Cross Country Service Reductions and Alterations, 28-11-2021 onwards

[dk1]

The only thing about my employment that is frustrating is the lack of train or a seat to sit on to get me there. My terms of employment are fantastic thanks. And because of that when there is a crisis I am more than happy to go the extra mile.

What about passengers work life balance? The customers who pay your high salaries?

Not that old chestnut again.

 

[Class 170101]

It should be noted of course that a union can agree RDW but it doesn't mean the individuals of that union want to do it so there could still be a problem.

 

[dk1]

It should be noted of course that a union can agree RDW but it doesn't mean the individuals of that union want to do it so there could still be a problem.

It wouldn’t cause an issue as such as all Rest Day Working is completely voluntary.

 

[NEDdrv]

Let’s try and keep this civil.

The agreement expired this week, having already been extended by around a month. What isn’t clear:

1) was there a proposal by either XC or ASLEF to roll over the agreement on existing terms?, or,

2) did XC or ASLEF propose a different set of terms to agree to RDW, and if so what were they?


Personally, I find it odd that there needs to be an agreement between company and staff that enables individual staff to work extra shifts. I think most people who do rostered work in other industries will think similarly; there was certainly no need for an agreement in the other three industries I have worked in where I worked a roster. If you wanted to do extra shifts, you let the managers know and they called you in when required. But that’s my view.

The agreement normally does roll over but there have been lots of occasions lately when the rostering department have not adhered to the agreement even after it was brought up at meetings between ASLEF and the company. The outcome being an extension was not granted.

 

[bramling]

I agree. In many industries the people who just turn up and do their contracted hours are still seen as "unhelpful" whereas if everyone turned up and did what they should then the businesses wouldn't have to be so reliant on overtime.

Absolutely. In my experience the “no overtime” people tend to be the ones who will ultra reliably be in for what they’re contracted to do, and will be conscientious when they’re there. Labelling them as “unhelpful” or “awkward” simply turns the workplace toxic.

 

[181]

The other question which I don't think has yet been answered in detail is:

With 50٪ service cuts already where did all the drivers go?

This:

Some of our diagrams have been reduced in length due to COVID, mess room capacity at various locations, so a 50% reduction in train service does not equate to 50% less drivers.

touches on it, but it's hard to understand how Covid measures could make such a big difference (maybe at the height of lockdown and restrictions they could have, but less so now).

 

[Bletchleyite]

Absolutely. In my experience the “no overtime” people tend to be the ones who will ultra reliably be in for what they’re contracted to do, and will be conscientious when they’re there. Labelling them as “unhelpful” or “awkward” simply turns the workplace toxic.

I always question the need for out of hours working, and so have occasionally been labelled "shop steward" perjoratively by some people in the past. I similarly pretty much always take an hour for lunch as I believe it improves my afternoon productivity. But I am happy to work either when it is actually, genuinely necessary. I just don't like "presenteeism culture", it should be about efficiency of work, not long hours.

That is in an office context, though, which differs from the railway.

 

[vdriud]

The other question which I don't think has yet been answered in detail is:

This:

touches on it, but it's hard to understand how Covid measures could make such a big difference (maybe at the height of lockdown and restrictions they could have, but less so now).

Surely the drivers are still employed though? If some are off from covid etc then call up the reserves who were driving the services. It makes no sense at all.

Have XC stopped recruiting so numbers have dropped naturally and not been replaced?

 

[Class 170101]

It wouldn’t cause an issue as such as all Rest Day Working is completely voluntary.

Correct but whether sanctioned or not if no driver / guard wants to work on a specific Sunday (for example) then RDW agreement or not then there could be a coverage issue still.

 

[dk1]

Absolutely. In my experience the “no overtime” people tend to be the ones who will ultra reliably be in for what they’re contracted to do, and will be conscientious when they’re there. Labelling them as “unhelpful” or “awkward” simply turns the workplace toxic.

The same applies to those who don’t want to attend the Christmas Party or a get together in many working environments. Tantamount to bullying people to tow the line & become team players in far more outreaching ways than just their job description. It’s okay to say ‘no thanks’.

 

[Bald Rick]

Because it’s an effective way to bargain short of balloting for industrial action & keeps unity. It also can include counter agreements such as leave. For example at my depot the first 4 drivers to ask for a days leave are guaranteed to get them granted regardless of whether or not the roster clerk can cover their turn. This privilege is withdrawn as soon as the RDW agreement no longer stands.

It wouldn’t cause an issue as such as all Rest Day Working is completely voluntary.

That’s exactly my point - as RDW is completely voluntary, why the need for an agreement?

The other question which I don't think has yet been answered in detail is:

With 50٪ service cuts already where did all the drivers go?

There aren’t 50% service cuts. Cross Country is running something like 80% of its service.

 

[dk1]

That’s exactly my point - as RDW is completely voluntary, why the need for an agreement?

As I said because it’s a bargaining tool & there are benefits for the membership too from management such as guaranteed leave. Otherwise it would be like headless chickens. A union rep is also released on a regular basis to monitor & count to allow a fair booking out procedure for those wishing to work. It’s an easy way when working at a depot to easily spot the overtime kings & queens.

 

[NEDdrv]

The other question which I don't think has yet been answered in detail is:

This:

touches on it, but it's hard to understand how Covid measures could make such a big difference (maybe at the height of lockdown and restrictions they could have, but less so now).

Some drivers will have retired, training delayed due to COVID, messroom capacity is in line with industry practice. remember what happened to GWR not that long ago when COVID hit at a depot and spread like wildfire.

 

[PupCuff]

Surely the drivers are still employed though? If some are off from covid etc then call up the reserves who were driving the services. It makes no sense at all.

Have XC stopped recruiting so numbers have dropped naturally and not been replaced?

There's numerous problems across the industry currently, most of which aren't exclusive to XC.

Lots of drivers at some companies are teetering on retirement age and covid has drastically slowed down opportunities to train new ones.

Covid of course has directly affected staff and sickness as a result remains high.

Around Christmas there's typically a significant rise in antisocial behaviour and assault/abuse, meaning it can be offputting to crews to work overtime, particularly at weekends.

The current National Rail Contracts put lots of additional requirements on financial control on train operators. In some cases this has included recruitment freezes (I don't know whether that has happened at XC), but it does affect activities across the businesses which then have to find ways to adapt to reduce the impact on the service delivery to customers.

Some of the rail trade unions across different companies are - completely coincidentally - raising disputes over things like being asked to use certain smartphone apps, requiring three guards on certain trains rather than one, and railway managers being qualified as train conductors to keep the services running if there's a shortage.

There's probably a million and one other specific issues that I could find if I really wanted to, but what I'm trying to get across is that we can't just blame train drivers for where the industry is at, it needs commitment at every level from the station cleaner to the managing director to ask themselves what they can do and how they can adapt to do what the vast majority of rail staff want to do and deliver a great customer service.

 

[181]

There aren’t 50% service cuts. Cross Country is running something like 80% of its service.

Interesting. It definitely looks as if the inter-city type routes are at about half the pre-Covid frequency (or even less between Reading and Southampton); presumably other routes have been more normal until now.

 

[Goldfish62]

There aren’t 50% service cuts. Cross Country is running something like 80% of its service.

What? How can that be the case with the South Coast to Newcastle and SW to Manchester services completely withdrawn?

 

[dk1]

What? How can that be the case with the South Coast to Newcastle and SW to Manchester services completely withdrawn?

Is it balanced top heavy by the full service that was reintroduced on the 170 routes? That would boost the overall figures that even then do sound artificially high.

 

[Bald Rick]

What? How can that be the case with the South Coast to Newcastle and SW to Manchester services completely withdrawn?

Cardiff - Birmingham - Nottingham, and Birmingham - Leicester - Stansted are more or less at pre Covid service levels. And IIRC there are a handful of ‘extra’ services above the hourly frequency on the NE/NE-SE/SW routes

As I said because it’s a bargaining tool

That becomes a bit circular - “we need an agreement as a bargain tool to make agreements”. As I said, I don’t understand it.

 

[Efini92]

I get paid less than a train driver but if I have to deliver a project and work late/weekends (unpaid) i do what I have to do to get it over the line.

The amount drivers are paid I would expect you to be highly flexible and go the extra mile at all times.

You guys need to get in the real world!

Or you need to join the railway…

 

[dk1]

That becomes a bit circular - “we need an agreement as a bargain tool to make agreements”. As I said, I don’t understand it.

No you don’t seem to but trust me it has worked very successfully for both sides for decades now.

 

[vdriud]

That’s exactly my point - as RDW is completely voluntary, why the need for an agreement?








There aren’t 50% service cuts. Cross Country is running something like 80% of its service.

On the Bristol to Birmingham corridor we have lost our half hourly service to hourly. That is a 50% cut. What has happened to these drivers? XC should be overstaffed right now not understaffed. There should be no need for rest day working with at least 20% of drivers spare?

Its all very odd.

 

[Bald Rick]

On the Bristol to Birmingham corridor we have lost our half hourly service to hourly. That is a 50% cut. What has happened to these drivers? XC should be overstaffed right now not understaffed. There should be no need for rest day working with at least 20% of drivers spare?

Its all very odd.

Some of them are driving Cardiff - Nottingham trains...

Plus higher absence levels, training backlog, and the usual December resource squeeze.

 

[dk1]

On the Bristol to Birmingham corridor we have lost our half hourly service to hourly. That is a 50% cut. What has happened to these drivers? XC should be overstaffed right now not understaffed. There should be no need for rest day working with at least 20% of drivers spare?

Its all very odd.

They appear to have coped very badly with training during the pandemic.compare that with my TOC that has passed out a record number of new drivers & doubled the amount of driver instructors.

Don’t forget that you can have a dozen drivers spare at a depot but if it’s just 1 minute over the say 3 hour shift movement off their spare time, it will automatically go to a driver who is rest day available & can catch that job.

 

[vdriud]

Some of them are driving Cardiff - Nottingham trains...

Plus higher absence levels, training backlog, and the usual December resource squeeze.

So where are the Nottingham to Cardiff drivers? The service is still hourly as it was before and these seem to be taking the big brunt of the cancellations.

They appear to have coped very badly with training during the pandemic.compare that with my TOC that has passed out a record number of new drivers & doubled the amount of driver instructors.

Don’t forget that you can have a dozen drivers spare at a depot but if it’s just 1 minute over the say 3 hour shift movement off their spare time, it will automatically go to a driver who is rest day available & can catch that job.

Your TOC sounds very well and professionally run. Good to hear.

That is quite an interesting rule, what is the benefit of this? Is it safety/fatigue related?

 

[dk1]

So where are the Nottingham to Cardiff drivers? The service is still hourly as it was before and these seem to be taking the big brunt of the cancellations.


Your TOC sounds very well and professionally run. Good to hear.

That is quite an interesting rule, what is the benefit of this? Is it safety/fatigue related?

Every depot is slightly different but we can only be moved 3 hours either way from our spare datum time. So if I was 08:15 spare & another driver was 10:30 spare but the jobs going where 05:05, 09:20 & 13:55, the only job I could catch is the 09:20 as it’s a 3 hour movement each way. Therefore I am closer so as long as I sign route & traction I will get that turn. The 10:30 spare driver could do the 09:20 but I’m closer so I get it. Neither of us can pick up the 05:05 or 13:55 turns so these would be offered to a driver on their rest day.

Thanks for the training comment. It has been done very safely & very successfully. A credit to some of our driver managers in pulling it all together & the DIs & trainees for compliance & effort.

 

[Bald Rick]

So where are the Nottingham to Cardiff drivers? The service is still hourly as it was before and these seem to be taking the big brunt of the cancellations.

See the second sentence of my post.

Your TOC sounds very well and professionally run. Good to hear.

GA have done a great job - but have been a little fortunate. They recruited a number of extra drivers pre-Covi£ to deal with a big training workload for the new fleet, and the extra services they were due to run.

Then the new fleet was late, and the extra services aren’t going to run. So they have more drivers on the books than they need for the level of service they are running. They were also the trial TOC for driver training in the Covid environment, so got ahead of the pack.

 

[O L Leigh]

So where are the Nottingham to Cardiff drivers? The service is still hourly as it was before and these seem to be taking the big brunt of the cancellations.

You're missing the point.

Birmingham to Cardiff was always 1 tph, but Birmingham to Nottingham was 2 tph. The same was the case on the Stansted route, with 2 tph to Leicester and 1 tph beyond. Both of these routes were reduced during the pandemic to 1tph throughout but have now been restored to their former frequencies.

That certain service are taking the brunt of cancellations should indicate to you where the problems lie. There is a big depot in the Midlands that has been under-complement for quite some considerable time due to various reasons. This has never been fully addressed and it is likely to take some years to deal. The core of the problem is that the company cannot keep up with the rate of people leaving, primarily due to retirement. Although it is still taking qualified drivers from elsewhere, this depot is still going to need a large influx of trainees to meet the demand. This hasn't been helped by the greater burden of the work diagrammed since the pandemic falling onto this depot while others have seen their jobs cut back.

The Covid pandemic has had a big impact on training, and not just for new starters. Route and traction training has been similarly affected due to the restrictions imposed on the number of people who can share a driving cab. In ideal circumstances it would take a driver roughly 12 months to pass out during which time they are classed as non-productive (in other words, they are unable to cover their own work). This is the case also for drivers who are route-learning or undergoing traction training. What this means in practice is that every driver undergoing training represents one additional job that requires cover. This is also the case where drivers are non-productive for other reasons not related to training.

Even while there was an agreement for rest-day working, even with the reduced service on some routes, XC was only just getting by. All spares were used and allocated together with rest-day volunteers, but there was still a daily need for additional people to come in and cover work. There has also been judicious use of cross-cover between depots and even reallocation of drivers on the day.

If a company is supposed to cut it's coat according to it's cloth, this is how much the coat can cover when all the elastic has been taken out. You're wrong to suggest that 50% of the drivers have disappeared off the books because you don't see what the situation has been within the company and how it has been covering all the work thus far. From a staffing perspective, XC is under-resourced due to the number of unfilled vacancies and number of non-productive drivers. Therefore, knowing the extent to which they have been reliant on the goodwill of their staff to come in and work on their days off, they have had to plan for cancellations and make them known in advance. Resourcing the service based on a known quantity is far better for everyone (including the passengers) than promising a full service at the start of each day and then making short-notice cancellations as the day goes on.

So you see, it's not as simple as you seem to think.

 

[Horizon22]

Surely the drivers are still employed though? If some are off from covid etc then call up the reserves who were driving the services. It makes no sense at all.

Have XC stopped recruiting so numbers have dropped naturally and not been replaced?

What "reserves"? Your posts seem to have a fundemantal misunderstanding of the driver situation (and of contractual/legal obligations regarding pay/rest etc). Many train companies (TOCs) are recruiting drivers all the time on a rolling basis - most TOCs have "workforce planning" teams that look at roles like drivers/guards and understand and predict when a driver recruitment drive might be required (considering training periods of up to 12+ months for a train driver and several months for a guard). The rail industry also applies "talent pools" that should there for some reason be unexpected vacancies (and not many people leave train driving), they have someone they can get in post relatively quickly without the rigmarole of a full on recruitment driver. Obviously Covid threw all of this out of the window.

Firstly and initially many recruitment processes were put on hold (albeit briefly) around Covid as the situation was all completely unknown. Those already in training and/or the recruitment process(and each TOC had varying numbers depending on what stage of the recruitment process they were in) basically had to be put on hold indefinitely. Drivers need a certain number of in-cab hours with a driver indstructor (DI) to become competent - that was all indefinitely cancelled at the beginning of the pandemic. At the same time, service reductions were mandated so drivers that "sign" different routes may have lost competence in certain areas that went along less frequently. And people still continued to retire at a normal (and sometimes higher rate). Others have left naturally or moved to other companies which has caused disproprtionate responses. And lets not forget drivers are not superhuman and they (and their family & friends) are also subject to many of the restrictions and fall out from infection / isolation / pings etc.

All-in-all its led to a signifcant backlog of drivers at many places (some are who in position but need practical handling). Many were stuck at home only able to do theory. Once in-cab training was allowed again (approximately 12-15 months later), there's a bottleneck with all these drivers now ready to get a DI, but there's only so many DIs who are willing to do the role and capable. That is a separate issue in itself and I have simplified some of the details above which I won't go into fully here but you can I hope you can appreciate how this has all happened.

Shortages have happened in many other industries too, but they often don't have as stringent & strict training requirements. This is getting better and I would hope by early next year, many of these backlog due to Covid will have been significantly reduced. I can't speak for the RDW agreement but ultimately its "overtime" - people don't want to do it forever and not be properly reimbursed (ultimately its a choice) but the railway also has to look at costs. The only real solution will be a full 7-day inclusive working week and that's a battle for another day I imagine...

 

[talltim]

Can't help feeling XC should have concentrated on getting more drivers trained up on HSTs. Not being able to run some Yoyagers is better than not being able to run HSTs when you consider that it takes a double set that includes a 5 car unit to have greater capacity.

 

[43096]

There aren’t 50% service cuts. Cross Country is running something like 80% of its service.

They're not. On the "traditional" XC service it's 1tph from Manchester (down from 2), 1tph from the Oxford corridor (down from 2), 1tph from Plymouth/Bristol (down from 2), 1tph from Newcastle (down from 2). So on the core legs, I make that 50% of the pre-Covid timetable - basically back to the pre-Pumpkin days, just with worse connections at New Street. Overall, it's probably a bit more than 50%, but no way is it 80% or anything like it.