Can I change the destination on a Northern complimentary travel pass?

[CaptainHaddock]

I've got one of these and I'm planning a trip from Sheffield to Windermere for a day's walking at some point in the future.

The problem is that my chosen journey leaving Sheffield at 0710 only gives me a 14 minute connection at Manchester Piccadilly which, given the Hope Valley stopper is regularly delayed, may not be enough. If I miss the 0848 Manchester to Windermere train, the next Northern one isn't for another 4 hours which would be way too late for a day out.

Were I to miss the 0848, I would prefer to change my destination and get the Northern train to Ulverston at 0948. Under the terms of the ticket could I simply cross out "Windermere" on the complimentary ticket and write "Ulverston" instead?

 

[SteveM70]

You don’t need to complete the ticket to access the platform at Sheffield. I’d like to think that if you explained your situation to the guard on the first train, and said you’d complete the ticket before you got to Piccadilly based on the state of play a few minutes out, they’d be fine with it. However I suspect their gateline staff would absolutely not be fine with it

 

[CaptainHaddock]

You don’t need to complete the ticket to access the platform at Sheffield. I’d like to think that if you explained your situation to the guard on the first train, and said you’d complete the ticket before you got to Piccadilly based on the state of play a few minutes out, they’d be fine with it. However I suspect their gateline staff would absolutely not be fine with it

It's a while since I've been to Piccadilly. Do I need to pass through the gateline to get from platform 1 to 14?

 

[Bletchleyite]

I wouldn't modify a ticket as that could end you up on the thick end of a prosecution.

What I would do is to write Windermere and board the 0948 if you do miss the connection. You are still valid as far as Lancaster. Hopefully the guard will come through in this time and you can explain the situation, and likely they will OK it. If they don't OK it, before leaving Lancaster buy a return from Lancaster to Ulverston on your phone, which is only about a tenner.

Or as an alternative, just buy a single for the Avanti bit from Lancaster to Oxenholme and still go to Windermere, that's only £7.40.

It's a while since I've been to Piccadilly. Do I need to pass through the gateline to get from platform 1 to 14?

You could go over the bridge, but sometimes there are staff at the top (not that often, but I've seen it).

 

[robbeech]

There shouldn't be a massive problem with this in practise, especially if you explain why you've decided to change it, and even more so if you've been delayed because of Northern themselves. I'd start by not filling the destination in at all as Steve says, if you had to, and then needed to change it, you could possibly get a bit of an endorsement from the guard on one of the stations.

In general terms, you'll sometimes benefit from putting a station on there that opens up a variety of routes to you but i appreciate this isn't possible with these 2 destinations due to Windermere being a branch to a dead end. For example you wouldn't have one Barnsley to Hull, you'd have to to Scarborough incase you change your mind on the day.

 

[SteveM70]

It's a while since I've been to Piccadilly. Do I need to pass through the gateline to get from platform 1 to 14?

It wouldn’t matter - my suggestion would mean you’d filled in the ticket before arriving in Manchester

 

[robbeech]

You could go over the bridge, but sometimes there are staff at the top (not that often, but I've seen it).

Agreed, it does happen, although regardless, it's the quickest way anyway so yuo should be going over the bridge regardless.

 

[gray1404]

I do not believe it would be reasonable to expect you to wait 4 hours for the next Northern service to Windermere. In those circumstances there is a very valid argument that you should be allowed to take the next available TOC(s) to your intended destination. You should not feel obliged to change your destination.

 

[LowLevel]

I do not believe it would be reasonable to expect you to wait 4 hours for the next Northern service to Windermere. In those circumstances there is a very valid argument that you should be allowed to take the next available TOC(s) to your intended destination. You should not feel obliged to change your destination.

Without ticket acceptance being in place I suspect you would struggle to get most other TOCs to accept a Northern complimentary travel pass.

Personally I've had a few of them turn up and as long as people have had a decent reason I'm not bothered but I wouldn't have thought there would be an obligation to accept a complimentary product from another TOC otherwise.

 

[SargeNpton]

What does it say on the pass itself about a) whether it needs to be filled in before starting the journey, and b) whether amending it makes it invalid?

 

[philthetube]

If you do miss your train, you could pay to Ulverston and' presumably get another free pass from Northern.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I must admit that given how few people would spend the whole day riding around on trains with one I don't get why they don't just issue them as day rovers, and issue two if a period return is being compensated.

 

[SteveM70]

I must admit that given how few people would spend the whole day riding around on trains with one I don't get why they don't just issue them as day rovers, and issue two if a period return is being compensated.

They seemed to do that when things were really horrific a couple of years ago. No idea whether it was policy, clerical laziness or some of their people going rogue and ticking the all day box out of sympathy for us

 

[Killingworth]

According to recent statistics the 7.10 arrives within 10 minutes 95% of journeys so there may be no problem. However its true, time keeping on the Hope Valley line remains poor even with fewer passengers and trains.

 

[jumble]

You don’t need to complete the ticket to access the platform at Sheffield. I’d like to think that if you explained your situation to the guard on the first train, and said you’d complete the ticket before you got to Piccadilly based on the state of play a few minutes out, they’d be fine with it. However I suspect their gateline staff would absolutely not be fine with it

I am sure you are correct but really struggle to understand why the gateline staff would care at all

 

[_toommm_]

I am sure you are correct but really struggle to understand why the gateline staff would care at all

If it comes in on Platform 1-4 it's TPE gateline staff and they can be pretty arsey.

 

[Bletchleyite]

If it comes in on Platform 1-4 it's TPE gateline staff and they can be pretty arsey.

You wouldn't go via the main gateline to get to 13/14, you'd go via the bridge.

 

[NorthWestRover]

Two or three weeks ago when I was at Picc, there were TPE staff doing ticket checks at the bottom of the stairs from the bridge to platform 1.

 

[RHolmes]

I do not believe it would be reasonable to expect you to wait 4 hours for the next Northern service to Windermere. In those circumstances there is a very valid argument that you should be allowed to take the next available TOC(s) to your intended destination. You should not feel obliged to change your destination.

If there’s no ticket acceptance with another TOC quite simply it wouldn’t be valid and the user would be issued with a penalty fare or made to purchase a new ticket. This is terrible advice.

 

[SteveM70]

I am sure you are correct but really struggle to understand why the gateline staff would care at all

Me too. But the Carlisle security gateline people (Northern’s subcontractors) are a nightmare - poorly trained, low paid, disenfranchised and increasingly unhelpful

 

[Nibbles09]

As harsh as it sounds but altering a destination is amount to a ticket irregularity and you could end in more trouble. You’ve been given a complimentary ticket and the amount of times I’ve seen these defaced with extended dates or change of destination. Best practise is fill in the destination you want to go and if your plans change seek permission to change the destination before boarding or just pay for a separate ticket. Lot cheaper than being charged for the full amount and possibly a fine

 

[RHolmes]

As harsh as it sounds but altering a destination is amount to a ticket irregularity and you could end in more trouble. You’ve been given a complimentary ticket and the amount of times I’ve seen these defaced with extended dates or change of destination. Best practise is fill in the destination you want to go and if your plans change seek permission to change the destination before boarding or just pay for a separate ticket. Lot cheaper than being charged for the full amount and possibly a fine

I’d also add to that your ticket must be fully filled in PRIOR to making your journey as an incomplete ticket is not a valid one either

 

[gray1404]

If there’s no ticket acceptance with another TOC quite simply it wouldn’t be valid and the user would be issued with a penalty fare or made to purchase a new ticket. This is terrible advice.

For the avoidance of doubt I was not giving any advice. I was merely stating that I do not believe it would be reasonable to expect the OP to wait 4 hours. In any situation the OP should seek staff assistance.

 

[Bletchleyite]

For the avoidance of doubt I was not giving any advice. I was merely stating that I do not believe it would be reasonable to expect the OP to wait 4 hours. In any situation the OP should seek staff assistance.

Agreed. It's not entirely unlikely that an Avanti or TPE guard would agree to accept it in the circumstances (for one stop between Lancaster and Oxenholme), however I know some wouldn't.

 

[scrapy]

If the ticket is filled in with Windermere the staff at Piccadilly would have no reason to challenge it. If plans change just have a word with the guard on the train to Ulverston. I'm sure there won't be an issue and you could always ask them to endorse if for your return journey but you could always tweet or phone Northern customer services if you miss the Windermere train and ask advice on ticket acceptance or alternatives. If you alter a ticket off your own back you could potentially be prosecuted.

 

[gray1404]

I've had a similar issue in that my Northern train has been cancelled or delayed and I've needed to get North of Preston for an onward Northern connection when using a comp ticket. A polite and short request to the guard on a AWC/TPE service has always resulted in a "yes" and a smile. I've kept it brief and a polite request (not a demand). On both occasions I've been accepted for travel and I also thanked them quickly upon getting off the train.

It is also worth bearing in mind that if you are delayed when travelling on a Northern comp ticket, you can claim delay repay on that too - in the form of another free ticket depending on the length of the delay.

 

[Llandudno]

The overwhelming majority of on board rail staff are great. If you are friendly, polite and calmly explain your conundrum then in the vast majority of cases you will be met with a favourable response.

A smile costs nothing!

 

[Killingworth]

Today's 7.10 from Sheffield was worryingly 9 minutes down at Chinley but 195126 made it to Piccadilly only 2 minutes late. I'd go for it and if it should be very late do the explaining as suggested. It arrived 6 minutes early yesterday.

 

[Djgr]

Plan B could be changed to walking around Silverdale/Arnside instead, with reduced potential extra costs.

 

[323235]

They seemed to do that when things were really horrific a couple of years ago. No idea whether it was policy, clerical laziness or some of their people going rogue and ticking the all day box out of sympathy for us

I've had a lot of these vouchers but I've never had an all day one - I've often got a return when only a single was expected. I used to email in for free passes for 15-29 minutes delays and they'd often send me a return. In the last few months they seem to have stopped accepting email delay repay (certainly for simple stuff) as I got an email asking me to log it on the portal.