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Coventry to Nuneaton stations go-ahead

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james60059

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My mate lives 5 minutes from the Ricoh and works at Bermuda Park, same as me and says he'll use the train if its conveniently timed (he currently uses the bus).
 

wasi

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Surely Coventry will be back at the Ricoh next season????

As others have said would be a massive bonus for the service.
 

pt_mad

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Is the bay and additional train per hour not part of phase 1?

http://www.warwickshire.gov.uk/nuckle

Surely all this is pointless if they can't put on 2 trains per hour?


The way the Nuneaton connection is timed at the moment people often continue on to Rugby from Tamworth, LTV and Atherstone instead of changing at Nun for Coventry.
 

DarloRich

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Where LM get the stock from is a different matter.

They could take the 153 off us on the Marston vale and let us have 2 x 150. That would mean taking the 150 of the Hereford line and transferring it away leaving one on depot for work.

Solved it AND got my self better train! ;)

(Can they juggle workings to cover the loss of a 150 on Hereford runs? Do the new 350's free anything up?)
 

Minilad

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They could take the 153 off us on the Marston vale and let us have 2 x 150. That would mean taking the 150 of the Hereford line and transferring it away leaving one on depot for work.

Solved it AND got my self better train! ;)

(Can they juggle workings to cover the loss of a 150 on Hereford runs? Do the new 350's free anything up?)

323's I believe. Not sure they will get to Hereford mind you ;)
 

LesF

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There's a lot of misunderstanding here. This week's announcement with a photo of Patrick McLoughlin and the Nuneaton MP is just a bit of electioneering. The two new stations at Arena and Bermuda were already committed. There is no stock to provide the extra hourly service until electrification elsewhere releases some. A bit of signalling is needed but the tenders were sky high because the industry is awash with work and doesn't need such a tiddler. The hourly LM that reverses at Cov will continue to L Spa when the line is doubled and electrified as part of the Electric Spine, serving Kenilworth's new station. There is no chance of more services crossing WCML at Cov to get from L Spa to Nuneaton until a flyover is built at Cov. It would be entirely on railway land, below the level of Spencer Park adjacent (apart from the OLE) and cause little disruption to services during construction, compared to a "dive under" that would mean digging up WMCL for months. When the stock is available, an old train will be stored at Coventry north yard and brought out for events at the Arena. Arena station isn't for a once-a-week event. It's for the reasons contributors gave, plus giving access to the network for the 100,000 people who live in the north of Cov, many of whom currently drive to Tile Hill station. The slow progress is frustrating but I believe we'll get everything we want eventually, with the Electric Spine giving a boost in about 3 year's time. Then I'll go for a Coventry east station and Warwick Uni rail ring.
 

The Planner

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. The hourly LM that reverses at Cov will continue to L Spa when the line is doubled and electrified as part of the Electric Spine, serving Kenilworth's new station. There is no chance of more services crossing WCML at Cov to get from L Spa to Nuneaton until a flyover is built at Cov.

Ummm, doesn't that contradict itself straight away? I agree with the second bit in that currently you won't get anything more across Cov as it currently stands and even with electric spine you still won't unless you recast the Coventry corridor. At the risk of having to put it in my signature Kenilworth is purely a Coventry to Leamington shuttle ending up in the up bay at Leamington via a new crossover.

It would be entirely on railway land, below the level of Spencer Park adjacent (apart from the OLE) and cause little disruption to services during construction, compared to a "dive under" that would mean digging up WMCL for months.

Got a source for that? that is pie in the sky at the moment and not in any plans.

The slow progress is frustrating but I believe we'll get everything we want eventually, with the Electric Spine giving a boost in about 3 year's time. Then I'll go for a Coventry east station and Warwick Uni rail ring.

Good luck with that one, Kenilworth isn't until the back end of 16 and anything else won't be for a good while after. From what I understand no one has even decided what is required between Coventry and Leamington yet, partial or the whole whack including the big job of sorting out the single bit just north of Kenilworth.
 

Qwerty133

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They could take the 153 off us on the Marston vale and let us have 2 x 150. That would mean taking the 150 of the Hereford line and transferring it away leaving one on depot for work.

Solved it AND got my self better train! ;)

(Can they juggle workings to cover the loss of a 150 on Hereford runs? Do the new 350's free anything up?)
More likely, that you'll get the 153 off Cov/Nun, and it'll get your 150 and the 150 off Hereford services, which I think was the original plan.
 

Class 170101

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I can't see the 153 leaving the Bedford services. Operational reasons. Bletchley Depot when under Silverlink only had 150s so only knowing 150s was all that was needed. Now under London Midland they also have 153s these are similar to 150s and retaining knowledge of these will be ideal particularly if in the result of unit failures of 150s only 153s are available to keep the service running vice cancellation or bustitution.
 

LesF

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The Planner:
The LM that reverses at Cov already crosses the tracks to go into plat 4 - and sits there awaiting its return run. It will be no trouble to send it on to L Spa and back. An extra set may be needed.
The Coventry flyover is my idea, in place of the "dive-under" suggested by others that would mean closing the main line for months. Fairly painless: uses plat 4 and a new turnout west of Warwick Road where a siding was taken out in WCRM, rising up the cutting, under the footbridge that would be raised, past the big cable gantry, over the tracks without removing any gantries, and down the cutting to the Nuneaton line. One track with bidirectional signalling. All northbound traffic would use it. Southbound traffic at the discretion of the signaller.
Redoubling the track north of Kenilworth is only complicated by the single track being in the middle of the trackbed so it has to be slewed to fit the second track. South of Ken there is a bit that was never double. Whether it gets doubled depends on demand. A stretch south of Cov was redoubled about 10 years ago as far as Gibbet Hill and more can be done incrementally as demand grows.
 

The Planner

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The LM idea only works in the peaks, the rest of the day they don't terminate and go on to Northampton. Surely the issue at Kenilworth is north of the loop where the Coventry cut off diverged, the general consensus being that it was never double in the first place?
 

LesF

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Sorry The Planner, you're right on both points. If HS2 really would "free up paths for more local services" then the conflict of trains from B'ham crossing the line at Coventry to go to L Spa would remain, even if Cov-B'ham were 4-tracked as proposed by Centro. In that case the proposed flyover would need a connection from the B'ham up track. It would be a very busy flyover! But it may never be built bearing in mind that HS2 claim a saving on the existing network of £8.3bn by CUTTING existing services. Do I know you?

Class 170101, 153's don't have to be used. Any old diesel will do to get the second hourly service running prior to electrification.
 

The Planner

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Birmingham to Coventry will never be 4 tracked with HS2 happening. It was only ever going to be Stechford to Beechwood Tunnel anyway, Centro will quietly forget about that one!
 

bussnapperwm

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Is the bedworth line, as it is, cleared for class 172s, even if it's only the 2 car SDO units? Reason I ask is eventually something must happen to the 153s, either reforming them or losing quite a few seats to a disabled toilet. Therefore what I am suggesting stock wise is send all 3 150s to Bletchley, cascade the 153s out of London midland to form more 155s for Northern and have the 172/1s from Chiltern (Chiltern gaining the 172/0s once GOBLIN gets electrified.

As an aside, does anyone know what depot crews the Bedworth line?
 

pt_mad

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So are we saying in theory that two 150s could be made available for a half hourly service from Nun - Cov in the future?
 

Cherry_Picker

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It's ten miles from end to end. If the linespeed were high enough then they could probably reduce the journey time by enough to have a half hourly service with the existing stock and crew.
 

LesF

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I've looked at one set providing 2 tph but it's difficult. I think it's more like 12 miles Cov-Nun and the linespeed is only 45mph, probably due to signalling rather than track. That may be cured by the electric spine - when it comes. A driver told me there's a lower limit (25mph?) on the Spon End viaduct. That may have been temporary. Let's try 75mph, 2 mins/station stop. That's 10 mins travel plus 6 mins stops making 16 mins each way. Doesn't work. Even 90mph = 8 mins + 6 mins stops leaves only 1 minute for the driver to have a pee and sprint to the other end of the train. Electric stock could reduce the station stops to 1.5 mins, leaving 2.5 mins to reverse at the terminals. Well, maybe, but not in the short term.
 

Senex

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The Planner:
Redoubling the track north of Kenilworth is only complicated by the single track being in the middle of the trackbed so it has to be slewed to fit the second track. South of Ken there is a bit that was never double. Whether it gets doubled depends on demand. A stretch south of Cov was redoubled about 10 years ago as far as Gibbet Hill and more can be done incrementally as demand grows.

Is that correct? I thought it was the section from Leamington to Kenilworth Junction that was once double, along with Gibbet Hill to Coventry, and that Kenilworth Junction to Gibbet Hill has always been single.
 

The Planner

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I've looked at one set providing 2 tph but it's difficult. I think it's more like 12 miles Cov-Nun and the linespeed is only 45mph, probably due to signalling rather than track. That may be cured by the electric spine - when it comes.
Nope, it was resignalled to higher than that (2007 i think?) just no justification for a higher linespeed. Electric spine wont do anything to the signalling as it is too new and whats there now will allow a fairly sizeable increase in traffic.

A driver told me there's a lower limit (25mph?) on the Spon End viaduct. That may have been temporary. Let's try 75mph, 2 mins/station stop. That's 10 mins travel plus 6 mins stops making 16 mins each way. Doesn't work. Even 90mph = 8 mins + 6 mins stops leaves only 1 minute for the driver to have a pee and sprint to the other end of the train. Electric stock could reduce the station stops to 1.5 mins, leaving 2.5 mins to reverse at the terminals. Well, maybe, but not in the short term.

Spon End is 20 I think and wont be remedied any time soon as it will cost too much. You would never get to 75, let alone 90, inbetween station stops even with an electric as they are too close and you need 6 minutes for a LM turnaround. It needs two units simple as.
 

Class 170101

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Could one have a two an hour service with the electric spine if the Birmingham to Coventry service interworked with the Coventry to Nuneaton service perhaps?
 

The Planner

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There is no Birmingham Coventry service outside of the peaks. It needs two units to work.
 

LesF

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http://signallingnotices.org.uk/scans//3200/NR LNW 56 Notice.pdf dated 2009 re the resignalling of Cov-Nun suggests at the end that the linespeed will remain mainly 45mph. Spon viaduct is as The Planner says 20mph both ways according to NetRail's 2009 doc, while the driver told me it only applies in one direction.
The mileage Cov-Nun is as Cherry Picker said 10 miles. I'll have to stop guessing! At 75mph that's 8 mins + 6 mins at intermediate stations + 6 mins turnround = 20 min. One set cannot provide 2tph, but an increased linespeed would allow 2 sets to provide a service every 20 mins. That's better than having trains standing at stations for long periods, occupying the platforms.
 

Martin_1981

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What is the likelihood of reinstating some form of access from the Coventry Line to the Leicester line which was removed in 2003 as part of the Nuneaton remodelling? The Coventry-Nuneaton trains could then be extended onto Leicester and/or Nottingham, as they were prior to 2003. This would probably assist in reducing overcrowding on the Leicester-Birmingham route.

Could also prove a useful diversionary route for XC services between the North East and South Coast when Birmingham-Derby is closed for engineering works.
 
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