GTR Electrostar refurbishments: 377s and 387s

[physics34]

As i said dont get too excited with the 'refurbishment' of these units its just some electrical improvements.

 

[Chiltern006]

with regards to screens, they are the same as seen on the Heathrow Express 387s

 

[JonathanH]

Surely the 3 plus 2 seating could be reduced to a more spacious layout in this new world

Who would pay for that?

It can just be used by passengers in a 2+1 formation in the future.

 

[Fincra5]

Would be nice if the class 377 refurbishment retains its current seats but optimise its for a 2x2 layout across all coaches and provide more 2 seaters. Would also be helpful if they improved first class because its abysmal compared to other TOC's. Secondly, but most importantly, why is southern doing this massive refurbishment on relatively modern stock when they have old class 455 cattle carriages running around the network that are in bad need of replacing. If they are not going to replace it, which is clearly the case at the moment, then refurbish it with a modern interior and put 2X2 seating, arm rests, tables, coat hooks, luggage racks, air-con, plugs and please please CHANGE THE MOTOR. The acceleration is awfully slow and bumpy. Literally just shudders the whole train when pulling away from the station and when putting the acceleration into neutral. Horrible ride!

Also do we know when Class 377 430 is expected to come out. Its been in the depot for refurbishing for quite some time now and I believe its the first 377 for refurbishing with the track light, sockets etc.

One last thing: I cannot stand the southern livery they should take this opportunity to change it.

I suppose you best ask the Department for Transport, as they have the Franchise Purse... 455s will go eventually when funding is given for a replacement or stock is shuffled. Of course the situation is different ATM.

No idea when 430 is out, suppose they're making sure it all works and is currently compatible with other 377s (Or has to run solo only).

The SN livery is fine. Complete waste of finite money to repaint the outside of the train, especially when the paintwork was refreshed not all too long ago!

 

[Energy]

455s will go eventually when funding is given for a replacement or stock is shuffled.

If I remember correctly the 455s and 313s are very cheap to lease, the 313s also don't have a toilet at all so aren't required to have a disabled one meaning that PRM hasn't been a problem for the 313s unlike other older stock.

 

[GeekyJamez]

Surely it would make sense for Southern to take on the Class 379's from Greater Anglia to replace the 313's

 

[Recessio]

Surely it would make sense for Southern to take on the Class 379's from Greater Anglia to replace the 313's

No 3rd rail gear, iirc, but 313 replacement has been talked to death in other threads, lets stay on topic.

Any news of if these types of refurbs will extend to other Electrostar-derived units or Turbostars?

 

[Metal_gee_man]

No 3rd rail gear, iirc, but 313 replacement has been talked to death in other threads, lets stay on topic.

Any news of if these types of refurbs will extend to other Electrostar-derived units or Turbostars?

The turbostars (171s) won't be touched by Southern, they'll be gone within the next few years to EMR, its just a matter of time.

I'd really like to see SE do something to their 375s but at 20 years old and only refurbished between 3-6 years ago I very much doubt it, they'll keep going for another 10 years and be scrapped as most EMUs do after 30 years service

 

[Chiltern006]

Credit to Dispatch Jack on Twitter. 377430 at Horsham

 

[Energy]

What screens are they?

 

[365 Networker]

Credit to Dispatch Jack on Twitter. 377430 at Horsham

It looks like they’ve changed the font on the PIS to match the newer Electrostars, but the older screens are too small, and the ‘P’s and ‘D’s have all been cut of.

 

[317 forever]

The grey seating looks less suited to Southern than the green seating did.

 

[bramling]

The turbostars (171s) won't be touched by Southern, they'll be gone within the next few years to EMR, its just a matter of time.

I'd really like to see SE do something to their 375s but at 20 years old and only refurbished between 3-6 years ago I very much doubt it, they'll keep going for another 10 years and be scrapped as most EMUs do after 30 years service

I’d be surprised if the Electrostars go early. They have the big advantage of being a pretty big fleet.

I know the same applies to something like 321s, however the difference is that they are now pretty obsolete, whereas Electrostars are still not massively different to current technology. Like most modern trains they’re also modular, which makes them easier to keep going.

 

[Bletchleyite]

The grey seating looks less suited to Southern than the green seating did.

You mean the picture in post 159? It's the same green moquette as before. If it ain't broke...

 

[43096]

You mean the picture in post 159? It's the same green moquette as before. If it ain't broke...

Thing is, it is broke. They've replaced that astroturf several times over the years. Lesson never learnt...

 

[RealTrains07]

I'd really like to see SE do something to their 375s but at 20 years old and only refurbished between 3-6 years ago I very much doubt it, they'll keep going for another 10 years and be scrapped as most EMUs do after 30 years service

The 375s have already been refurbished recently though. Plus SE are going to be adding plug sockets, LED lighting and updated CCTV as part of a packpage of futher improvements.

I think all electrostars like the 377s and 387s included will be staying for a while yet especially if GTR are taking time to refurbish their 2 fleets

 

[supervc-10]

I’d be surprised if the Electrostars go early. They have the big advantage of being a pretty big fleet.

I know the same applies to something like 321s, however the difference is that they are now pretty obsolete, whereas Electrostars are still not massively different to current technology. Like most modern trains they’re also modular, which makes them easier to keep going.

Across the whole GTR fleet- 1086 cars of Electrostar! By my maths and Wiki's numbers anyway! Not to mention further Electrostar units at other companies, which helps maintain the spares availability. I know there's a lot of differences from the earliest and latest units, but still.

I cannot see them going anywhere any time soon, they'll be like the Slammers they replaced I think.

 

[Energy]

I know there's a lot of differences from the earliest and latest units, but still.

The 379 onwards is where it changed a little to be more aventra like.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

Credit to Dispatch Jack on Twitter. 377430 at Horsham

I’m sad that they’ve replaced the original PIS with the 377/6 and 387 style PIS. I know it’s not a huge deal in the grand scheme of things, but the original one had a far smarter font.

 

[supervc-10]

Aren't the 377/6 and 377/7 closer to the 379s though?

GTR have a fair few of the newer Electrostars too- with 387s at Great Northern and Gatwick Express.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

Credit to Dispatch Jack on Twitter. 377430 at Horsham

Was 377 430 out today then?

I did think I had seen it when I was doing my food shopping trip, but kept telling myself "Nah... I must have misread 377 420 instead!"

 

[Energy]

Aren't the 377/6 and 377/7 closer to the 379s though?

Yep, 379/387 (very similar trains) and 377/5/6/7 are new gen electrostars which share features with the aventra, differences to earlier electrostars include the software.

 

[RichardKing]

I’m sad that they’ve replaced the original PIS with the 377/6 and 387 style PIS. I know it’s not a huge deal in the grand scheme of things, but the original one had a far smarter font.

Yeah, I'm inclined to agree with this. Also, the PIS announcements in the newer systems seem to be a lot slower. Hopefully this isn't the case in the refurbs.

 

[physics34]

Thing is, it is broke. They've replaced that astroturf several times over the years. Lesson never learnt...

Yep bizarre. The colour shows up dirt and the fabric (which i think is just normal stuff just unbrushed) seems to wear out quicker

 

[Jturner98]

For anyone that's interested

 

[Aictos]

I've had a senior member of the GTR management team confirm and they stated that and I quote "We will modify a range of units this year. Each tranche of electrostars is different so we will modify the first of each type to validate the design and production process".

No idea which 377/1, 377/2 and 377/3 will be done but for now just watch this space.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

It looks like they’ve changed the font on the PIS to match the newer Electrostars, but the older screens are too small, and the ‘P’s and ‘D’s have all been cut of.

Is it even PRM compliant then...

 

[365 Networker]

Is it even PRM compliant then...

Hopefully it can be corrected, as I can see it causing issues. Are units inspected for PRM compliance?

 

[aleggatta]

It looks like they’ve changed the font on the PIS to match the newer Electrostars, but the older screens are too small, and the ‘P’s and ‘D’s have all been cut of.

Hopefully it can be corrected, as I can see it causing issues. Are units inspected for PRM compliance?

The issue with the old screens having letters cut off, actually arises from the display not being sat correctly in the aperture, and I can honestly say from experience they are a bugger to change, and you pretty much have to take the whole thing apart again just to adjust the height of the display after you have fitted the display and tested the screen, something that, when a unit is needed for service or shift end is approaching, those supervising just want to see a functioning screen, as opposed to one 'perfectly viewable'.

 

[455Commuter]

The issue with the old screens having letters cut off, actually arises from the display not being sat correctly in the aperture, and I can honestly say from experience they are a bugger to change, and you pretty much have to take the whole thing apart again just to adjust the height of the display after you have fitted the display and tested the screen, something that, when a unit is needed for service or shift end is approaching, those supervising just want to see a functioning screen, as opposed to one 'perfectly viewable'.

It could be that, though I'm tempted to say the cutoff is a side-effect of the rolling shutter commonly found on cameras