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Different Driver Depot, Route and Traction cards

craigybagel

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The latter is rather a shame - in the process, Chester to Crewe, and Crewe/Stafford to Birmingham lose their first train of the day and vice versa the last train of the day. Oh well!
The Chester - Crewe leg is being maintained by starting the first Crewe - Milford Haven back from Chester in the same path (it used to run ECS from there anyway) but I agree the others will be a loss, especially to the numerous rail staff who used it to commute to work. But operationally it was a nightmare with so few drivers signing it now, and it served very little purpose as a useful diversionary route.
That's putting in generously! "Ooh, double Birmingham today" :lol:
The exciting days are when they go to Tysley! I know a fair few there though and they all seem pretty happy with their lot.
 
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JJ4

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Such maps can be misleading. The only service from Shrewsbury towards Birmingham that extends beyond Birmingham New Street/International is the daily Avanti service to London. WMR only operate Shrewsbury-Birmingham New Street services.

For a driver to be allowed to drive a train, they must have received training in both the traction (the type of unit/locomotive used) and the route. In most cases they will have to have driven that traction, and driven over that route, within the previous 6 months.

Route knowledge involves drivers learning things such as the name and location of all the stations on the line, the names and arrangement of the tracks, the type of signalling system used, line speeds, platform lengths, gradients, tunnels, bridges and other notable features. Basically they need to know the route like the back of their hand, to the extent that they know exactly where they are and where they need to start braking, even if it's night time and there is thick fog.

Obviously those requirements, as well as limits on shift length, breaks etc. amongst other factors, dictate what it makes sense for drivers at different depots to be trained on.

Therefore, WMR Shrewsbury drivers are only taught on the route between Shrewsbury and Birmingham, with a diversionary route via Bescot. The guide at the start of this thread illustrates this as follows:


The only other drivers at WMR who have knowledge of the line to Shrewsbury are Wolverhampton drivers:


Hope this helps?
This was a huge help, thank you. I have my DMI coming up for WMT, so wanted to be up to speed on the current routes but got a bit confused by it all. Thank you for clarifying.
 

Watershed

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but I agree the others will be a loss, especially to the numerous rail staff who used it to commute to work.
Indeed. It always had a decent number of passenger - even if not necessarily public fare payers - on the occasions I took it. Surprisingly well patronised for a "ghost" train.
 

class 9

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From the May timetable change,Leeds XC Drivers will no longer sign Newcastle to Edinburgh.
 

Biscuit 56

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From the May timetable change,Leeds XC Drivers will no longer sign Newcastle to Edinburgh.
They have reorganised all their driver diagrams, resulting in a country wide surplus of 97 drivers, so some depots have lost routes.
Leeds as mentioned, Plymouth will no longer sign Paignton
 

craigybagel

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They have reorganised all their driver diagrams, resulting in a country wide surplus of 97 drivers, so some depots have lost routes.
Leeds as mentioned, Plymouth will no longer sign Paignton
Thanks, will add those to the list that need changing in May.
 

wobman

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Tfw losing crewe to Stafford
The Chester - Crewe leg is being maintained by starting the first Crewe - Milford Haven back from Chester in the same path (it used to run ECS from there anyway) but I agree the others will be a loss, especially to the numerous rail staff who used it to commute to work. But operationally it was a nightmare with so few drivers signing it now, and it served very little purpose as a useful diversionary route.

The exciting days are when they go to Tysley! I know a fair few there though and they all seem pretty happy with their lot.
With Tfw losing the crewe to Stafford route it is yet another diversionary route lost, add that to the 2 Bescot diversions lost. Its short minded planning, as when things go wrong tfw can't divert its services around Birmingham and Wolverhampton...... I'm baffled how network rail let tfw run services to Birmingham with its traincrew not signing the diversions !
 

Watershed

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Network Rail can't dictate to TOCs what diversionary route knowledge they must have. It could be flagged at a TCRAG (Timetable Change Risk Assessment Group) meeting but if the TOC says they'll simply cancel services during disruption/engineering works... There's nothing that can really be done to stop them taking that approach.
 

craigybagel

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They have reorganised all their driver diagrams, resulting in a country wide surplus of 97 drivers, so some depots have lost routes.
Leeds as mentioned, Plymouth will no longer sign Paignton

Also as part of the same changes New St will lose Cambridge - Stansted
Interesting - is this all a sign that the current reduced service at XC is likely to go on for the long term? And are there any other cuts in route knowledge for other depots?
 

lammergeier

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Interesting - is this all a sign that the current reduced service at XC is likely to go on for the long term? And are there any other cuts in route knowledge for other depots?
Re. Service levels - no idea. As mentioned elsewhere the surplus is being carried forward for future service increases should they happen. There is actually an increase in the service in May.

No other depots are losing route knowledge, just the three mentioned in the thread.
 

Watershed

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Also as part of the same changes New St will lose Cambridge - Stansted
To be honest, I can kind of understand that one from a driver perspective - Birmingham to Stansted and back is a long old slog sat in the seat of a 170. I'm surprised it's considered more efficient to have Cambridge doing lots of extra Stansted shuttles, but...
 

Horizon22

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Can I kindly ask that if people wish to have further discussions regarding route knowledge changes (as opposed to providing an update) that they make a new thread in the main forum to allow this thread to remain a useful reference.
 

craigybagel

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Re. Service levels - no idea. As mentioned elsewhere the surplus is being carried forward for future service increases should they happen. There is actually an increase in the service in May.

No other depots are losing route knowledge, just the three mentioned in the thread.
Thank you, good to know. Will update along with the others on timetable change day.
 

tiptoptaff

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GWR Cardiff has had a bit of a rescope and will not actually sign HST or 158s when they get their digrams in two weeks time.

Route card isn't as full as listed either due to being understaffed and not all drivers sign all routes, but AIUI the plan is that by December all 24 (as will be) will sign the full card listed. Drivers who sign the routes listed already but work isn't given on it in May will be allowed to retain it pending a decision for December (usually have to lose it if no work in your link but being allowed to retain on the basis they should have work on it as an exception as the depot is new)

Discussions ongoing to have Canton added and 158s retained. But these are rumour so for now to be ignored.
 

craigybagel

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GWR Cardiff has had a bit of a rescope and will not actually sign HST or 158s when they get their digrams in two weeks time.

Route card isn't as full as listed either due to being understaffed and not all drivers sign all routes, but AIUI the plan is that by December all 24 (as will be) will sign the full card listed. Drivers who sign the routes listed already but work isn't given on it in May will be allowed to retain it pending a decision for December (usually have to lose it if no work in your link but being allowed to retain on the basis they should have work on it as an exception as the depot is new)

Discussions ongoing to have Canton added and 158s retained. But these are rumour so for now to be ignored.
Thank you. I've left the route card as is for now but removed HSTs and 158s.

I've also taken the time to do a bit of an update of some depots - I suspect that a lot of the info is already getting out of date! For example, I've deleted all references to 153s except from the two TOCs still stuck with the things, as well as a few other changes that I'm aware of, but I know there's going some other info in there that's already been superseded. I'm particularly worried about Northern and Scotrail as some of my source info for there is quite old, but if anyone can see any mistakes with any of the depots I'd be happy to update and fix.
 

MDB97

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Updates for Northern Trains LTD Carlisle Depot;

Both grades loosing Dumfries as of 17th May 2022.

Conductors:
Carlisle - Newcastle
Carlisle - Leeds
Newcastle - Morpeth
158 & 156

Drivers
Carlisle - Newcastle
Carlisle - Leeds
158 & 156
 

craigybagel

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Updates for Northern Trains LTD Carlisle Depot;

Both grades loosing Dumfries as of 17th May 2022.

Conductors:
Carlisle - Newcastle
Carlisle - Leeds
Newcastle - Morpeth
158 & 156

Drivers
Carlisle - Newcastle
Carlisle - Leeds
158 & 156
Thanks - I saw the rumour about that happening, good to see it confirmed.
 

GN Boy

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Great Northern amendments:

1) Hitchin sign Biggleswade to Peterborough

2) Hornsey Outer Link do not sign Finsbury Park to Three Bridges (yet)

3) Kings Cross now also sign 700s

4) Welwyn to have a TL and a GN link, with the former signing King’s Cross/Moorgate to Cambridge via Welwyn and Hertford and then Finsbury Park to Sevenoaks via Catford and Swanley. The GN link won’t sign the Sevenoaks section but will sign the same GN routes. Both links sign 717s and 700s.
 

craigybagel

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Great Northern amendments:

1) Hitchin sign Biggleswade to Peterborough

2) Hornsey Outer Link do not sign Finsbury Park to Three Bridges (yet)

3) Kings Cross now also sign 700s

4) Welwyn to have a TL and a GN link, with the former signing King’s Cross/Moorgate to Cambridge via Welwyn and Hertford and then Finsbury Park to Sevenoaks via Catford and Swanley. The GN link won’t sign the Sevenoaks section but will sign the same GN routes. Both links sign 717s and 700s.

Preston TPE now sign 802’s
Thanks, all updated.
 

iphone76

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Updates for MTR Elizabeth Line

Abbey Wood: (Now signs the entire route)
Now sign Abbey Wood to Reading

Gidea Park
Now sign Abbey Wood to Heathrow 4/5

Plumstead (Now signs the entire route)
Now sign Abbey Wood to Reading

Shenfield
Now sign from Hayes & Harlington to Heathrow T4/5
 

Horizon22

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Updates for MTR Elizabeth Line

Abbey Wood: (Now signs the entire route)
Now sign Abbey Wood to Reading

Gidea Park
Now sign Abbey Wood to Heathrow 4/5

Plumstead (Now signs the entire route)
Now sign Abbey Wood to Reading

Shenfield
Now sign from Hayes & Harlington to Heathrow T4/5

Is this the same info as you posted here? Is 315 competency disappearing considering the stock is pretty much gone?
 

craigybagel

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The lists have been updated today to take into account all the changes that came into effect with the timetable change over the weekend, along with a bit of general tidying. I've also incorporated the following changes at MTR since it's only a week to go.
From May 22, Old Oak Common, Abbey Wood and Plumstead depots will be all routes (Shenfield/Abbey Wood to Heathrow and Reading), Gidea Park and Shenfield depots will be Shenfield/Abbey Wood to Heathrow, Ilford depot will be Shenfield/Abbey Wood to Old Oak Common depot, and Maidenhead depot will be Abbey Wood to Heathrow/ Reading.
 

Grvrdvicdr

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Southeastern, faversham sign 377s, Charing Cross 707s and Victoria link 1 (selhurst link) sign to selhurt for ECS
 

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