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Bristol Temple Meads - eastern approach remodelling

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MarkyT

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‘Journey times extended by 10 minutes’ certainly makes it sound like they’ll be routing trains through St Philip’s Marsh. Surely there’s no other alternative route that would only take an extra 10 minutes?
Alternatively, with the northern parts of the Bristol East Junction layout taken out of use for relaying, it's possible XC trains might be being diverted via the Bristol (Rhubarb) Loop towards Bath for reversal at Bristol East Depot. They would then be able to access the higher numbered platforms (say #11-#15) via the Up Main and Down Main while work on the Filton side takes place. That would seem reasonable for the extra time added.
 
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The Planner

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‘Journey times extended by 10 minutes’ certainly makes it sound like they’ll be routing trains through St Philip’s Marsh. Surely there’s no other alternative route that would only take an extra 10 minutes?
Fairly sure that some trains are reversing at North Somerset to go via the Rhubarb. That would easily eat up 10 with the reversal.
 

tel

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‘Journey times extended by 10 minutes’ certainly makes it sound like they’ll be routing trains through St Philip’s Marsh. Surely there’s no other alternative route that would only take an extra 10 minutes?

Yes and the following week where journey times are extended by 1 hour suggests that trains will be diverted from Parkway to Bath, Westbury and down to Taunton. So I think we deduced that the route via PM wouldn't be used.

Tel
 
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Horizon22

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‘Journey times extended by 10 minutes’ certainly makes it sound like they’ll be routing trains through St Philip’s Marsh. Surely there’s no other alternative route that would only take an extra 10 minutes?

There's no direct route in via St Philip's Marsh though, so would necessitate a reversal somewhere or using Rhubarb Loop. Not sure where they'd reverse exactly though.

Edit: looks like there's a shunt available on the goods line south of the Down Main. Very broadly taking this route and reversing in the box
 

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Brissle Girl

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‘Journey times extended by 10 minutes’ certainly makes it sound like they’ll be routing trains through St Philip’s Marsh. Surely there’s no other alternative route that would only take an extra 10 minutes?
That sounds more like going via N Somerset Jn and then reversing onto the Rhubarb loop, rather than going via St Philip's Marsh, (whilst the Filton side of Bristol East is being remodelled).
 

Annetts key

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There's no direct route in via St Philip's Marsh though, so would necessitate a reversal somewhere or using Rhubarb Loop. Not sure where they'd reverse exactly though.

From the Filton direction:

A train can travel down the Down Filton Relief, crossover to the Up Bristol Loop line, on to the Up Main, then round to SPM. This is a direct main aspect route.

However, using most of the above routing, I think it is much more likely that CrossCountry trains will instead head towards Bristol East Depot, stop, then change direction and travel into Temple Meads on the Down Main. They can then use platforms 11/12, the Down Through (if not stopping) or use platform 15.

As I said earlier, using SPM is operationally very difficult.
 

Dai Corner

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From the Filton direction:

A train can travel down the Down Filton Relief, crossover to the Up Bristol Loop line, on to the Up Main, then round to SPM. This is a direct main aspect route.

However, using most of the above routing, I think it is much more likely that CrossCountry trains will instead head towards Bristol East Depot, stop, then change direction and travel into Temple Meads on the Down Main. They can then use platforms 11/12, the Down Through (if not stopping) or use platform 15.

As I said earlier, using SPM is operationally very difficult.
This also has the distinct advantage that people can get on and off!
 

Horizon22

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From the Filton direction:

A train can travel down the Down Filton Relief, crossover to the Up Bristol Loop line, on to the Up Main, then round to SPM. This is a direct main aspect route.

However, using most of the above routing, I think it is much more likely that CrossCountry trains will instead head towards Bristol East Depot, stop, then change direction and travel into Temple Meads on the Down Main. They can then use platforms 11/12, the Down Through (if not stopping) or use platform 15.

As I said earlier, using SPM is operationally very difficult.

When I said no direct route, felt it was implied without going via Bristol TM as that's where the works are!
 

Yindee8191

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Alternatively, with the northern parts of the Bristol East Junction layout taken out of use for relaying, it's possible XC trains might be being diverted via the Bristol (Rhubarb) Loop towards Bath for reversal at Bristol East Depot. They would then be able to access the higher numbered platforms (say #11-#15) via the Up Main and Down Main while work on the Filton side takes place. That would seem reasonable for the extra time added.
Ah, thanks for clearing that up. Definitely makes sense
 

edwin_m

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Does that mean that when the other half of the layout is being done, London trains will use the Rhubarb Curve and reverse near Lawrence Hill?
 

Annetts key

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When I said no direct route, felt it was implied without going via Bristol TM as that's where the works are!
When there is a total block on all lines, obviously not. But the plan is to keep some platforms and lines open for most of the time.


Does that mean that when the other half of the layout is being done, London trains will use the Rhubarb Curve and reverse near Lawrence Hill?

I believe this is likely, yes. But since the requading (four tracking for those who don’t know it was four lines prior to 1984). I’ve not checked on what is now possible.
 

edwin_m

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I believe this is likely, yes. But since the requading (four tracking for those who don’t know it was four lines prior to 1984). I’ve not checked on what is now possible.
Did something very similar on a Cardiff-Portsmouth in a 2017 heatwave when only one of the three coaches had working aircon and the driver wanted to be driving from that end for the rest of the journey.
 

Annetts key

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Yeah, various things are possible when you have multiple junctions and someone had their sensible head on at the design stage.

I’ve boarded a train in BTM platform 1 that turned around via Dr Days Jcn, North Somerset Jc, back to BTM (stopping again at platform 3), then on towards the West...
It was a special though, as it was replacing the last train of the day for the stopping service, due to a problem with the booked service.
 

Class 170101

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The hourly extension to journey time is that Bristol Parkway to Taunton via Dr Days Jn, Bath Spa and Westbury or via Swindon reverse then via Melksham and Westbury?
 

43 302

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The hourly extension to journey time is that Bristol Parkway to Taunton via Dr Days Jn, Bath Spa and Westbury or via Swindon reverse then via Melksham and Westbury?
I would imagine the former but I don't know.
 

Brissle Girl

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XC can also divert via Swindon if needs be, aren’t they cleared via the Golden Valley too?
Yes, services were routed that way during the Filton bank work. Whether it is worth ensuring route knowledge is in place when the alternative via Bath is available (and more regularly used by XC) is another matter.
 

Dren Ahmeti

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Yes, services were routed that way during the Filton bank work. Whether it is worth ensuring route knowledge is in place when the alternative via Bath is available (and more regularly used by XC) is another matter.
I seem to remember some diversions that way recently, including one that went Didcot-Swindon! Didn’t know that they still signed that way.

However, didn’t XC have route conductors to divert via the Henbury Loop line a while ago?
 

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Narroways Junction - Clifton Down - Avonmouth - Holesmouth Junction - Hallen Marsh Junction - Henbury - Filton West Junction - Stoke Gifford West Junction has been used as a diversionary route on various occasions. Many, many years ago, BR Intercity used it (and paid a contribution towards the maintenance of it).

During some major engineering works on the Filton lines, CrossCountry have used Avonmouth/Henbury. They paid for the signalling to be improved, allowing properly signalled moves between the Severn Beach line and the Henbury Freight line at Holesmouth Junction, plus various other minor changes.
 

DaveHarries

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‘Journey times extended by 10 minutes’ certainly makes it sound like they’ll be routing trains through St Philip’s Marsh. Surely there’s no other alternative route that would only take an extra 10 minutes?
Yes I think you are right: no other diversion that short. The diversions at other times will be via. Westbury and Castle Cary.

Dave
 

Brissle Girl

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Yes I think you are right: no other diversion that short. The diversions at other times will be via. Westbury and Castle Cary.

Dave
I think it was concluded that a short diversion via North Somerset Jn only to reverse and take the “rhubarb curve” is a more likely scenario.
 

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Brissle Girl

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You've got a half hourly local service and one XC train an hour as a maximum, so I would imagine so. I believe the current signalling would only allow platform 2 to be used for reversing in, but presumably ecs movements can be used to reverse in the Bristol West vicinity, and so arrive at 3 and depart from 1.
 

greatvoyager

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You've got a half hourly local service and one XC train an hour as a maximum, so I would imagine so. I believe the current signalling would only allow platform 2 to be used for reversing in, but presumably ecs movements can be used to reverse in the Bristol West vicinity, and so arrive at 3 and depart from 1.
Ah yes, they probably would use that method to reverse.
 

Annetts key

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Yes, you can see that they have already started work.

During part of the Bristol East work, there will be no platforms available at Temple Meads. The T3 occupation of all lines being approximately the country (West) side of Bath Road over bridge.

What’s bizarre is that the work to “extend the platform” is ‘temporary’. Keeping in mind that it’s only the surface that needs work doing, as the platforms were build for much longer trains. The surface and coping stones having been damaged by the various plant (dumpers, etc.) used last time they resurfaced the current in use part of the platform... Oh and not much effort being maid to control the vegetation.
What’s bizarre is that the work to “extend the platform” is ‘temporary’. Keeping in mind that it’s only the surface that needs work doing, as the platforms were build for much longer trains. The surface and coping stones having been damaged by the various plant (dumpers, etc.) used last time they resurfaced the current in use part of the platform... Oh and not much effort being made to control the vegetation.

Given that the four coach Castle class ‘HST’ 2+4 sets now call regularly, as do some DMUs that are four units long, it would make sense to do a proper job of it.

And if the passenger numbers grow again once the effects of COVID19 Corona virus have disappeared, it is possible that even longer trains may call at this station (e.g. 2 car + 3 car Turbos).
 
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