• Our booking engine at tickets.railforums.co.uk (powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!

Class 307/308s in West Yorkshire

Status
Not open for further replies.

yorksrob

Veteran Member
Joined
6 Aug 2009
Messages
38,820
Location
Yorks
Going OT but that reminds me rather of services formed solely of HAPs on the Southern in the 80s (and presumably before). How did the guard manage to get through a 10HAP or 12HAP formation of the kind that ran on certain peak services on the South Western in the 80s? Did fare-dodgers target such trains?

Thinking back to my childhood, the larger stations in Kent and Sussex were barriered, so unless you were going from small station to small station, the chances are you'd have been checked anyway.
 
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R

RailUK Forums

Alfie1014

Member
Joined
27 Jun 2012
Messages
1,119
Location
Essex
I spent six years driving the class 308 units on the Skipton/Bradford FS/Ilkley/Leeds 'triangles' services between 1995 and 2001, when they were replaced by the 333s. Despite their age - and the amount of time that they had spent quietly rusting in the salty sea air at Pig's Bay Sidings, Shoeburyness - they were generally fairly efficient and reliable although, not surprisingly, suffered from quite severe bodywork corrosion.....which made some of the cabs rather draughty in Winter. When the 21 units already mentioned were resurrected and moved up to West Yorkshire in 1994-95, the trailer composites were removed and the resulting three cars units had a significantly improved power/weight ratio. In this form, they were capable of considerably more than their nominal 75 mph maximum and I have to confess to reaching 84 with 308 163 - easily the best unit - one night on the late Ilkley-Skipton ECS working. When things did go wrong, they were usually minor faults which you could just about stagger home with. I only failed completely - requiring assistance - twice in six years, with the same power fault and subsequently discovered that it could be rectified (unofficially) by the driver opening the relay cupboard in the Motor Brake Second and striking the plastic cover of two of the overload relays with a carriage key! Unfortunately, in the late 1990s, a much more serious fault which had afflicted the units a few years earlier on the London, Tilbury & Southend line re-emerged in Yorkshire. One morning, shortly after 308 155 had arrived in platform 2 at Leeds, there was a loud explosion in the motor coach, which blew off one of the brake van doors and catapulted the guard's seat out onto the platform. Luckily the guard had just vacated the van and was shocked, but unhurt. About a week later, the same thing happened with 308 138 in the same platform, thankfully again with no injuries. Both units were taken out of service and sent to Neville Hill immediately after the incidents and several diagrams were replaced by diesel units for a few weeks while the rest of the fleet were checked and it transpired that the problem was caused by overheating of the cooling oil bath surrounding the right-angled joint in the 25 Kv power cable leading from the pantograph main circuit breaker to the transformer. Apparently the same thing happened with 308 162 inside the maintenance shed at Neville Hill - this time causing a fire which damaged the passenger accommodation - and that unit never ran again. The then franchise holder, Northern Spirit, had planned a final gala weekend before the units' second withdrawal - with six car units running special 'express' services circulating on all four routes, interspersed between the 333 service trains and stopping only at Guiseley, Shipley and Keighley and doing the rare electrified track on the Up line to the Limit of Shunt at Skipton North Junction. IIRC, it was planned to sell a £5 'all day' ticket with the proceeds going to a railway charity. Unfortunately, however, Northern Spirit were rapidly descending into a critical driver shortage, with many service train cancellations, so the management reluctantly called off the whole event at very short notice.
I was Service Planning Manager on the LTS during their ‘exploding brakevan‘ period in 1992. All the units had to have testing of the oil around the HV cables taking many out of service if defects were found. It wrecked the service for a while with units brought in from all and sundry sources. Some units were allowed in traffic with MBS locked out of use and guards using cabs or other brake vans but it was a pretty hectic time having to rewrite the timetable and trying to manage peak demand as best possible. Matters were complicated by an unconnected problem with the HT cables in the 312s at one point. That said it did make for interesting times!
 

D6130

Established Member
Joined
12 Jan 2021
Messages
5,652
Location
West Yorkshire/Tuscany
Some units were allowed in traffic with MBS locked out of use and guards using cabs or other brake vans but it was a pretty hectic time having to rewrite the timetable a
I forgot to mention that for several months following the pyrotechnic incidents in Leeds, the guard's compartment in the MBS on the West Yorkshire units was locked out of use - with the guard riding in the rear cab - although the passenger saloons were still in use. Following these incidents, all 21 West Yorkshire units were unofficially named by a couple of Skipton drivers - using stickers inside the cab between the windscreens and below the destination indicator box - after famous historical explosions. Names such as "Vesuvius", "Krakatoa" and "Chernobyl" come to mind. Not surprisingly, management took a dim view of the 308s becoming known as the "Explosion" class and did their best to peel off the 'nameplates'. However, some of the fitters at Neville Hill were sympathetic and reinstated a couple of them!
 

Tracked

Established Member
Joined
30 May 2011
Messages
1,242
Location
53.5440°N 1.1510°W
Remember the 307's well from the early 90's, always used to sit in the powered carriage for the noise as it accelerated, someone's put a bit of footage of them from Outwood in 1991 on Youtube, including the NSE livered unit;

 

Neptune

Established Member
Joined
29 May 2018
Messages
2,445
Location
Yorkshire
Apparently the same thing happened with 308 162 inside the maintenance shed at Neville Hill - this time causing a fire which damaged the passenger accommodation - and that unit never ran again.
Great memories but just a small point. 162 did re-enter service with the MBS from 134 which in turn became the NL Xmas tree.

Great units to work as a guard as were the 307’s. Much preferred having a brake van than squashing into the back cab.
 

61653 HTAFC

Veteran Member
Joined
18 Dec 2012
Messages
17,624
Location
Another planet...
Remember the 307's well from the early 90's, always used to sit in the powered carriage for the noise as it accelerated, someone's put a bit of footage of them from Outwood in 1991 on Youtube, including the NSE livered unit;

Good find, and confirms I hadn't imagined the NSE unit!

Shocking to see those open fields surrounding the station, nearly all buried under housing now.
 

nw1

Established Member
Joined
9 Aug 2013
Messages
6,865
Good find, and confirms I hadn't imagined the NSE unit!

Shocking to see those open fields surrounding the station, nearly all buried under housing now.

A bit OT but related to the above - Is Outwood as a whole one of these places that has had exponential population growth recently?

I ask as I hadn't heard of it at all in the 80s, yet now it's important enough to be part of the name of a constituency (the one formerly of Ed Balls).

FWIW I have only travelled once on this line, to and from Leeds on one rather misty day in February 1989. I don't remember a lot of housing on most of the Doncaster to Leeds section, but rather a mix of abandoned industry and fields for most of the way. I remember you arrived into Leeds quite suddenly, without any of the sprawling suburbs which are a feature of the arrival into Manchester, for instance. This was still by HST, electric services hadn't quite started yet, I don't remember seeing any local services but Pacer might be a fair guess.
 

Neptune

Established Member
Joined
29 May 2018
Messages
2,445
Location
Yorkshire
Since I started in the 90’s Outwood has gone from a handful of passengers and sometimes none to being pretty busy all day and some peak morning trains pre-COVID could pick up 70+ people.
 

61653 HTAFC

Veteran Member
Joined
18 Dec 2012
Messages
17,624
Location
Another planet...
It has grown massively since the 90s, but whether that is classed as "recent" is all relative. Certainly in the mid-to-late 2000s there seemed to be a new development springing up every week.

Locals pre-electrification could be anything from a heritage unit to a 155, but a Pacer would be very likely.
 

nw1

Established Member
Joined
9 Aug 2013
Messages
6,865
It has grown massively since the 90s, but whether that is classed as "recent" is all relative. Certainly in the mid-to-late 2000s there seemed to be a new development springing up every week.

Yes, I suppose relative to 1991 (the date of the video) or 1989 (the date I visited the area) is what I meant.
 

Neptune

Established Member
Joined
29 May 2018
Messages
2,445
Location
Yorkshire
Locals pre-electrification could be anything from a heritage unit to a 155, but a Pacer would be very likely.
155’s are probably the rarest units at Outwood to be fair. 1st gen DMU’s, 141, 142, 144, 150 & occasionally 156 the most likely pre electrification units on locals.
 

61653 HTAFC

Veteran Member
Joined
18 Dec 2012
Messages
17,624
Location
Another planet...
155’s are probably the rarest units at Outwood to be fair. 1st gen DMU’s, 141, 142, 144, 150 & occasionally 156 the most likely pre electrification units on locals.
They certainly are now since they moved to Hull, and weren't common even when new as they tended to be concentrated on the Calder Valley. In any case, I'd meant to type 156s but was suffering from fat finger syndrome!
 

Neptune

Established Member
Joined
29 May 2018
Messages
2,445
Location
Yorkshire
They certainly are now since they moved to Hull, and weren't common even when new as they tended to be concentrated on the Calder Valley. In any case, I'd meant to type 156s but was suffering from fat finger syndrome!
Haha. We all suffer that from time to time.

I have worked a 155 on a Dearne Valley stopper in Serco/Abellio days but it was one return trip and then replaced.

I’ve also worked one on a Nottingham although it was the summer when Notts was closed so it was a Langley Mill terminator and shunt to Toton and back. Both obviously with Leeds drivers.

Sheffield crews have never signed them which is why they have never been diagrammed to Sheffield.

They can and indeed do appear passing Outwood now if working a Knottingley via Wakefield service but don’t stop.
 

contrex

Member
Joined
19 May 2009
Messages
862
Location
St Werburghs, Bristol
How did the guard manage to get through a 10HAP or 12HAP formation of the kind that ran on certain peak services on the South Western in the 80s? Did fare-dodgers target such trains?
In my youth in the SUB - EPB - HAP era, on-train ticket checks were unknown. A "North Dulwich to Tulse Hill or West Norwood" single was as good as an inner-zone rover, as long as you didn't try to pass any barriers, and ended your tour at one of the named stations. Ah, summer Saturdays in 1965!
 
Last edited:

theblackwatch

Established Member
Joined
15 Feb 2006
Messages
10,714
Great memories but just a small point. 162 did re-enter service with the MBS from 134 which in turn became the NL Xmas tree.

Looking back at my records, 308134 went to Railcare (as it was at the time) at Glasgow, presumably as a spares donor for the 308 overhaul programme that was carried out there, after a while at NL as their 'Xmas tree'. I have 308162 down as arriving at Railcare for 'electrical fire damage' attention in December 1999, and, as you mention, it returned to service in 2000 with the MBSO of 308134.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Top