Leeds Station Improvement

tbtc

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If I recall correctly Network Rail also have to pay TOCs compensation when they close a station, in this case to alter the track to add the new platform for a number of days, that very likely doesn't come cheap.

You are correct, which can make things look more expensive (since the TOC has signed a contract to deliver those services, so needs to be compensated if it's unable to do so)

This is one problem with people who make comparisons with BR schemes - it was easy for BR to hide the true cost of projects, e.g. they could just scrap the evening service on a line for a year to give plenty of time for long engineering possessions, they could dump the signalling costs onto another project so that the first one appeared to be good value for money. Whereas nowadays things have to be accounted for properly, you have to compensate the train operating side of things (even if that's just another cost centre in the same business).

I'm not criticising the BR approach - accounting was very different back then - but it means that trying to make comparisons to what things cost back then was is always a bit doomed - people like to criticise the modern railway by pointing out that "...but British Rail managed to rebuild/ electrify/ re-model for just a fiver plus a bag of crisps for the engineer", whereas the truth is more like "this was just the net cost of the materials, and everything else was fudged to hide the other costs in other columns".
 
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YorksLad12

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Do the 80x often use anything lower than Platform 6? Not sure which would be long enough for a 9-car - possiby all of them apart from 3 and 4.

I should have added a ;) at the end of my 800/801 comment ;)
I think the 5-car sets that sometimes run on the Harrogate extensions could use 0 to 5 but they still use 6 and 8.
Before the Leeds rebuild in 2000, platform 1 was platform W which could take 14 carriages.

That's where the former North of London Eurostars that GNER hired used to spend the night, I think. P1 was extended a bit shortly after Leeds 1st was completed in 2001; not sure if that extension is still there or if it went to accommodate P0's track access.
 

JRT

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I should have added a ;) at the end of my 800/801 comment ;)
I think the 5-car sets that sometimes run on the Harrogate extensions could use 0 to 5 but they still use 6 and 8.


That's where the former North of London Eurostars that GNER hired used to spend the night, I think. P1 was extended a bit shortly after Leeds 1st was completed in 2001; not sure if that extension is still there or if it went to accommodate P0's track access.
Platform 0 operational length 204 metres

Platform 1 normal operating length 215 m, however the full length of 274 m can be used if necessary.

Platform 2 209 m (before latest changes)
Platform 5 205 m
Platform 6 279 m
 

61653 HTAFC

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The London to Skipton used to use P1, no idea if it still does. As mentioned the shortened TMSTs used to mostly use W/1 which they overhung, though they sometimes used 5/8 which (once it became 8 and was longer) they could fit with room to spare.
 

johntea

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What is going on with Leeds station now?

Lots of workmen and various barriers up around the main concourse area and outside the front entrance!
 

HarryL

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What is going on with Leeds station now?

Lots of workmen and various barriers up around the main concourse area and outside the front entrance!
I've heard they're putting the new concourse floor down finally as it wasn't done during the rest of the refurbishment, not sure how true it is though as I haven't seen it myself.
 

yorksrob

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Yes, the days of the shiny BR terrazzo are numbered. It's being replaced with rustic looking stone paving.
 

YorksLad12

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Yes, the days of the shiny BR terrazzo are numbered. It's being replaced with rustic looking stone paving.
But... they added bits to the shiny floor didn't they during the work in 2018/19? Pity nothing can be done with the platforms themselves; was told that they attract condensation, being over the river, so it's a safety issue.
 

yorksrob

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But... they added bits to the shiny floor didn't they during the work in 2018/19? Pity nothing can be done with the platforms themselves; was told that they attract condensation, being over the river, so it's a safety issue.

Yes, they've changed the band around the edge a while back.

The platforms were only painted grey when the station was remodelled in the early noughties. Presumably they could paint them again !
 

YorksLad12

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Question: What was the usable length of platform 1 before the work started? It's 215m (behind L3672) in the most recent Sectional Appendix, but I only started looking at those last year so don't know what it used to be. If it used to be used to stable the North of London Eurostars GNER had on lease it should have been at least 345m (14x23m coaches plus one engine, with the other one hanging off the end), which is quite a difference.
 

swt_passenger

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Question: What was the usable length of platform 1 before the work started? It's 215m (behind L3672) in the most recent Sectional Appendix, but I only started looking at those last year so don't know what it used to be. If it used to be used to stable the North of London Eurostars GNER had on lease it should have been at least 345m (14x23m coaches plus one engine, with the other one hanging off the end), which is quite a difference.
Most intermediate 373 coaches are significantly shorter, ie 18.7m according to wiki. That possibly gets you down towards around 300m.
 

CyrusWuff

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Most intermediate 373 coaches are significantly shorter, ie 18.7m according to wiki. That possibly gets you down towards around 300m.
Also according to Wiki (in the main body of the Class 373 article), the NoL sets were just over 312m long.

Operating restrictions for the NoL sets between London and York (but not Leeds for some reason) still feature in the London North Eastern Sectional Appendix, and were apparently last updated in April 2017(!) They could use Platforms 1 and 6 at Kings Cross; 1, 3, 4 and 8 at Doncaster; and 3, 5, 9, 10 and 11 at York.
 

yorksrob

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They were running NOL sets between Leeds and London !!!!!

(Southern Railway joke)
 

skyhigh

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Yes, the days of the shiny BR terrazzo are numbered. It's being replaced with rustic looking stone paving.
Is it? They've put down some kind of chipboard so far. Looks very odd, but I assumed they'd be putting something down on top. They also seem to be doing some tarmacking where the old barrier line used to be.
 

yorksrob

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Is it? They've put down some kind of chipboard so far. Looks very odd, but I assumed they'd be putting something down on top. They also seem to be doing some tarmacking where the old barrier line used to be.

Ha ha, yes I actually walked on it today, and it is indeed chip-board.

In my defense, my eyesight isn't what it was :lol:
 

asharpe

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Noticed a new departures screen on platform 5. Shame that it shows departures from London Liverpool Street.

Also any idea if the stairwell down to Neville Street will reopen?
 

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YorksLad12

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The idea was to close it. Then the idea was to replace it with a lift or lifts once the rest of the work to pedestrianise (read: turn into cafes and seating areas so you can't walk past easily) Bishopgate Street happens. If it happens. But if they at least install the shorter run of steps up near where the new crossing point is I'd imagine it'll be shut for good.
 

59CosG95

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I saw on NR's May Bank Holiday Works page that Platforms 4 to 6 are having a re-model - is there any further indication to the scope of this?
 
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I saw on NR's May Bank Holiday Works page that Platforms 4 to 6 are having a re-model - is there any further indication to the scope of this?
Could this be to extend platform 5 to accommodate a 10-carriage Azuma?

I seem to remember reading about this a while ago, although I’m not sure whether this has a grain of truth to it. True or not, taking Azumas off of the though lines will be very beneficial.
 

quantinghome

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Could this be to extend platform 5 to accommodate a 10-carriage Azuma?

I seem to remember reading about this a while ago, although I’m not sure whether this has a grain of truth to it. True or not, taking Azumas off of the though lines will be very beneficial.
I don't think it involves any significant change in platform length. It's modifying the approach tracks, presumably to allow more efficient use of the platforms.
 

YorksLad12

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Could this be to extend platform 5 to accommodate a 10-carriage Azuma?

I seem to remember reading about this a while ago, although I’m not sure whether this has a grain of truth to it. True or not, taking Azumas off of the though lines will be very beneficial.
Platform 5 is only 205m long according to the Sectional Appendix, well short of the mark needed for 10 carriages. An extension to P5 was in the plan after P0 was done, I believe, but everything has been delayed on that front. That might have been for local/Northern units though.

Having the London train on P8 is useful, as you don't need to drag your luggage around (as you do for the XC services); the regular xx15 departures from P6 and xx45 from P8 were easy to remember as well, before the Azumas came in. But it does hog one through road/four virtual platforms for 30 minutes in each hour, which doesn't seem efficient.
 

JRT

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Could this be to extend platform 5 to accommodate a 10-carriage Azuma?

I seem to remember reading about this a while ago, although I’m not sure whether this has a grain of truth to it. True or not, taking Azumas off of the though lines will be very beneficial.
I seem to remember the idea of the Platform 0 wasn't to have an extra local platform, but to move trains along, that is trains that used platforms 1-5 & 8 to use platforms 0-4 & 5 instead, freeing up platform 8 to be used as a through platform for all York & beyond services.
 
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YorksLad12

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I seem to remember the idea of the Platform 0 wasn't to have a new local platform, but to move trains along, that is trains using platforms 1-5 & 8 to use platforms 0-4 & 5 instead, freeing up platform 8 to be used as a through platform for all York & beyond services.
So... it would be a new local platform then? ;)
My understanding was that it (also) made it easier to run 6-car services in the peaks.

In an/my ideal world [redacted as speculative].

Update: we have a residents letter. The important bits are:

"We will be installing four pile foundations, which will support the erecting of additional overhead line equipment between platforms 4 and 6. We will also be moving some of the signalling equipment.

"Our teams will be working from 00.01 on Sunday 30 May until 4.00 on Monday 31 May. The piling work... is planned through the day on Sunday 30 May from 08.00 until 20.00

"For this work to be carried out safely, some of the platforms at Leeds will be closed on Sunday 30 May..."

Compared to what information they gave us during the P0 work this is practically a novel. I'd have added the benefit of the work, but it's still useful.
 
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Halifaxlad

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I've been through Leeds tonight so here's a few photos. Laying of the new floor over the Southern concourse has begun and appears to be progressing well.

IMG_20210506_172436.jpg
IMG_20210505_124340.jpg

By the Ticket gates on the other side of the barriers is very impressive.

IMG_20210506_211037.jpg

The windows on the Northern concourse have been covered over, presumably in prep for some work.

IMG_20210506_210400.jpg

They're is also this small section of scaffolding along the Southern Wall adjacent to the footbridge, don't know what's going on.

IMG_20210506_211539.jpg
 

skyhigh

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The windows on the Northern concourse have been covered over, presumably in prep for some work.
The staff areas have been painted over the last couple of weeks so I suspect they'll be moving into the public areas next.
 

HarryL

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The new concourse floor looks good but is there any particular reason it wasn't done during the rest of the rebuild? Seems like an odd oversight unless they couldn't get the materials to do it properly before.

Are they also going to do the other concourse floor to match?
 

yorksrob

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I've been through Leeds tonight so here's a few photos. Laying of the new floor over the Southern concourse has begun and appears to be progressing well.

View attachment 95640
View attachment 95641

By the Ticket gates on the other side of the barriers is very impressive.

View attachment 95642

The windows on the Northern concourse have been covered over, presumably in prep for some work.

View attachment 95645

They're is also this small section of scaffolding along the Southern Wall adjacent to the footbridge, don't know what's going on.

View attachment 95644

Certainly the inside of the trainshed needs a good clean. Perhaps they're getting round to it.
 

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