 short. I also doubt, even with the best efforts, we'll have 100,000 extra drivers by Boxing Day.

I am also concerned that the 'rush' to train extra drivers will compromise safety.

As always, we are using a very short term sticking plaster to address a long term and deep problem.
 

REVUpminster

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It's interesting that migrants don't integrate because they can't speak the language and at the same time want to come here because they speak English...
Most migrants don't intergrate on religious grounds. It's been the same through the ages. Many of our football teams have historic religious affiliations notably in Glasgow, Edinburgh, Liverpool, Manchester, and a lesser extent London.
 

davetheguard

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why so many try to cross the channel illegally is
The reason why so many (as you put it) try to cross the channel illegally is because we've made it so extremely difficult to enter the country legally. Post Brexit points system has made this even worse.

So instead of people coming here legitimately, getting jobs, and paying taxes to our government, we have to spend a fortune trying to keep them out. While at the same time, we haven't got enough workers to fill all the job vacancies.....

Perhaps I'm missing something, but it doesn't seem to make much sense to me.
 
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alex397

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Most migrants don't intergrate on religious grounds. It's been the same through the ages. Many of our football teams have historic religious affiliations notably in Glasgow, Edinburgh, Liverpool, Manchester, and a lesser extent London.
Have you got some figures to back that up?

Also, do you consider someone only ‘integrated’ once they have converted to Christianity?
 

REVUpminster

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Have you got some figures to back that up?

Also, do you consider someone only ‘integrated’ once they have converted to Christianity?
Why assume the asylum seekers are not Christians. Until recent fundamental Islam, Christians lived all over the middle east. Saddam Hussein's deputy Tariq Aziz was a Christian.
 

najaB

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Why assume the asylum seekers are not Christians. Until recent fundamental Islam, Christians lived all over the middle east. Saddam Hussein's deputy Tariq Aziz was a Christian.
You're the one who said:
Most migrants don't intergrate on religious grounds.
If they are Christian then what are the "religious grounds" of which you speak?
 

alex397

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Why assume the asylum seekers are not Christians. Until recent fundamental Islam, Christians lived all over the middle east. Saddam Hussein's deputy Tariq Aziz was a Christian.
You haven’t answered my questions which I assume means you don’t have an answer.

In your post you said the following:
REVUpminster said:
Most migrants don't intergrate on religious grounds
Which to me seems like you were assuming ‘most’ migrants are not Christian, by saying they don’t integrate on religious grounds.
 

najaB

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More Brexit-related insanity from our Government:

British motorists driving outside the UK must now remove old-style GB stickers or cover them up.
Instead they should display a UK sticker or have the UK identifier on their number plate.
The UK government guidance has been in place since Tuesday 28 September.
"It might only be a matter of replacing two letters, but this is a significant change for drivers who in normal times take their cars outside the UK," said RAC spokesman Rod Dennis.
The new rules state that any driver with a GB sticker on their car now needs to replace it with a new UK one if they are taking their vehicle abroad.
"Drivers also need to remember that number plates featuring the blue band and letters 'GB' next to the European golden stars are also no longer valid," Mr Dennis warned.

 

Xenophon PCDGS

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Let us not forget that the RMT union were in favour of Brexit, so that means it was the right path to follow during the referendum.

*********************************************************************************************************************
Do not some of our Gallic neighbours refer to this country as Royaume-Uni?
 
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najaB

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Do not some of our Gallic neighbours refer to this country as Royaume-Uni?
Quite possibly so. But this switch to UK from GB is, in my opinion, largely driven by the desire to replace the EU flag sticker with the Union Flag, rather than the stated "strengthening the Union identity".
 

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