Fort George OO Gauge Scottish Terminus/Junction Layout

[Cowley]

Maybe I should do that to my Lima Blue 20 I picked up for cheap last wk...

Do it Rich!

I remember years ago (when I had a bit of disposable income) walking into the model shop in Exeter and buying a pair of blue 20s which I then weathered. They looked great paired up on freight, but to my mind even better at the head of a rake of blue and grey mk1s.
Lovely.

 

[Peter C]

Thank you! Yes, that's a good point, I will give them a quick brush at some point.

Ah, he looks like me after a shift down t'pit ...I must watch the two railway episodes they did again

The BR Blue Class 20 became Scottish today. My first time doing transfers and it was actually okay to be fair. I recently saw a DRS Class 20 on a railtour with a Wessie on too, so I’m contemplating doing that loco as well on one side at least.

View attachment 123497

My apologies for not responding to this sooner @Iskra - I'm sure I'd said something when I saw it! What a lovely-looking engine. I've always found Class 20s to be a particularly interesting design: very reminiscent of a steam engine, I'd argue, with the cab at one end rather than at both ends (or even in the middle as on the Class 14s).

Loving the work you've been doing on the layout as well. Keep it up!

-Peter

 

[Iskra]

My apologies for not responding to this sooner @Iskra - I'm sure I'd said something when I saw it! What a lovely-looking engine. I've always found Class 20s to be a particularly interesting design: very reminiscent of a steam engine, I'd argue, with the cab at one end rather than at both ends (or even in the middle as on the Class 14s).

Loving the work you've been doing on the layout as well. Keep it up!

-Peter

Thanks Peter, yeah I like the lop-sided locomotives they have a bit of character about them.

 

[Iskra]

A few weeks ago, I had a crack at running a 1970's real Fort William timetable on Fort George. What this showed up, was that my track layout wasn't really up to the task for a number of reasons.

Thus, a number of track upgrades have taken place today:

- A set of points to allow Platform 2 to serve both the branch and the mainline have been installed. This allows easier through services between Glasgow and Mallaig.
- An additional set of points at the ends of Platform 1/2 to allow loco run arounds on those platforms. On P1 a loco can now run around 2 carriages and a van which is a typical off season train length on the branch. On P2 a 4 carriage train can be run around.
- P3 has had a set of points added to allow loco's to run around and this has shorterned one siding to allow the station building to be positioned a little more realistically.

This all allows much more operational flexibility and should make things easier in terms of loco movements and shunt release movements needed (although there will still be some). I'm now going to attempt to run the same timetable again, and hopefully it should be much easier

 

[Cheshire Scot]

A few weeks ago, I had a crack at running a 1970's real Fort William timetable on Fort George. What this showed up, was that my track layout wasn't really up to the task for a number of reasons.

Thus, a number of track upgrades have taken place today:

- A set of points to allow Platform 2 to serve both the branch and the mainline have been installed. This allows easier through services between Glasgow and Mallaig.
- An additional set of points at the ends of Platform 1/2 to allow loco run arounds on those platforms. On P1 a loco can now run around 2 carriages and a van which is a typical off season train length on the branch. On P2 a 4 carriage train can be run around.
- P3 has had a set of points added to allow loco's to run around and this has shorterned one siding to allow the station building to be positioned a little more realistically.

This all allows much more operational flexibility and should make things easier in terms of loco movements and shunt release movements needed (although there will still be some). I'm now going to attempt to run the same timetable again, and hopefully it should be much easier

Excellent, and bearing in mind in the early 1970s it was the old station in Fort William which was very constrained for space and the longest platform took about 7 coaches (albeit the buffer stops were several coach lengths beyond the platform end), the other two about 51/2 coach lengths, this with your space constrained scaled down lengths is very realistic.

That layout was however much less flexible than yours, with the three platforms leading off the single line and a loco release crossover serving the two shorter platforms, and the junction for Mallaig was approx. 1 mile down the line.

I do wish I could recall the detail of the 12 coach summer Saturday 17.25 to Glasgow, Edinburgh and Kings Cross, but I'd guess it must have had coaches off the platform at both ends! In terms of scale you might try to replicate than with maybe seven coaches - acknowledging that won't fit in the fiddle yard.

 

[Cowley]

Excellent, and bearing in mind in the early 1970s it was the old station in Fort William which was very constrained for space and the longest platform took about 7 coaches (albeit the buffer stops were several coach lengths beyond the platform end), the other two about 51/2 coach lengths, this with your space constrained scaled down lengths is very realistic.

That layout was however much less flexible than yours, with the three platforms leading off the single line and a loco release crossover serving the two shorter platforms, and the junction for Mallaig was approx. 1 mile down the line.

I do wish I could recall the detail of the 12 coach summer Saturday 17.25 to Glasgow, Edinburgh and Kings Cross, but I'd guess it must have had coaches off the platform at both ends! In terms of scale you might try to replicate than with maybe seven coaches - acknowledging that won't fit in the fiddle yard.

Very interesting. I’ve always loved the look of the old station in photos (I never saw it in real life unfortunately), mainly because of the way it was right next to the water.

@Iskra - Those are definitely good improvements. I’m just wondering what you did in the two hours in between trains?

 

[Cheshire Scot]

I’m just wondering what you did in the two hours in between trains?

Only two hours? But they would of course be 00 scale hours!

 

[Cowley]

Only two hours? But they would of course be 00 scale hours!

It’s funny really. We were doing a show at the weekend on what is supposedly a secondary route in Devon in winter and you realise that anyone watching probably saw about ten different trains in ten minutes.

 

[Iskra]

Very interesting. I’ve always loved the look of the old station in photos (I never saw it in real life unfortunately), mainly because of the way it was right next to the water.

@Iskra - Those are definitely good improvements. I’m just wondering what you did in the two hours in between trains?

Trust me, I was a very busy being multiple drivers, signallers and shunters all at once! Should be a bit easier now, when I try run it again

 

[Cheshire Scot]

@Iskra - you may have seen the feature in February 'Railway Modeller' re Ballachulish, a former terminus station very much in the Fort George mould, if not, and for the benefit of others, the modeller assumes the Ballachulish branch did not close in 1966 and depicts the terminus, remodelled to better cater for the traditional and more modern freight traffic whilst still serving as a passenger station, some 20 years later early in the RETB and class 37/4 era.

I don't normally read Railway Modeller but was drawn to this issue by the cover photo. I note that this layout will be at the Model Rail Scotland show at the end of February, it is a number of years since I attended this event so perhaps this would be a good year to go again!

In the featured era the traditional flows of inward alumina and outward finished aluminium for the Aluminium Works at nearby Kinlochleven have been joined by the newer timber traffics. It is worth noting that following the closure of Ballachulish the traffic for Kinlochleven continued on rail for many years using the facilities at Fort William and although modelled with aluminium for export being conveyed in Cargowaggons (hence no need to model the actual ingots) in the 1980s the domestic aluminium flows were actually conveyed in OBA wagons, typically three loads per day several days per week. The modeller has a couple of very nicely liveried 'Alcan' road vehicles although it was the the local haulier Kinlochleven Road Transport who had the contract to bring ingots to the railhead for loading and alumina in the opposite direction - whilst the aluminium was loaded to rail at the BR Freight Depot the alumina was actually handled at the Fort William Aluminium Works private siding. In the years that followed the Kinlochleven aluminium traffic passed to Freightliner resulting in a much longer road transfer to the Coatbridge Terminal.

Perhaps some ideas for you to develop?

I worked with a number of former Ballachulish staff in Fort William who had transferred under redundancy arrangements whilst some staff from stations down the branch towards Connel Ferry were able to continue their railway carers in Oban.

NOTE: 3 hours later some cosmetic editing to the original (typos and duplication)

 

[Iskra]

@Iskra - you may have seen the feature in February 'Railway Modeller' re Ballachulish, a former terminus station very much in the Fort George mould, if not, and for the benefit of others, the modeller assumes the Ballachulish branch did not close in 1966 and depicts the terminus, remodelled to better cater for the traditional and more modern freight traffic whilst still serving as a passenger station, some 20 years later early in the RETB and class 37/4 era.

I don't normally read Railway Modeller but was drawn to this issue by the cover photo. I note that this layout will be at the Model Rail Scotland show at the end of February, it is a number of years since I attended this event so perhaps this would be a good year to go again!

In the featured era the traditional flows of inward alumina and outward finished aluminium for the Aluminium Works at nearby Kinlochleven have been joined by the newer timber traffics. It is worth noting that following the closure of Ballachulish the traffic for Kinlochleven continued on rail for many years using the facilities at Fort William and although modelled with aluminium for export being conveyed in Cargowaggons (hence no need to model the actual ingots) in the 1980s the domestic aluminium flows were actually conveyed in OBA wagons, typically three loads per day several days per week. The modeller has a couple of very nicely liveried 'Alcan' road vehicles although it was the the local haulier Kinlochleven Road Transport who had the contract to bring ingots to the railhead for loading and alumina in the opposite direction - whilst the aluminium was loaded to rail at the BR Freight Depot the alumina was actually handled at the Fort William Aluminium Works private siding. In the years that followed the Kinlochleven aluminium traffic passed to Freightliner resulting in a much longer road transfer to the Coatbridge Terminal.

Perhaps some ideas for you to develop?

I worked with a number of former Ballachulish staff in Fort William who had transferred under redundancy arrangements whilst some staff from stations down the branch towards Connel Ferry were able to continue their railway carers in Oban.

NOTE: 3 hours later some cosmetic editing to the original (typos and duplication)

Please excuse my delayed response- on reading your excellent post, I decided to order a copy of the magazine and subsequently waited until I’d read it before responding.

Yes, it’s an excellent article and layout very much along the lines of what I’d like to achieve one day and there are many excellent features for inspiration. If you visit the layout in Glasgow do report back please and also thank you for bringing the article to my attention

 

[Cowley]

It’s about time you gave us an update isn’t it @Iskra..?

 

[Iskra]

Thanks for unlocking the thread

Well, it has certainly been a while due to increasing busyness in the real world. However, I’ve made some changes at Fort George. Firstly, I’ve removed the engine shed and associated sidings, fuel roads etc. I decided the small shed area was a bit of a cliche; not very realistic, taking up room and getting in the way of seeing the trains. Of course, the shed at Fort William is away from the station so it is prototypical in that respect. Now engines trundle on/off the layout and there is a dedicated shed area in the fiddle yard for loco-stabling.

The farmhouse has taken its place, and in the farmhouse’s previous area I’ve put down some grass. I think this gives the layout a more rural feel, makes it less cluttered/congested and makes it feel more like a bleak end-of-the line kind of place. I’m probably going to add a sheep or two in the future to this area and I do have some additional tufts/plants etc that can go in at a later date if I feel the need.

Obviously, there’s still a lot to do, particularly trackside, but I’m glad I’ve made a small amount of progress

 

[Cowley]

I like that. Layouts like yours always seem to work better (to me at least) if there’s not too much trackwork everywhere and there’s a bit of room for the scenery to breathe.

You could always make a little micro layout depot scene on a shelf above the railway if you wanted to display your locos?

I’d like to live in that house by the way.

 

[Peter C]

Thanks for unlocking the thread

Well, it has certainly been a while due to increasing busyness in the real world. However, I’ve made some changes at Fort George. Firstly, I’ve removed the engine shed and associated sidings, fuel roads etc. I decided the small shed area was a bit of a cliche; not very realistic, taking up room and getting in the way of seeing the trains. Of course, the shed at Fort William is away from the station so it is prototypical in that respect. Now engines trundle on/off the layout and there is a dedicated shed area in the fiddle yard for loco-stabling.

The farmhouse has taken its place, and in the farmhouse’s previous area I’ve put down some grass. I think this gives the layout a more rural feel, makes it less cluttered/congested and makes it feel more like a bleak end-of-the line kind of place. I’m probably going to add a sheep or two in the future to this area and I do have some additional tufts/plants etc that can go in at a later date if I feel the need.

Obviously, there’s still a lot to do, particularly trackside, but I’m glad I’ve made a small amount of progress

View attachment 139243

Loving that @Iskra! Great stuff. 'Less is more' certainly works on model railways a lot of the time - one of the things I really struggled with on my layout was getting plenty of scenery in so as to not overcrowd the (relatively small) board with tracks. The setting of the farmhouse, the grass in front of it with the track, and the field next to it are all looking superb!

I’d like to live in that house by the way.

You'll have to beat me to the estate agents...

-Peter

 

[Iskra]

I like that. Layouts like yours always seem to work better (to me at least) if there’s not too much trackwork everywhere and there’s a bit of room for the scenery to breathe.

You could always make a little micro layout depot scene on a shelf above the railway if you wanted to display your locos?

I’d like to live in that house by the way.

Yes, I think it’s very easy to get carried away with using all available space when designing a layout as a track plan, and then more so when you put it down and realise what you can do by adding just a little bit more somewhere and then suddenly you’ve got a vast amount of track in a (generally) unrealistic amount of space. I am much preferring the more rationalised version already

I mean that’s true, but one layout is enough I think! I’m probably not going to, but if I was to do that, I’d probably just add scenery to part of the fiddle yard and turn a section into a mini depot layout. I should probably concentrate on finishing Fort George before anything like that however!

Yes, me too!

Loving that @Iskra! Great stuff. 'Less is more' certainly works on model railways a lot of the time - one of the things I really struggled with on my layout was getting plenty of scenery in so as to not overcrowd the (relatively small) board with tracks. The setting of the farmhouse, the grass in front of it with the track, and the field next to it are all looking superb!


You'll have to beat me to the estate agents...

-Peter

Yes thats something I’ve struggled with too, but I think I’m getting there now and achieving a bit more balance. Yeah, I’m really happy with the fields too, thank you!

 

[Peter C]

Yes thats something I’ve struggled with too, but I think I’m getting there now and achieving a bit more balance. Yeah, I’m really happy with the fields too, thank you!

Hopefully at some point in the future I'll build another layout, and I'll definitely be drawing inspiration from what you've done with bits of yours. I'm really liking the greenery and the fields - may I ask what sort of materials you've used to make them?

-Peter

 

[Iskra]

Hopefully at some point in the future I'll build another layout, and I'll definitely be drawing inspiration from what you've done with bits of yours. I'm really liking the greenery and the fields - may I ask what sort of materials you've used to make them?

-Peter

They are actually scenic mats designed for wargaming from Model Scenery Supplies. You can buy them in different sizes and just use them whole, or cut/tear them to shape for custom areas

 

[Big Jumby 74]

I like that. Layouts like yours always seem to work better (to me at least) if there’s not too much trackwork everywhere and there’s a bit of room for the scenery to breathe.

Ditto. Love the pic of the cottage Iskra, really works well. I've fallen in to the 'too much track/not enough space' (for anything else) trap as well, more than once, to the point I become bored with the plan, and have to start again, before I ever really achieve anything much.
For me the early diesel era, and a mix of green/blue locos, maroon & blue/grey carriages etc., but with limited space, mostly loco's of up to type 3 in size (class 37's being a favourite) and semi rural branch line, either based around Scottish practice or East Anglian - many closed branches there to get inspiration from - and I can use my class 15/16's etc.
I did think one option I might have would be to have a set track plan and scenery, but then have buildings (sig box/station buildings etc) removable, so that I could eg; have one set of buildings built to a GE design, and another set to perhaps a Caledonian style (or whatever), so the 'spirit' of the layout would work either way, depending on which loco's one wanted to operate on any given day. That said, classes 24/26/27 did all work 'doon' south very briefly which with some poetic license strengthens my idea about East Anglia as a basis!

But I must get back to initial (re)planning stage, before any of that happens...

 

[Iskra]

Ditto. Love the pic of the cottage Iskra, really works well. I've fallen in to the 'too much track/not enough space' (for anything else) trap as well, more than once, to the point I become bored with the plan, and have to start again, before I ever really achieve anything much.
For me the early diesel era, and a mix of green/blue locos, maroon & blue/grey carriages etc., but with limited space, mostly loco's of up to type 3 in size (class 37's being a favourite) and semi rural branch line, either based around Scottish practice or East Anglian - many closed branches there to get inspiration from - and I can use my class 15/16's etc.
I did think one option I might have would be to have a set track plan and scenery, but then have buildings (sig box/station buildings etc) removable, so that I could eg; have one set of buildings built to a GE design, and another set to perhaps a Caledonian style (or whatever), so the 'spirit' of the layout would work either way, depending on which loco's one wanted to operate on any given day. That said, classes 24/26/27 did all work 'doon' south very briefly which with some poetic license strengthens my idea about East Anglia as a basis!

But I must get back to initial (re)planning stage, before any of that happens...

That all sounds amazing

I've had another re-shuffle tonight:

I've re-done the farmhouse area, and I think it looks vaguely convincing now



Added Autumnal unkept scrub land/shubbery (nii) adjacent to the station:



I've re-arranged the military logistics depot, although I will no doubt tinker with this further in the future.



This is how the station approach is looking at the moment (definitely more to do here)



And there has been further rationalisation of the track layout. A further siding has been removed, leaving just the three platform roads, a run around loop and one siding. I've decided that this is plenty for the likely operations, but I wanted to keep one siding as I do think it's cool to just dump random rolling stock on the layout for something to look at when there aren't any trains running; this can be anything from a DMU/loco to just a stray wagon or engineering stock.



There's still a lot more to do with the track area, but it's starting to come together when you look at the layout from the front, from a distance, if you squint...

I've also changed the stock that's running on the layout to the early sprinterisation era, which allows 156's, 37's and 20's all running together. I'm actually finding this era much more enjoyable to run as it's a lot simpler to operate than steam. I also have the option of loco operations with the assorted movements, or just running a DMU in and out depending on how I'm feeling.

 

[Cowley]

That all sounds amazing

I've had another re-shuffle tonight:

I've re-done the farmhouse area, and I think it looks vaguely convincing now

View attachment 146741

Added Autumnal unkept scrub land/shubbery (nii) adjacent to the station:

View attachment 146742

I've re-arranged the military logistics depot, although I will no doubt tinker with this further in the future.

View attachment 146743

This is how the station approach is looking at the moment (definitely more to do here)

View attachment 146744

And there has been further rationalisation of the track layout. A further siding has been removed, leaving just the three platform roads, a run around loop and one siding. I've decided that this is plenty for the likely operations, but I wanted to keep one siding as I do think it's cool to just dump random rolling stock on the layout for something to look at when there aren't any trains running; this can be anything from a DMU/loco to just a stray wagon or engineering stock.

View attachment 146745

There's still a lot more to do with the track area, but it's starting to come together when you look at the layout from the front, from a distance, if you squint...

I've also changed the stock that's running on the layout to the early sprinterisation era, which allows 156's, 37's and 20's all running together. I'm actually finding this era much more enjoyable to run as it's a lot simpler to operate than steam. I also have the option of loco operations with the assorted movements, or just running a DMU in and out depending on how I'm feeling.

That’s all looking very good. I really like the autumnal feel of the scene, everyone tends to set things in summer (including me!) because it’s the obvious thing to do, but bringing in something a bit different can make a huge difference.

The cottage scene looks lovely but that house is in desperate need of a path to the front door. If you brush a line up to it with water would you be able to scrape some of the grass off by dissolving the glue maybe @Iskra?

 

[Iskra]

That’s all looking very good. I really like the autumnal feel of the scene, everyone tends to set things in summer (including me!) because it’s the obvious thing to do, but bringing in something a bit different can make a huge difference.

The cottage scene looks lovely but that house is in desperate need of a path to the front door. If you brush a line up to it with water would you be able to scrape some of the grass off by dissolving the glue maybe @Iskra?

Thank you!

Yeah, I’ll definitely add in the path in the future. The track area is probably the next area to receive attention though.

 

[Intercity110]

this is a very nice layout of yours.

 

[sprinterguy]

Thanks for the update Iskra; as someone else modelling a Fort William-esque terminus in OO I do enjoy watching developments on your layout.

There's definitely a benefit to be had from a mixed multiple unit and loco-hauled operation, to provide both utility and variety, in my opinion: My layout is permanently set, loosely, around 1993, so the primary passenger service, of five trains each way, is based around two Sprinters and one loco-hauled set that represents the 'Young Explorer' services that ran between Glasgow and Fort William during 1994. Plus my version of the Jacobite steam service between April and October.

Most prototypical termini can certainly benefit from a siding for the stabling of ad-hoc stock, be it engineers trains or spare coaching stock. My terminus, beyond the two longer passenger platform faces that are assumed to have been 'modernised' in the 1970s, has a shorter two-sided dock that largely handles Motorail traffic and parcels from the thrice-weekly Travelling Post Office, inspired by the Whitehaven - Huddersfield working that ran until 1991.

 

[Iskra]

That’s excellent! The early/mid 90’s do seem a fascinating time frame up there with plenty of livery variety and loco operation, so I don’t blame you for choosing the that period at all, and I will probably try to reproduce that time period on my layout at somepoint in the future too.

Whitehaven-Huddersfield sounds very random today!

I’m liking the look of your stock and platform there

 

[sprinterguy]

Whitehaven-Huddersfield sounds very random today!

Yeah, I've always wanted a proper parcels train since childhood, and my rationale was that if such an obscure pairing as Whitehaven and Huddersfield could justify a TPO service into the 1990s, then my regional branch could, too.

I’m liking the look of your stock and platform there

Cheers - I really must get round to adding the platform edging to my parcels dock at some point.

That’s excellent! The early/mid 90’s do seem a fascinating time frame up there with plenty of livery variety and loco operation, so I don’t blame you for choosing the that period at all, and I will probably try to reproduce that time period on my layout at somepoint in the future too.

Regional Railways was quite the haven for pockets of traditional loco-hauled operation during the nineties; particularly in the summer, it was quite widespread.

There's definitely a varied range of liveries to choose from just within the comparatively small class 37/4 fleet within my timeframe: Perhaps surprisingly, given that just over half the sub-class wore the BR Mainline scheme at the time.

 

[Peter C]

I've just had a read of this latest update @Iskra and I must say it sounds (and looks) great. I agree with @Cowley re. the path to the farmhouse (I wonder if a small amount of ballast sprinkled along would work?) but it's still looking very much the part as it is. I think rationalising the trackwork is a good idea - though that's not to say there was too much before, but I think (and I was guilty of it!) it can be a 'too much of a good thing... is not so wonderful', to misquote a certain Mr. Liberace...

-Peter