First Aberdeen

[Volvodart]

It has never been officially confirmed that the other 10 potentially coming are double deckers. They seem to have gone out of their way to not say it in such a way as "another 10 are coming". The single deckers would be a lot more affordable with Aberdeen Council not having to pay a contribution for these 10.

 

[Jordan Adam]

It has never been officially confirmed that the other 10 potentially coming are double deckers. They seem to have gone out of their way to not say it in such a way as "another 10 are coming". The single deckers would be a lot more affordable with Aberdeen Council not having to pay a contribution for these 10.

You beat me to replying but you're right, some articles last year did state and allude that the further 10 would be double deckers but the wording was generally quite vague and the specific type has not been confirmed. All we really do know is another 10 are coming, they're from Wrightbus and intended for the 23.

The one thing that's always peed me off a bit with First Aberdeen is branding buses for a particular route then not sticking with those routes.

Even before Covid there were many examples of branded buses running on different route numbers.

Maybe it's a virgo pedantic thing and I know there are breakdowns etc. but it seems they got to a point where the branding was ignored. Why spend all that money and time on the special livery for the buses to be allocated anywhere?

The issue Aberdeen have had up until recently is that too many and often of the wrong type were branded. For example they had 15 Enviro500s branded for the 1/2. However on weekdays when the Uni Closed timetable is in place the 1/2 only required 17 buses and they'd often allocate 10 or so Artics on the 1/2 meaning that half of the branded E500s were surplus and ended up being used on other services. With repaints progressing fast the intention is to brand less E500s this time (possibly only 7 or 8) that way the problem should in theory be resolved.

Likewise with the 19, with AWPR opening making journey times faster and the frequency being reduced from 12 to 15 minutes the vehicle requirement of the 19 off peak went from 12 to 10, at the time this happened Aberdeen had 13 buses branded for the 19. 69357 was repainted a few months later but for around 2 years Aberdeen had 12 branded Geminis to cover 10 duties, there was an 11th duty that just operated in the morning peak however this was usually single decker operated.

The other reason is because of interworking, as an example two daytime buses on the 13 until recently used to worked on the 3 and 8 in the morning, while another works on to the 12 in the afternoon.

 

[Deltic1961]

Atricle in P&J about previous reliability of Hydrogen buses. Were First "forced" to take these on as another ACC vanity project?

First chief lifts lid on previous faulty fleet after £8.3m spent on new hydrogren buses for Aberdeen

Public transport chiefs say they are unconvinced about the benefits of hydrogen buses despite a multi-million-pound fleet being launched in Aberdeen. It's

www.pressandjournal.co.uk

Taking 10 minutes to charge, the new double deckers have a range of about 200 miles, meaning they should run morning, noon and night on the number 19 route – whereas the latest electric models would run out of juice.

Aberdeen’s involvement in the EU bus scheme is part of council efforts to make hydrogen power more competitively priced and more widely adopted, as Town House bosses view the green energy source as one of the city’s next big industries.

 

[Volvodart]

Stagecoach did not want them,so First had to take them! First probably got a good deal, in that they just pay the cost of a diesel double decker. The current zero emission buses funding from the Scottish Government for electric buses has the operator paying at least 25% of the additional cost of buses above their diesel equivalent plus 25% of the cost of infrastructure. They are maintaining them themselves, the previous ones were maintained by the council and Van Hool, so that may be an improvement. Wrightbus is likely to be more responsive than Van Hool as that was a very small part of their business.

 

[Jordan Adam]

The thing you need to remember with the Vanhools is that much of the reliability issues were not even related to the Hydrogen side of things but rather how non-standard they were. The perfect example being 64995 which spent most of 2017 off the road with a door defect. The only major issue with them was excessive use of the brakes draining the batteries causing them to cut out, that's why Stagecoach examples frequently broke down near Market Street. Part of the issue there was that the retarder was on a separate switch rather than directly linked to the pedal, so if the driver pushed the brake pedal it was only the brakes that were stopping the bus.

The roll out of the Streetdecks thus far has been much smoother and the technology has moved on significantly in the nearly 7 years between when the Vanhools and Streetdecks were built. 39713 was out from 06:30 to just after midnight on Friday so that does at least prove they can do a full 18 hour shift (unlike the previous Vanhools)

 

[scosutsut]

£500k a pop!?! I know this is emerging tech but did they invite Richard Hall over to spec them or something? That's at least a double premium!

No glass staircase or front upper deck side panels, so I guess more actually could have been spent.

Madness!

 

[RomeoCharlie71]

£500k a pop!?! I know this is emerging tech but did they invite Richard Hall over to spec them or something? That's at least a double premium!

No glass staircase or front upper deck side panels, so I guess more actually could have been spent.

Madness!

They are very much "poverty spec". No audio-visual announcements, Wi-Fi or USB ports either.

 

[JumpinTrainz]

I hope these prove reliable and that they are the first of many to arrive within First around Scotland.

The speck inside these buses seems to be on par with the 44*** series E200MMCs/Streetlites in Glasgow. Perhaps First wanted to scale down where they could until they proved their worth. Perhaps if there are more the spec may be more advanced.

 

[Jordan Adam]

The council set the specification not First. First will be retrofitting Wifi on them in the near future.

 

[Deltic1961]

You have to wonder if it's money well spent though. Although the project was put in place before the pandemic ACC are now going to be deep in the c**p financially.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

The cost of the vehicles is, naturally, very expensive given that it is evolving technology, and hence why it's been required to have external funding.

As for poverty spec, wifi is now becoming almost redundant. USBs is perhaps more of a surprising omission but perhaps not so important on shorter journeys. NSAs would certainly be one area that you'd expect though.

 

[JumpinTrainz]

The cost of the vehicles is, naturally, very expensive given that it is evolving technology, and hence why it's been required to have external funding.

As for poverty spec, wifi is now becoming almost redundant. USBs is perhaps more of a surprising omission but perhaps not so important on shorter journeys. NSAs would certainly be one area that you'd expect though.

I wouldn’t say WiFi is now becoming redundant. Buses and trains are just getting with it in terms of WiFi. Many people rely on it and it’s definitely a draw to using public transport especially for visitors to the country.

 

[Jordan Adam]

The cost of the vehicles is, naturally, very expensive given that it is evolving technology, and hence why it's been required to have external funding.

As for poverty spec, wifi is now becoming almost redundant. USBs is perhaps more of a surprising omission but perhaps not so important on shorter journeys. NSAs would certainly be one area that you'd expect though.

As noted above (although my post is yet to be approved so you won't have seen it at the time of posting.... ) Wifi is going to be getting refitted on them, the reason for the low spec is because the council specified them not First. Although i would agree with you, Wifi is somewhat redundant as many people now have contracts that provide unlimited data, in fact i can't recall the last time i used wifi on a bus! The lack of USBs is more surprising, especially given that the Culter end of the 19 is fairly long and some people could be spending 40-50 minutes on the bus.

 

[Volvodart]

The WiFi is supposed to be getting fitted by First's contractors. That may suggest that the non WIFI was down to the council rather than First.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

I wouldn’t say WiFi is now becoming redundant. Buses and trains are just getting with it in terms of WiFi. Many people rely on it and it’s definitely a draw to using public transport especially for visitors to the country.

Stagecoach has turned it off for their operations since Covid. As has been said by @Jordan Adam, the data provisions of mobile phones are now such that it is less of an issue.

 

[AndrewTaylor95]

I'm more surprised USBs aren't a feature on the Streetdecks. Council would've been as well to just standardise the interior like the Vanhools rather than it being First's, 19 in Aberdeen must be one of the longest routes as well.

 

[Jordan Adam]

I'm more surprised USBs aren't a feature on the Streetdecks. Council would've been as well to just standardise the interior like the Vanhools rather than it being First's, 19 in Aberdeen must be one of the longest routes as well.

The 19 isn't the longest route, it just seems that way because the Culter leg is quite long, however the Tillydrone end is quite short.

In terms of mileage the 17, 18 and X27 are all longer.

 

[Deltic1961]

Any updates on the reliability of the Streetdecks since they started in service?

 

[route101]

Bit off topic but they did make into the First Years. When were the Atlanteans retired in Aberdeen?

 

[Swanny200]

Bit off topic but they did make into the First Years. When were the Atlanteans retired in Aberdeen?

Been led to believe it was early 2001

 

[route101]

Been led to believe it was early 2001

Thanks, Do you know how old the buses were when they were retired or what registration year?

 

[Swanny200]

Thanks, Do you know how old the buses were when they were retired or what registration year?

No clue I'm afraid as I had left there by then, would imagine it would have been some of the X or V reg fleet so at least 20 years old.

 

[Jordan Adam]

Any updates on the reliability of the Streetdecks since they started in service?

Other than one or two minor teething issues that were to be expected (for example there was an issue with the heating which was fixed through a software update), they've been very reliable far more than i was expecting. They're now using them 18 hours and they've already made appearances on The Bridges, 3, 12, 23, X27 and school services in addition to the 19. Even on Sundays they're now using them on the 3.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

No clue I'm afraid as I had left there by then, would imagine it would have been some of the X or V reg fleet so at least 20 years old.

Think they might have included the X and Y regs of which some ended up in North Devon.... jeez...

 

[Swanny200]

Think they might have included the X and Y regs of which some ended up in North Devon.... jeez...

Were they in general service in Devon or were they converted to open toppers?

 

[GusB]

The last batch of Atlanteans were 331-345 (XSS331-345Y) and they definitely made it into First days. I moved away from Aberdeen in 2001 and I'm fairly certain they were still around, although numbers must have been fairly thin by then.

 

[Jordan Adam]

The last batch of Atlanteans were 331-345 (XSS331-345Y) and they definitely made it into First days. I moved away from Aberdeen in 2001 and I'm fairly certain they were still around, although numbers must have been fairly thin by then.

The last day of Atlantean service was the 30th March 2001. Same day the Y-RSA B10BLEs hit the roads.

There was also a commemorative parade down Union Street while they ran duplicates on the 19 with the new B10BLEs and outgoing Atlanteans.

Linked below are a few photos from that day:

Scotland - The PMP Film Archive

Buses in Scotland

pmpfilms.smugmug.com

Scotland - The PMP Film Archive

Buses in Scotland

pmpfilms.smugmug.com

 

[LAIRA]

Were they in general service in Devon or were they converted to open toppers?

They were used on school runs when they ended there days in Plymouth.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Were they in general service in Devon or were they converted to open toppers?

Frontline service!! (credit to photographers)

1010

First Western National 1010, URS328X, Leyland Atlantean with Alexander H45/29D body, ex Grampian 328, in Barnstaple Bus Station on 13 August 2001

www.flickr.com

1011 (2)

First Western National 1011, NRS307W, Leyland Atlantean with Alexander H45/29D body in Barnstaple Bus Station on 18 August 2001. Note Red Bus fleetnames

www.flickr.com

1012

First Western National 1012, XSS332Y, Leyland Atlantean with Alexander H45/29D body, ex Grampian 332, in Barnstaple Bus Station on 18 August 2001

www.flickr.com

First Western National (First Red Bus) 1009 (URS 327X)

One hell of an inter-group cascade: from Aberdeen all the way to Devon. Captured in Ilfracombe bus station on 25/06/2001, bound for the wonderfully-named Westward Ho! (with exclamation mark). I don't know who the invisible person the driver pointing to is, unless of course he's gesticulating...

www.flickr.com

First in Cornwall did receive the Grampian open toppers though

 

[Swanny200]

Frontline service!! (credit to photographers)

1010

First Western National 1010, URS328X, Leyland Atlantean with Alexander H45/29D body, ex Grampian 328, in Barnstaple Bus Station on 13 August 2001

www.flickr.com

1011 (2)

First Western National 1011, NRS307W, Leyland Atlantean with Alexander H45/29D body in Barnstaple Bus Station on 18 August 2001. Note Red Bus fleetnames

www.flickr.com

1012

First Western National 1012, XSS332Y, Leyland Atlantean with Alexander H45/29D body, ex Grampian 332, in Barnstaple Bus Station on 18 August 2001

www.flickr.com

First Western National (First Red Bus) 1009 (URS 327X)

One hell of an inter-group cascade: from Aberdeen all the way to Devon. Captured in Ilfracombe bus station on 25/06/2001, bound for the wonderfully-named Westward Ho! (with exclamation mark). I don't know who the invisible person the driver pointing to is, unless of course he's gesticulating...

www.flickr.com

First in Cornwall did receive the Grampian open toppers though

What were the people in North Devon used to before then that the Atlanteans replaced them. In all honesty, I loved them and thought they were good buses, but in 2001, I would have thought that they were showing their age.