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GWR Pullman dining reinstated

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Butts

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I’m curious, have you actually used the GWR Pullman dining service since the HSTs were retired?

Does it have the same "ergonomically friendly" seats as the rest of the 1st Class - aka ironing boards as opposed to the armchairs on the old HST's ?

Perhaps he feels the ambience is not what it was ?
 

Wilts Wanderer

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Does it have the same "ergonomically friendly" seats as the rest of the 1st Class - aka ironing boards as opposed to the armchairs on the old HST's ?

Perhaps he feels the ambience is not what it was ?

The ergonomics of the IET seats in general is subjective. Personally I can’t imagine a better dining environment than a Mark 1 Open First - apart from the fact the deep cushioned seats are incredibly uncomfortable after sitting for about 30 minutes, and leaning forward to eat. I find the IET first class seats very comfortable, and the standard class seats slightly less so. Equally the HST first class leather seats were not my cup of tea.
 

RPI

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Yes. Food good, migraine from bright lighting and backache from seat not so good. Never again. Ever.
I suppose its subjective and I've suffered a sore a*se in standard many a time but a bad back definitely not, one of the few ailments I havent suffered on an IET as the posture that they created is actually good for your back, but we digress.

I've heard rumblings that the breakfast pullmans may be making a return, this is just from various customer host's though and not heard from any management.
 

Private Baxter

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The ergonomics of the IET seats in general is subjective. Personally I can’t imagine a better dining environment than a Mark 1 Open First - apart from the fact the deep cushioned seats are incredibly uncomfortable after sitting for about 30 minutes, and leaning forward to eat. I find the IET first class seats very comfortable, and the standard class seats slightly less so. Equally the HST first class leather seats were not my cup of tea.
I accept that the size of the HST seats were not quite right for dining, but other than that, they managed to get it absolutely spot on, from the colour scheme, to the lighting, which in turn allowed for those mini (fake!!) candles on evening services. Its simple touches like that, along with the Pullman crockery, that was the icing on the cake. I do find the current seats comfortable enough, but in my opinion it needs a more inspiring interior design, and the lighting needs to be far less bright.
I've heard rumblings that the breakfast pullmans may be making a return, this is just from various customer host's though and not heard from any management.
I will take that just as gossip for now, especially as it has been confirmed by the MD that it won't be coming back. However, from my own observations breakfasts had always been pretty popular (at a good price as well) and thought it would continue to do well especially for those travelling on new flexi season tickets. The up WoE breakfast always returned as the first down lunch which was usually very well used.
 

Goldfish62

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I've heard rumblings that the breakfast pullmans may be making a return, this is just from various customer host's though and not heard from any management.
Hopwood has stated in Modern Railways that breakfast will not be returning ever due to already pre-pandemic low demand.
 

Ianno87

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I will take that just as gossip for now, especially as it has been confirmed by the MD that it won't be coming back. However, from my own observations breakfasts had always been pretty popular (at a good price as well) and thought it would continue to do well especially for those travelling on new flexi season tickets. The up WoE breakfast always returned as the first down lunch which was usually very well used.

Hopwood has stated in Modern Railways that breakfast will not be returning ever due to already pre-pandemic low demand.

If I were travelling on business, and was being paid to go first class, then I think the expectation would be that you'd be using the time productively to start your working day at the laptop with a coffee and a croissant, not tucking into an elaborate breakfast (which is really from the days of carrying papers around in your briefcase)
 

HamworthyGoods

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Hopwood has stated in Modern Railways that breakfast will not be returning ever due to already pre-pandemic low demand.

He didn’t actually say ever, he just said it’s not currently planned to return, subtle difference.
 

HamworthyGoods

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So subtle I think most people would read it as not coming back, caput, gone.

He said he doesn’t think it’ll be back as the new market will be leisure travel not the early morning, however I’m sure if West Country Business traffic does take back off it will come back. It’s all a bit crystal ball gazing at the moment.
 

Private Baxter

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If I were travelling on business, and was being paid to go first class, then I think the expectation would be that you'd be using the time productively to start your working day at the laptop with a coffee and a croissant, not tucking into an elaborate breakfast (which is really from the days of carrying papers around in your briefcase)
Interesting point, and not something I have really considered. However considering breakfast was only available on two services before (one from Swansea, another from Plymouth) then most first class customers did as you described, whilst a small yet loyal customer base made use of the Pullman. I know that some would choose that train specifically.
He didn’t actually say ever, he just said it’s not currently planned to return, subtle difference.

So subtle I think most people would read it as not coming back, caput, gone.
Agree with both points. He did not say it would never come back, however from what was said can safely rule it out making a return any time soon. It is a shame, but think that the replacement lunch/dinner from Swansea will be a worthwhile replacement, and who knows, if it takes off perhaps they can, in time add a down lunch as well.
 

43096

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Hopwood has stated in Modern Railways that breakfast will not be returning ever due to already pre-pandemic low demand.
So there's even less justification for the loss of passenger space with the kitchen equipment on the 80x fleet. It either needs to be used for its intended purpose, removed, or moved/re-purposed to allow a proper buffet service open to all that would benefit many more people.
 

Goldfish62

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So there's even less justification for the loss of passenger space with the kitchen equipment on the 80x fleet. It either needs to be used for its intended purpose, removed, or moved/re-purposed to allow a proper buffet service open to all that would benefit many more people.
Indeed. I had thought that GWR would have moved to some sort of complimentary meal offering as per LNER and AWC in order to best utilise the kitchens, but clearly they still prefer being the Tesco Value (without the low prices) long distance operator.
 

Ianno87

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So there's even less justification for the loss of passenger space with the kitchen equipment on the 80x fleet. It either needs to be used for its intended purpose, removed, or moved/re-purposed to allow a proper buffet service open to all that would benefit many more people.

Old hat.

At seat ordering is the future (via an App serviced from a central galley)
 

43096

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Old hat.

At seat ordering is the future (via an App serviced from a central galley)
By whatever method, the principle remains the same - it would be a far better use of that space that would benefit many more people than the Pullman dining on a minimal number of services.
 

Goldfish62

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By whatever method, the principle remains the same - it would be a far better use of that space that would benefit many more people than the Pullman dining on a minimal number of services.
Completely agree.
 

Private Baxter

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By whatever method, the principle remains the same - it would be a far better use of that space that would benefit many more people than the Pullman dining on a minimal number of services.
Hopefully the kitchens will eventually become multi use, including for Pullman on selected services. Food delivered via an app is, I believe the way forward, though due to the location of the kitchens on the IETs, I could see it becoming very annoying, esp for first class passengers, with customer hosts constantly going in and out with customer orders across the train.
 

Goldfish62

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Hopefully the kitchens will eventually become multi use, including for Pullman on selected services. Food delivered via an app is, I believe the way forward, though due to the location of the kitchens on the IETs, I could see it becoming very annoying, esp for first class passengers, with customer hosts constantly going in and out with customer orders across the train.
Not of course an issue on LNER as the food comes from the buffet.
 

williamn

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Big shame that the lunchtime down train won't be coming back, I loved taking that!
 

WesternLancer

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He said he doesn’t think it’ll be back as the new market will be leisure travel not the early morning, however I’m sure if West Country Business traffic does take back off it will come back. It’s all a bit crystal ball gazing at the moment.
Odd, because EMT used to sell the best part of 2 Mk 3 carriages of an HST on the Nottm to St P run every Saturday morning (even before it became an all inclusive breakfast with the 1st class ticket). No doubt 95%+ leisure travellers. Used to think it was a good deal because it fills you up enough to not need much of a lunch later on, so good value as a result.
 

Goldfish62

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Odd, because EMT used to sell the best part of 2 Mk 3 carriages of an HST on the Nottm to St P run every Saturday morning (even before it became an all inclusive breakfast with the 1st class ticket). No doubt 95%+ leisure travellers. Used to think it was a good deal because it fills you up enough to not need much of a lunch later on, so good value as a result.
I think one of the issues is that the GWR Pullman offering is pitched as a high-end silver service (and expensive) product rather than a good basic meal.
 

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