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General reminiscences about train to ferry travel

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ricoblade

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Still runs in addition to the about there is the 06:38 Liverpool Street to Harwich Town (calls at Harwich International) - this is the morning boat train. The 17:38, 18:48 and 21:02 aren't boat trains although I believe you still can make the boat by boarding the 21:02 ex Liverpool Street. Not many people tend to use it now except for a small number of weekends per year. When the Cross Country one ran to Manchester and Glasgow I don't think it went via Cambridge but instead direct to Ely.


Hasn't been an Intercity set for over 10 years and won't ever be again. I think the last time it was that it was an Intercity it ran as the 17:27 Liverpool Street to Harwich International calling at Colchester for the commuters and 19:30 Harwich International to Liverpool Street.


Updated recently, I seem to recall, to reflect tram operation on the Dutch side vice railway as it was previously.
In the early 80s, a boat train to Harwich Parkeston Quay ran Manchester Piccadilly, reversed at Sheffield then Nottingham, Grantham, Peterborough, March, Ely, Bury St Edmunds with "connections to Amsterdam, Bonn, Basel and Milan". I can still hear the lady announcer at Sheffield calling the route.
 

Ken H

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In the early 80s, a boat train to Harwich Parkeston Quay ran Manchester Piccadilly, reversed at Sheffield then Nottingham, Grantham, Peterborough, March, Ely, Bury St Edmunds with "connections to Amsterdam, Bonn, Basel and Milan". I can still hear the lady announcer at Sheffield calling the route.
1607781805949.png

1961 Bradshaw on timetableworld.com.
 

Richard Scott

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Remember doing a school charter around June 1984 from Cheltenham to Dover Western Docks for ferry to Boulogne. Was only mildly into trains then but sure loco was a 31. Try as I might never been able to find the loco number, if anyone can help be appreciated! Also have no idea of route, have vague idea went via Blackfriars where loco ran round, is that even likely?
 

30907

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Remember doing a school charter around June 1984 from Cheltenham to Dover Western Docks for ferry to Boulogne. Was only mildly into trains then but sure loco was a 31. Also have no idea of route, have vague idea went via Blackfriars where loco ran round, is that even likely?
Not only unlikely, I don't think it was possible by then. Normal route would be Kensington Olympia-Factory Jn.
 

eastwestdivide

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Remember doing a school charter around June 1984 from Cheltenham to Dover Western Docks for ferry to Boulogne. Was only mildly into trains then but sure loco was a 31. Try as I might never been able to find the loco number, if anyone can help be appreciated! Also have no idea of route, have vague idea went via Blackfriars where loco ran round, is that even likely?
Also, a 31 all the way to Dover would be extremely unusual. Excursions and other special trains from the Western Region to the SE division of the Southern were usually a WR 47 all the way through. (Or in the case of one Reading-Gillingham football special, a 3-car 117 DMU!)
 

AndyW33

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I was lucky enough to use Liverpool Riverside once, arriving on an Isle of Man Steam Packet vessel and catching a train to Birmingham. To my everlasting shame I can't remember too much about it, the ferry crossing had been more exciting to young teenage me.
 

Richard Scott

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Also, a 31 all the way to Dover would be extremely unusual. Excursions and other special trains from the Western Region to the SE division of the Southern were usually a WR 47 all the way through. (Or in the case of one Reading-Gillingham football special, a 3-car 117 DMU!)
I knew basic outlines of locos and even though didn't know classes could recognise different types. Admittedly it was a backward glance but front of a 31 quite distinct. I may be wrong, if anyone has info about this train and loco(s) on it I'd be grateful. I've tried everywhere I can think of to find out but to no avail.
 

eastwestdivide

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I knew basic outlines of locos and even though didn't know classes could recognise different types. Admittedly it was a backward glance but front of a 31 quite distinct. I may be wrong, if anyone has info about this train and loco(s) on it I'd be grateful. I've tried everywhere I can think of to find out but to no avail.
If it was a 31 from Cheltenham, I'd hazard a guess that it would be changed en route to the Southern. Never say never though!
 

STEVIEBOY1

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I was lucky enough to use Liverpool Riverside once, arriving on an Isle of Man Steam Packet vessel and catching a train to Birmingham. To my everlasting shame I can't remember too much about it, the ferry crossing had been more exciting to young teenage me.
I presume Liverpool Riverside was accessed via tunnels from the main line around Edge Hill?
 

EveningStar

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I presume Liverpool Riverside was accessed via tunnels from the main line around Edge Hill?
Yes. This, Liverpool Riverside, is a good read.

Boat train from London Victoria to Dover Marine, Sunday 14 December 1975. See from my notes that cabbed 71004 after it arrived with the Night Ferry. Boat train was 68010 & 7186 & 7017 & 7137, with whole journey feeling like a breathless, non-stop rattle down to Dover, via I notice Swanley from Bromley to Tonbridge as presumably a diversion due to Sunday engineering work (via Bat & Ball not the normal boat train route?). Walk from platform to ferry just a few steps, then met by relatives other side for drive to Germany.
 
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STEVIEBOY1

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Yes. This, Liverpool Riverside, is a good read.

Boat train from London Victoria to Dover Marine, Sunday 14 December 1975. See from my notes that cabbed 71004 after it arrived with the Night Ferry. Boat train was 68010 & 7186 & 7017 & 7137, with whole journey feeling like a breathless, non-stop rattle down to Dover, via I notice Swanley from Bromley to Tonbridge as presumably a diversion due to Sunday engineering work (via Bat & Ball not the normal boat train route?). Walk from platform to ferry just a few steps, then met by relatives other side for drive to Germany.
Thank you that Liverpool Riverside Link was very interesting to read.
 

Bungle158

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Anyone remember the Folkestone Harbour branch? I first used it on a school trip to France back in 1965. I think the train was a Schools Travel Service charter. Everyone had to wear a coloured STS badge. Presumably different colours denoted the various schools involved.

The journey involved a reversal at Folkestone East for the short run down to the harbour. As l remember, it was all done quite efficiently, although the wait to join the branch seemed interminable.

Once arrived, columns of school kids were frogmarched straight onto the waiting ferry. In this case, the SNCF Cote d' Azur. I guess that the staff at Folkestone Harbour were well used to columns of children, given the station's wartime role.
 

STEVIEBOY1

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Yes, I used that branch a few times in the 1970s for trips to France, then many many years later on steam charter trips that went along the branch, lovely.
 

rogercov

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I've posted these before, so apologies if you have already seen them.
It's a memory from June 1959 of arrival at Newhaven Harbour and subsequent departure from Dieppe Maritime.
It's interesting to look on Google Street View at Dieppe. You can roughly work out where the picture was taken from as some of the buildings are still recognisable, but there's no railway now.
Newhaven-June-1959.jpgDieppe-June-1959.jpg
 

WesternLancer

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I've posted these before, so apologies if you have already seen them.
It's a memory from June 1959 of arrival at Newhaven Harbour and subsequent departure from Dieppe Maritime.
It's interesting to look on Google Street View at Dieppe. You can roughly work out where the picture was taken from as some of the buildings are still recognisable, but there's no railway now.
View attachment 87381View attachment 87382
Thanks for posting such interesting pics - excellent to see as being from Sussex Dieppe was my regular route to France. I miss the ferry docking right at the heart of the town quayside. Interesting as this predates the early 70s(?) Newhaven Harbour structures I knew (not old enough to recall what the station there was like before).

At the Dieppe end was the art deco style quayside building there in 1959 then, but just out of shot in your image?

I don't know when it dated from but used to love boarding or alighting from it and when we would go (sometimes even for a day trip which was quite a bit of ship board time!) we would get off and if not connecting with a boat train walk over to choose one of the restaurants on the quay side to eat which was always a priority for my mum, keen to get a taste of French cooking as soon as possible.

I used the short lived Hoverspeed (?) fast catamaran services a few times for day trips when they ran - from memory I think late 1990s, and these made a day trip in summer very easy and pleasant to do, again enjoying those quayside eateries. I think the tracks were removed as part of some sort of 'regeneration' scheme that happened after the channel tunnel was opened.
 

WesternBiker

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Some wonderful reminiscences here!

I think my favourite memory of many Cross-Channel crossings in the 1980s was travelling from Birmingham to Wageningen in the Netherlands in 1985; train from Birmingham cross-country to Harwich, then the Prinses Beatrix there (overnight) and back (daytime). On the return leg we encountered a force 8 gale and I was grateful for a wonderfully steam heated Mk1 carriage, hauled by a Class 31, back to Birmingham.

The other ferry terminal I recall as a child was Lymington Pier for the ferries to the Isle of Wight. It has to be the easiest of connections - cross platform from train to ferry! I see it still records over 100k passengers a year.
 

High Dyke

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I've mentioned elsewhere, but for me New Holland - Hull and back on the MV Farringford. This was a school outing, with a pair of Class 114 units as the form of travel from Grantham to New Holland Pier and back. This would've been about 1978.

The vessel, built on Clydeside in 1948, was withdrawn from that route with the opening of the Humber Bridge in 1981.

Also done Liverpool Street, Harwich, Hoek-van-Holland, Amsterdam a couple of times.
 

AlbertBeale

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I've posted these before, so apologies if you have already seen them.
It's a memory from June 1959 of arrival at Newhaven Harbour and subsequent departure from Dieppe Maritime.
It's interesting to look on Google Street View at Dieppe. You can roughly work out where the picture was taken from as some of the buildings are still recognisable, but there's no railway now.
View attachment 87381View attachment 87382

Re the pic of the boat train at Newhaven Harbour station in 1959 - what's the chronology of boat trains using a third platform at the Harbour station, as opposed to branching off to the - as was until recently - Marine station? My use of that crossing from time to time didn't start until the 1970s; I seem to remember it as being via Marine station then.
 

EbbwJunction1

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The other ferry terminal I recall as a child was Lymington Pier for the ferries to the Isle of Wight. It has to be the easiest of connections - cross platform from train to ferry! I see it still records over 100k passengers a year.
I'd go along with this, as I travelled on it last year, and it was very good.

There is one other that I've used, and this is the Gosport Ferry from Portsmouth Harbour. Leave the station, turn left and down the ramp and board the ferry ... you might have to wait a short while, depending on what time you're travelling, but job done!
 

WesternLancer

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Re the pic of the boat train at Newhaven Harbour station in 1959 - what's the chronology of boat trains using a third platform at the Harbour station, as opposed to branching off to the - as was until recently - Marine station? My use of that crossing from time to time didn't start until the 1970s; I seem to remember it as being via Marine station then.
Yes, Marine def there from my childhood in early 70s. I wonder if eg the intro of bigger ferries or RoRo meant they had to go a bit further out in the harbour and thus needed the spur with terminal buildings attached? It's an interesting question. Was the spur to Marine station part of a dockside 'siding' before that? logic would suggest it was

wikipedia says (with a reference source)

"The London, Brighton and South Coast Railway (LB&SCR) opened the station on 17 May 1886, as Newhaven Harbour (Boat Station).On 14 May 1984, British Rail renamed the station to Newhaven Marine.[8]"

But I do not recall a name change in 1984 even tho I lived locally.

Shame the ever brilliant disused stations has not got an entry on Marine yet.
 

rogercov

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Thanks for posting such interesting pics - excellent to see as being from Sussex Dieppe was my regular route to France. I miss the ferry docking right at the heart of the town quayside. Interesting as this predates the early 70s(?) Newhaven Harbour structures I knew (not old enough to recall what the station there was like before).
At the Dieppe end was the art deco style quayside building there in 1959 then, but just out of shot in your image?

Thanks for the response. I never left the station at Dieppe, so didn't explore the town. Looking again at Google Street View, I see that all of the buildings in the background of my picture are almost exactly the same today. I seem to remember that Dieppe Maritime had a single island platform so it could accommodate two trains.

In the early 60s, I travelled a few times to Paris with the school via the Newhaven-Dieppe route. There was a French company which organised trips to Paris in the Easter holidays for several English schools. There were 10 days each year when Paris was descended upon by hoards of English schoolkids, around 30 per school. We all had to wear white armbands and badges to identify which party we were in. It was quite a convenient (and cheap) way of seeing all the sights as our parties were herded past the queues at places like the Louvre and Eiffel Tower.

Steam was used on the route between Dieppe and Paris St. Lazare until well into the 60s. As far as I am aware, our trains were "specials", laid on specifically for the schools. It's possible that the boat was too. I certainly got the impression that the only adult passengers were those in charge of the school parties.

I have one memory of a return journey where there two such trains left St. Lazare from adjacent platforms. As soon as the station clocks at the end of the platform clicked over to 10am, both trains immediately pulled away. They remained side by side right up to where the two tracks diverged a couple of miles outside Paris, much to the delight of the young passengers who were exchanging waves and other gestures between the trains.

One train would then go via Rouen (still the main route, I believe). The other would use a route via Pontoise, Gisors and Neufchatel-en-Bray, parts of which are no longer there. They would arrive at Dieppe within a few minutes of each other.
 

WesternLancer

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Thanks for the response. I never left the station at Dieppe, so didn't explore the town. Looking again at Google Street View, I see that all of the buildings in the background of my picture are almost exactly the same today. I seem to remember that Dieppe Maritime had a single island platform so it could accommodate two trains.

In the early 60s, I travelled a few times to Paris with the school via the Newhaven-Dieppe route. There was a French company which organised trips to Paris in the Easter holidays for several English schools. There were 10 days each year when Paris was descended upon by hoards of English schoolkids, around 30 per school. We all had to wear white armbands and badges to identify which party we were in. It was quite a convenient (and cheap) way of seeing all the sights as our parties were herded past the queues at places like the Louvre and Eiffel Tower.

Steam was used on the route between Dieppe and Paris St. Lazare until well into the 60s. As far as I am aware, our trains were "specials", laid on specifically for the schools. It's possible that the boat was too. I certainly got the impression that the only adult passengers were those in charge of the school parties.

I have one memory of a return journey where there two such trains left St. Lazare from adjacent platforms. As soon as the station clocks at the end of the platform clicked over to 10am, both trains immediately pulled away. They remained side by side right up to where the two tracks diverged a couple of miles outside Paris, much to the delight of the young passengers who were exchanging waves and other gestures between the trains.

One train would then go via Rouen (still the main route, I believe). The other would use a route via Pontoise, Gisors and Neufchatel-en-Bray, parts of which are no longer there. They would arrive at Dieppe within a few minutes of each other.
Great memories - thanks! I guess just over 10 years before my own first recollections. We would also explore Dieppe as quite often we would be using the car ferry with car - so left the town in leisurely manner after arrival. My dad was also mindful of the Dieppe raid memorial there as we had a close family friend who as a Marine was part of that, and was captured by the Germans at the raid - which he regarded as rather a debacle - and he was an officer.

My own recollections are of diesel hauled stock from Paris - and also occasions when changing at Rouen onto DMUs.

I did it by night once in I think December 1987 - one of the very few times I used it at night. I'd been in north west England and my family were already in Paris staying with my mum's childhood pen friend and I was to join them. A rare occasion travelling from Victoria to Newhaven. Mid week night boat train foot passengers were a rarity in December I guess and I recall being pulled up after passport check by a 2nd control officer who then proceeded to ask me a whole series of questions about why I was travelling and where I lived (which was down the road near Polegate). Unsure what he suspected me of, maybe he was just bored, or maybe the actual existence of a teenage foot passenger at that time of year was grounds for a few questions!!!

My main recollection was that neither the boat trip or the onwards train journey were long enough to get much kip on the cushions. It was enjoyable to arrive amongst the early commuters at St Lazarre. Our family friend picked me up by car from the station (they lived in a flat in fairly central Paris) and then gave me a whistle stop car tour of all the key Paris sites before going for breakfast. Great memories. I assume we returned as a family together on the day train / boat.
 
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30907

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Re the pic of the boat train at Newhaven Harbour station in 1959 - what's the chronology of boat trains using a third platform at the Harbour station, as opposed to branching off to the - as was until recently - Marine station? My use of that crossing from time to time didn't start until the 1970s; I seem to remember it as being via Marine station then.
It's one and the same platform. The SR 1958 and Cooks 1973 timetables (checked from www.Timetableworld.com) both call it Harbour.
 

WesternBiker

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Thanks for the response. I never left the station at Dieppe, so didn't explore the town. Looking again at Google Street View, I see that all of the buildings in the background of my picture are almost exactly the same today. I seem to remember that Dieppe Maritime had a single island platform so it could accommodate two trains.

In the early 60s, I travelled a few times to Paris with the school via the Newhaven-Dieppe route. There was a French company which organised trips to Paris in the Easter holidays for several English schools. There were 10 days each year when Paris was descended upon by hoards of English schoolkids, around 30 per school. We all had to wear white armbands and badges to identify which party we were in. It was quite a convenient (and cheap) way of seeing all the sights as our parties were herded past the queues at places like the Louvre and Eiffel Tower.

Steam was used on the route between Dieppe and Paris St. Lazare until well into the 60s. As far as I am aware, our trains were "specials", laid on specifically for the schools. It's possible that the boat was too. I certainly got the impression that the only adult passengers were those in charge of the school parties.

I have one memory of a return journey where there two such trains left St. Lazare from adjacent platforms. As soon as the station clocks at the end of the platform clicked over to 10am, both trains immediately pulled away. They remained side by side right up to where the two tracks diverged a couple of miles outside Paris, much to the delight of the young passengers who were exchanging waves and other gestures between the trains.

One train would then go via Rouen (still the main route, I believe). The other would use a route via Pontoise, Gisors and Neufchatel-en-Bray, parts of which are no longer there. They would arrive at Dieppe within a few minutes of each other.
I travelled to France via Newhaven (Harbour) in 1986; I was staying in Dieppe and, arriving at around 3:30 in the morning, I wished I was travelling on to Paris on the boat train waiting at Dieppe Maritime, right on the harbourside. Instead, I found a cafe open overnight and waited until I could start exploring the town, before the youth hostel opened. I'm not sure that many places in the UK would have a civilised cafe open at that time in the morning.
 
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Glorious_NSE

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Anyone remember the Folkestone Harbour branch? I first used it on a school trip to France back in 1965. I think the train was a Schools Travel Service charter. Everyone had to wear a coloured STS badge. Presumably different colours denoted the various schools involved.

The journey involved a reversal at Folkestone East for the short run down to the harbour. As l remember, it was all done quite efficiently, although the wait to join the branch seemed interminable.

Once arrived, columns of school kids were frogmarched straight onto the waiting ferry. In this case, the SNCF Cote d' Azur. I guess that the staff at Folkestone Harbour were well used to columns of children, given the station's wartime role.
Brings back forgotten memories, particularly the STS badges! Family trips to France in the 60s seemed to be mainly via Folkestone and I remember both the Folkestone Harbour branch and Dover Marine very well. Boat trains on the South Eastern were always easily recognisable with the MLV (Motor Luggage Van) at one end of the formation - they always looked to be in a hurry. To see a 12 car + MLV (ECBC + MLV in SR shorthand) passing through Tonbridge either accelerating hard out of the curve in the down direction, or braking hard for the curve on the up, was always impressive.

As a South Eastern management trainee in 1975, one of the highlights of a week spent cab riding with a traction inspector was a trip up the Harbour branch. We joined the MLV on the quayside and it was shunted back onto the 12 car formation. A local trip driver drove the train up the hill whilst we remained in the rear cab to allow a speedy reversal at the junction and I distinctly remember the motors making a lot more noise than usual! Kent Coast units had a 'series only' switch specifically to protect the resistance grids from overheating on the steep gradient of the Harbour branch. On arrival in the reversing sidings the departure signal cleared even before we came to a stand and, after a quick confirmation that the trip driver had actually got off, we were off for a lively ride to Victoria.

Seeing the picture of a 231K at Boulogne Maritime also reminds me of returning from an STS school skiing trip (yes, we had badges!) to Switzerland in 1969. Having reversed at Lille, progress in the frosty early morning seemed somehow different - a quick look out of the corridor window revealed two 141Rs at the head of the train. Wonderful!

M
 

Hawkwood Junc

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My only train to ferry experience was as an 11 year old doing a mini cruise to Gothenburg with my parents back in the mid 90s. We used the dedicated boat train from Liverpool Street - a very lightly loaded Class 86 plus Mk2s with a Mk1 buffet/restaurant car (out of use) from what I remember. A broken down freight train between Ingatestone and Chelmsford meant that we arrived at Parkstone Quay about an hour behind schedule and the Princess of Scandinavia left about 90 mins late as a result. The ship always being held for the train!

What followed was an extremely rough crossing as the captain tried to make up time and I learnt the true meaning of seasickness. The way back was calm as a millpond however!
 
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