• Our booking engine at tickets.railforums.co.uk (powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!

Glasgow Queen Street refurbishment and remodelling

Status
Not open for further replies.

PaxVobiscum

Established Member
Joined
4 Feb 2012
Messages
2,397
Location
Glasgow
Quick visit today (first this year) to see what’s been happening. Was advised to by buy a Platform Ticket (remember those? :lol:) instead of reporting in to Duty Manager.
Short video below which doesn’t really show anything much different from scotraildriver’s photos posted earlier.
 

Attachments

  • C840632F-0460-4829-BC3D-5C3B99A2459D.jpeg
    C840632F-0460-4829-BC3D-5C3B99A2459D.jpeg
    714.4 KB · Views: 171
Last edited:
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R

RailUK Forums

najaB

Veteran Member
Joined
28 Aug 2011
Messages
30,780
Location
Scotland
Was advised to by a Platform Ticket (remember those? :lol:) instead of reporting in to Duty Manager.
Very interesting. The video was too, especially that you managed to get all the way down the stairs without being told to take care on the stairs. ;)
 

PaxVobiscum

Established Member
Joined
4 Feb 2012
Messages
2,397
Location
Glasgow
Very interesting. The video was too, especially that you managed to get all the way down the stairs without being told to take care on the stairs. ;)
:lol: Indeed I was repeatedly told to “Hold the handrail and take care on the stairs” and much care was consequently taken – to ensure that this did not feature in the video.

I had not seen the last couple of pages of posts here until yesterday (I seem not to have notifications on this thread any more) so that when I went I was unaware of restrictions on the toilets. Nobody challenged me, though there were staff about.
 

swt_passenger

Veteran Member
Joined
7 Apr 2010
Messages
31,376
Very interesting. The video was too, especially that you managed to get all the way down the stairs without being told to take care on the stairs. ;)
Well perhaps if you wait until an announcement is just finished, and then run like mad, you can beat the next one. ”safety first”...

It’s good to see another video from @PaxVobiscum though.
 

PaxVobiscum

Established Member
Joined
4 Feb 2012
Messages
2,397
Location
Glasgow
I understand that the new lift at the west end of LL platform 9 is expected to be in operation soon; platform 8 which has been slightly extended will have to wait until the mirror thingy (used by drivers to check the doors before departure) and other platform end gubbins is shifted first.
Photo taken with permission and under NR supervision.
33ACC7E8-4A68-456E-AF62-504ED97A48E0.jpeg

Interesting that some of the original 1960s blue tiles remain in place (top right) for now.
 

Scotrail314209

Established Member
Joined
1 Feb 2017
Messages
2,353
Location
Edinburgh
I understand that the new lift at the west end of LL platform 9 is expected to be in operation soon; platform 8 which has been slightly extended will have to wait until the mirror thingy (used by drivers to check the doors before departure) and other platform end gubbins is shifted first.
Photo taken with permission and under NR supervision.
View attachment 94882

Interesting that some of the original 1960s blue tiles remain in place (top right) for now.

These extensions will prove seriously useful in the event that a 385 has to divert into the Lower Level. I know they can’t go out via Maryhill, so a reversal at Hyndland would need to happen.

Quite nice to see everything taking shape, I passed through recently and it was stunning. I just hope there’s retail options soon.
 

najaB

Veteran Member
Joined
28 Aug 2011
Messages
30,780
Location
Scotland
There's already a set of lifts, halfway along the lower-level platforms. They are accessed from platform 7 on the high-level. Been there for 40+ years.
And the problem with providing another set is...?

Edit: I find it interesting that the same forum (admittedly not the same members) where the suggestion to reopen the Borders Railway all the way to Carlisle as a diversionary route is made with a straight face baulks at the idea of a second set of lifts at one of the busiest stations in Scotland.
 
Last edited:

PaxVobiscum

Established Member
Joined
4 Feb 2012
Messages
2,397
Location
Glasgow
it is of course not unknown for the existing lifts to the LL at platform 7 to break down from time to time ;) so a bit of redundancy is sensible. The shiny new scenic lift at the W George St entrance was out of service again yesterday.
 

najaB

Veteran Member
Joined
28 Aug 2011
Messages
30,780
Location
Scotland
I never said it was a problem.

I was responding to you saying "not everyone can use the stairs".
The fact that there was another set was clear from the question I was answering: "...could someone tell me what the point is of these additional lifts to and from the lower level platforms?"
 

Highlandspring

Established Member
Joined
14 Oct 2017
Messages
2,777
Anyone who has used the existing lifts will know that they are the slowest moving vehicles on the planet. A snail with severe emphysema carrying a heavy rucksack could climb the low level stairs quicker than the lift ascends.
 

PaxVobiscum

Established Member
Joined
4 Feb 2012
Messages
2,397
Location
Glasgow
Anyone who has used the existing lifts will know that they are the slowest moving vehicles on the planet. A snail with severe emphysema carrying a heavy rucksack could climb the low level stairs quicker than the lift ascends.
:lol: Don’t hold out too much hope for the speed of the new ones either – a certain well known supplier of domestic stairlifts appears to have the contract. :)
 

ScotTrains

Member
Joined
13 Nov 2014
Messages
376
Location
Scotland
Interesting that Unit 7 is clearly listed on the specification as being the "First Class Lounge"
/QUOTE]

Is the long term plan for this area to eventually become the First Class Lounge in the future once passenger numbers are up and covid restrictions fully lifted?

The location of the lounge looks good and reminds me of the Manchester one, being a floor up overlooking the concourse.
 
Last edited:

PaxVobiscum

Established Member
Joined
4 Feb 2012
Messages
2,397
Location
Glasgow
Who knows about the long term plans. It was Abellio ScotRail who were pushing for a first class lounge. The 2015 (post Buchanan Galleries extension cancellation) plans foresee other uses for that area though a lot of other detail has changed as well:F82DD443-4F27-401C-8433-6E58C0F7150E.png
 

najaB

Veteran Member
Joined
28 Aug 2011
Messages
30,780
Location
Scotland
Who knows about the long term plans. It was Abellio ScotRail who were pushing for a first class lounge. The 2015 (post Buchanan Galleries extension cancellation) plans foresee other uses for that area though a lot of other detail has changed as well
With the crew facilities elsewhere I guess that space has opened up.
 

och aye

Member
Joined
21 Jan 2012
Messages
802
Quick visit today (first this year) to see what’s been happening. Was advised to by buy a Platform Ticket (remember those? :lol:) instead of reporting in to Duty Manager.
Short video below which doesn’t really show anything much different from scotraildriver’s photos posted earlier.
Nice to see your videos again @PaxVobiscum I hope your seagull is well too. :D Looking forward to the completion of this phase of the Queen Street redevelopment.
 
Joined
14 Mar 2021
Messages
192
Location
Glasgow
:lol: Don’t hold out too much hope for the speed of the new ones either – a certain well known supplier of domestic stairlifts appears to have the contract. :)
I wish that escalators were in scope for the project.
I don't know if there are guidelines regarding when and where escalators are to be specified but surely the foot count up and down the stairs at the western end of the platforms would justify escalators?
I could not imagine construction of a new two level major station without them. No doubt grandfather clauses apply here, though.
Pre-pandemic I saw many frail or elderly passengers struggling on these stairs with heavy suitcases, either unaware of the lifts or unwilling to wait for one to arrive.

FJ
 

Bald Rick

Veteran Member
Joined
28 Sep 2010
Messages
29,164
I wish that escalators were in scope for the project.
I don't know if there are guidelines regarding when and where escalators are to be specified but surely the foot count up and down the stairs at the western end of the platforms would justify escalators?
I could not imagine construction of a new two level major station without them. No doubt grandfather clauses apply here, though.
Pre-pandemic I saw many frail or elderly passengers struggling on these stairs with heavy suitcases, either unaware of the lifts or unwilling to wait for one to arrive.

FJ

There is a counter intuitive principle that escalators can ‘lift’ fewer people than stairs for a given width. For short rises, stairs have a higher capacity.
 

najaB

Veteran Member
Joined
28 Aug 2011
Messages
30,780
Location
Scotland
There is a counter intuitive principle that escalators can ‘lift’ fewer people than stairs for a given width. For short rises, stairs have a higher capacity.
Especially since it's easier to increase the width of a flight of stairs than it is to install a second escalator.
 

PaxVobiscum

Established Member
Joined
4 Feb 2012
Messages
2,397
Location
Glasgow
I see the Platform 9 lift opening has been confirmed for Monday 26/4/21:
We'll bring the new lift to and from Platform 9 into service on Monday, accessed via the Dundas Street end of the platform. We'll take the current lift out of service the same day, to allow us to carry out some work on it.
Nice accompanying photo taken from the now not-to-be 1st Class Lounge (AKA Retail Unit 7).
8C584E47-D590-4190-B427-1C6E875AA7AE.jpeg
 
Joined
14 Mar 2021
Messages
192
Location
Glasgow
There is a counter intuitive principle that escalators can ‘lift’ fewer people than stairs for a given width. For short rises, stairs have a higher capacity.
@Bald Rick I accept your point that escalators have a lower capacity than stairs.

It appears that Network Rail recognise that there is risk of falls on these stairs and they tried to partially mitigate this risk with the annoying automated announcements that our esteemed correspondent @PaxVobiscum tried to avoid in his latest video. I doubt that these announcements do much to mitigate the risk.

The new lifts will be another action to mitigate the risk. They might be a more effective mitigation, particularly if they are clearly visible to passengers on the platform walking towards the western stairs. Unfortunately, if they are too slow, then some passengers will not wait and the mitigation is less effective.

If Network Rail replaced the exiting western stairs with escalators, then there would be queuing on the platforms, which would be another risk.

It seems to me that a solution would be to excavate and build a pair of platform level halls, one per platform, at the western end, below the high level hall, with escalators, stairs and lifts together for transit between the two levels. The queuing would be off the platforms in the halls. Obviously, this solution would cost a lot more than like for like replacement of stairs with escalators, but given the major reconstruction of this station I wonder why it was not in scope?

Regards

FJ
 

PaxVobiscum

Established Member
Joined
4 Feb 2012
Messages
2,397
Location
Glasgow
I would suggest that the requirement to keep the station operating during the period of works (apart of course for the necessary short period of closure of the High Level for the tunnel slab track renewal) would make that pretty difficult with the pre-COVID19 level of service. That and the enormous cost of course ;).
 

NotATrainspott

Established Member
Joined
2 Feb 2013
Messages
3,223
Maybe the best chance of improving access to the lower level platforms will come when the car park site is developed. It'd be relatively easy to open up the eastern ends of the platforms and integrate new lifts and escalators into the basement and foundations of the new build. There was a concept to put fairly large buildings to the north and south of the railway, with a sort of public square in between. At the very least, you could make the eastern end able to handle many more passengers, giving you more room to improve the western end too.
 

NotATrainspott

Established Member
Joined
2 Feb 2013
Messages
3,223
DESIGNS Revealed For Further Major Redevelopment At Queen Street Station


PLANS have been drawn up for the next stage of the transformation of Queen Street station.

A major new building is proposed for the former car park area beside North Hanover Street.

It would house a new concourse, passenger facilities — including retail and food/drink outlets — and operational accommodation for train staff.


The structure would act as a platform for possible future major office development above but, until those plans are brought forward, a roof-level plaza would be formed.


Documents submitted to Glasgow City Council state: “The development is split into two elements, the Podium Deck (a space for operational space, retail, food and beverages etc.) and the Above Podium Development Deck (a space for a commercial development).

“The podium deck will accommodate two levels to the south where it provides passenger spaces and three to the north for operational functions.”

Above and below, how the building would look on the North Hanover Street and Cathedral Street sides
The documents continue: “The overarching ambition is that when complete the site will be an integrated, innovative, commercial hub bringing together a key transport hub, Grade A office and retail tenant space.

“Inside the podium is a significant new station concourse which provides step-free access to the low-level Platforms 8 and 9.

“The concourse is also connected directly to the mainline station concourse creating a ‘one station’ experience across the stations levels.

“New entrances to the concourse are provided adjacent to the Millennium Hotel and at the midpoint on North Hanover Street opposite Martha Street. It can also be accessed from the plaza level via lifts and escalators.

“A significant part of the station experience will be a new concourse mezzanine. The mezzanine will be lined with retail. It is expected that people will dwell on the mezzanine and watch the activity of the concourse below while enjoying a meal or drink.”

The submission adds: “At the roof level of the podium, a new public plaza is proposed, providing access to and from the station as well as landscaped amenity space. The plaza will be created as a meanwhile use, until a future development in delivered

“In the meanwhile condition, the plaza is proposed as an open, public plaza planted with soft landscape and incorporating rooftop retail with breakout seating and a new pavilion entrance to the station.

“The plaza will be accessible via public steps from North Hanover Street and from street at Cathedral Street as well as from the station concourse below via lifts and escalators.

“In this configuration, plots have been designated to the north and south of the site and provision made within the podium accordingly. In this scenario the central space will be retained as a landscaped public space.

“This podium project is recognised as the first step in a bigger project for the site and as such the remit for the podium includes delivery of a flexible development deck which can enable the delivery 300,000 sq.ft. of commercial buildings by others in the future.”

Major redevelopment work has already been carried over the past few years on the existing station facilities.

Here are the two planning applications with more details.

21/01480/PAP | Redevelopment of former car park to provide station operational and passenger facilities including retail | Queen Street Station 38 George Square Glasgow

21/01473/LBA | Alterations to trainshed, hotel wall, site boundary wall and bridge. | Queen Street Station 38 George Square Glasgow

This is exactly what Queen Street needed. NR will build out the station services under a development deck on the same level as Cathedral Street. Then, once commercial conditions are correct, a developer can come in and build an office or other development on top without affecting the station operations.
 

Speed43125

Member
Joined
20 Jul 2019
Messages
1,136
Location
Dunblane
Certainly seems like a good idea, the current concourse is always full of passengers milling around waiting just outside the gateline, I'm sure an enlarged facility would come very much in handy.
 

swt_passenger

Veteran Member
Joined
7 Apr 2010
Messages
31,376
Wow, that should keep this thread going for another few years then. It’s going to be quite a massive change to access to the low level platforms.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Top