Lothian Group discussion (Lothian City, Lothian Country Bus and East Coast Buses)

[FlybeDash8Q400]

I've seen it about 3/4 times within the last month or so.
Yea it's understandable, I've noticed a drastic increase in traffic in Broxburn and Pumpherston so yea hopefully they do go back to normal schedules.

Are you sure it’s pairs and not duplicates? Not sure if they are running duplicates at the minute though - duplicates as a general rule won’t show in timetables but some do. I do find though that it’s quite difficult (although not impossible) for a 30 minute service to run directly in pairs.

 

[Graham Alexand]

Are you sure it’s pairs and not duplicates? Not sure if they are running duplicates at the minute though - duplicates as a general rule won’t show in timetables but some do. I do find though that it’s quite difficult (although not impossible) for a 30 minute service to run directly in pairs.

I usually refer to Google maps and bustimes.org because they're usually very accurate.

Google maps one says "27 mins delayed" an the next says "on time".

Then I am off to check bustimes.org an on the map the 2 buses (275's) are bacically nose to tail.

Since I use the 2 sources I'm pretty certain that it is running in a pair (but this could also be unreliable, unlikely but never rule out a possibility ).

Image below shows two 275's running within a minute of each other.

 

[route101]

I usually refer to Google maps and bustimes.org because they're usually very accurate.

Google maps one says "27 mins delayed" an the next says "on time".

Then I am off to check bustimes.org an on the map the 2 buses (275's) are bacically nose to tail.

Since I use the 2 sources I'm pretty certain that it is running in a pair (but this could also be unreliable, unlikely but never rule out a possibility ).

Image below shows two 275's running within a minute of each other.
View attachment 96268

Interesting, never knew Bus Times.org had real time maps. Is that just for certain areas?

 

[RomeoCharlie71]

Interesting, never knew Bus Times.org had real time maps. Is that just for certain areas?

Lots of operators show on bustimes.org. You can see the full map at http://bustimes.org/map

 

[Graham Alexand]

Interesting, never knew Bus Times.org had real time maps. Is that just for certain areas?

Depends on the company, Lothian Country/ EastCoastBuses and Lothian Buses have both a fleet list on Bustimes.org and a map.

 

[mb88]

I usually refer to Google maps and bustimes.org because they're usually very accurate.

Google maps one says "27 mins delayed" an the next says "on time".

Then I am off to check bustimes.org an on the map the 2 buses (275's) are bacically nose to tail.

Since I use the 2 sources I'm pretty certain that it is running in a pair (but this could also be unreliable, unlikely but never rule out a possibility ).

Image below shows two 275's running within a minute of each other.
View attachment 96268

Oddly, Google maps continuously shows the 281s as running 15 minutes late even when they are on time.

 

[Graham Alexand]

Oddly, Google maps continuously shows the 281s as running 15 minutes late even when they are on time.

It may be different across other services.(?)

 

[FlybeDash8Q400]

I usually refer to Google maps and bustimes.org because they're usually very accurate.

Google maps one says "27 mins delayed" an the next says "on time".

Then I am off to check bustimes.org an on the map the 2 buses (275's) are bacically nose to tail.

Since I use the 2 sources I'm pretty certain that it is running in a pair (but this could also be unreliable, unlikely but never rule out a possibility ).

Image below shows two 275's running within a minute of each other.
View attachment 96268

Bus times yes can be very accurate most of the time so you’re right there but Google maps is known at times to be extremely inaccurate, often showing delays of 400+ mins when clearly that wouldn’t happen so that’s one to watch out for. I’ve seen this happen with both buses and it seems to be even worse with trains. I’ve learnt now to basically not use it all due to its unreliability.

It’s probably a very obvious point but the image you’ve attached shows one at Pumpherston, could the second one be a Bathgate bound bus?

 

[Graham Alexand]

Bus times yes can be very accurate most of the time so you’re right there but Google maps is known at times to be extremely inaccurate, often showing delays of 400+ mins when clearly that wouldn’t happen so that’s one to watch out for. I’ve seen this happen with both buses and it seems to be even worse with trains. I’ve learnt now to basically not use it all due to its unreliability.

It’s probably a very obvious point but the image you’ve attached shows one at Pumpherston, could the second one be a Bathgate bound bus?

Yea, one time I seen a 276 delayed for around 2hrs 47mins .

 

[Humberscot]

Yea, one time I seen a 276 delayed for around 2hrs 47mins .

Maybe these LCB buses are waiting, in the desperate hope of picking up any passengers at all!

 

[Graham Alexand]

Maybe these LCB buses are waiting, in the desperate hope of picking up any passengers at all!

The 275 pre pandemic could be actually quite busy sometimes same with X17 (now 276) i think when (well IF) the 275 goes back to the Gyle it may pick up in numbers again.

The 276 I think is a temporary variation of the X17 so we may see that going back to Edinburgh and maybe an increase in numbers (this is my THEORY though) .

 

[Jordan Adam]

The 276 I think is a temporary variation of the X17 so we may see that going back to Edinburgh and maybe an increase in numbers (this is my THEORY though) .

Its permanent.

 

[Lothianbus703]

Is it true that 183 has become a training bus or is this just a lie?

 

[CN04NRJ]

Is it true that 183 has become a training bus or is this just a lie?

That'd be false TB3 is ex 169. 168 is TB2 and 167 is TB1. Heard 170 is TB4 also but haven't seen it.

 

[Graham Alexand]

Its permanent.

Well I had a thought a whlie back it was for the 275/ 276 being both Edinburgh Park services so they'd combine to create a 15min frequency in Livingston and between Uphall and the Gyle.

(Again this is only a Theory)

 

[TheEastCoaster]

Maybe these LCB buses are waiting, in the desperate hope of picking up any passengers at all!

*sigh* are we still going on about LCB never get any passengers? I mean unless you work there how do you really know the numbers? Bore off next question!

Well I had a thought a whlie back it was for the 275/ 276 being both Edinburgh Park services so they'd combine to create a 15min frequency in Livingston and between Uphall and the Gyle.

(Again this is only a Theory)

I would have hoped the 275 would have been extended back to the Gyle in the last change. Maybe they're waiting for Tier 2/1 in June so more offices and places will be open, and if the 276 won’t be extended back to the City Centre they might as well go to the Gyle also!

Maybe re-route it through Winchburgh and Kirkliston to give First a run for their money with the 600

 

[Humberscot]

*sigh* are we still going on about LCB never get any passengers? I mean unless you work there how do you really know the numbers? Bore off next question!



I would of hoped the 275 would of been extended back to the Gyle in the last change, maybe their waiting for Tier 2/1 in June so more offices and places will be open, and if the 276 won’t be extended back to the City Centre they might aswell go to the Gyle also!

Maybe re-route it through Winchburgh and Kirkliston give First a run for their money with the 600

Deary me! People are still going on about LCB never getting any passengers because LCB is still not getting any passengers and it is a pertinent point for discussion. Obviously one doesn't need to work there to observe how many people are travelling on buses. If you don't like the topics on offer for discussion I suggest you go and find another discussion group.

 

[takno]

Deary me! People are still going on about LCB never getting any passengers because LCB is still not getting any passengers and it is a pertinent point for discussion. Obviously one doesn't need to work there to observe how many people are travelling on buses. If you don't like the topics on offer for discussion I suggest you go and find another discussion group.

It's fair to say that this thread was a fair bit less tedious when all the "LCB have no passengers" chat was on a different thread. It's a pertinent point for discussion, but probably not something that many people are interested in.

 

[FlybeDash8Q400]

It's fair to say that this thread was a fair bit less tedious when all the "LCB have no passengers" chat was on a different thread. It's a pertinent point for discussion, but probably not something that many people are interested in.

Agreed re the LC no pax issue.

I find a lot of the repeated material a distraction and clutter, some won’t and I understand that but from my personal view unless it’s relevant to bring an old topic back up (which to be fair sometimes it is) then it’s best being left alone.

Well I had a thought a whlie back it was for the 275/ 276 being both Edinburgh Park services so they'd combine to create a 15min frequency in Livingston and between Uphall and the Gyle.

(Again this is only a Theory)

Won’t say anything about 275/276/X17 etc as I’ve mentioned it before, the old posts are still there if anyone wishes to read them via the search function.

 

[CN04NRJ]

Deary me! People are still going on about LCB never getting any passengers because LCB is still not getting any passengers and it is a pertinent point for discussion. Obviously one doesn't need to work there to observe how many people are travelling on buses. If you don't like the topics on offer for discussion I suggest you go and find another discussion group.

You're plain wrong. By no means are they bursting at the seams with passengers but I live in West Lothian and from what I see every day there's at least an even split between the two companies.

It's a tired discussion that has been over many times and resulted in moderator action. We'll have to see how both companies in West Lothian emerge from the pandemic as numbers recover - and there's the tenders coming up at some point.

 

[Busman757]

I’m guessing no one has actually seen the loads on the X18?

 

[Jordan Adam]

You're plain wrong. By no means are they bursting at the seams with passengers but I live in West Lothian and from what I see every day there's at least an even split between the two companies.

It's a tired discussion that has been over many times and resulted in moderator action. We'll have to see how both companies in West Lothian emerge from the pandemic as numbers recover - and there's the tenders coming up at some point.

Even then in terms of just passenger numbers alone the operators are not really comparable as they operate different frequencies on different corridors. The reality is if you work or favour Lothian you'll likely say Lothian are busier, the same is true of First.

It'll be interesting to see if Lothian bid for the tenders. I can't see them doing so given they didn't bother to bid for the 20, but we'll have to wait and see. Them operating the 31 over the Festive period was a nice surprise and the 40/X40 would fit nicely in with their network, that said i'd imagine E&M will want to keep it as it seems pretty well used.

 

[Bus9120UK]

I’m guessing no one has actually seen the loads on the X18?

It's a local to me, and I 100% have.

 

[CN04NRJ]

The reality is if you work or favour Lothian you'll likely say Lothian are busier, the same is true of First.

I've said neither, just that from what I've seen both companies have similar loadings. Sometimes there'll be an empty First Bus, sometimes there'll be a busy LCB bus and vice versa. Either way it's not sustainable for two operators but we all know how that discussion ends so I'd rather not get into it.

Obviously I'm biased as to which company I'd support overall (although I'm writing this on board a First 21 I'd paid for as just missed the 275!) I hope that both companies can coexist somehow. Doubt it's possible though.

 

[GusB]

Ok, we've already established that certain services have gone and won't come back. Constant speculation about what the route planners might have been thinking is utterly pointless and if new services appear in future there is no guarantee that they'll be the same as before. There's nothing wrong with posting ideas, but at the same time there is no point in flogging a dead horse either!

Could we also stop the "My favourite company has better loadings than yours" rhetoric please? It has no place here.

 

[Lothianbus703]

Ok, we've already established that certain services have gone and won't come back. Constant speculation about what the route planners might have been thinking is utterly pointless and if new services appear in future there is no guarantee that they'll be the same as before. There's nothing wrong with posting ideas, but at the same time there is no point in flogging a dead horse either!

Could we also stop the "My favourite company has better loadings than yours" rhetoric please? It has no place here.

Your right, I think this conversation happens way to much...

 

[cnjb8]

Ok, we've already established that certain services have gone and won't come back. Constant speculation about what the route planners might have been thinking is utterly pointless and if new services appear in future there is no guarantee that they'll be the same as before. There's nothing wrong with posting ideas, but at the same time there is no point in flogging a dead horse either!

Could we also stop the "My favourite company has better loadings than yours" rhetoric please? It has no place here.

Your right, I think this conversation happens way to much...

Yes, it makes this thread incredibly repetitive and boring!

 

[CN04NRJ]

Moving on, had my first ride on one of the new buses. Really impressed by the interior, I find the seats are actually more comfortable than the ones on the MCVs and XLBs etc. Ride quality is excellent and seem to be more powerful than earlier B5TLs.

Build quality is excellent too, hardly a creak and no rattles at all.

As an aside, it's really good to see buses looking busy again. Majority of services I've seen so far today have very good loadings - hopefully that'll only improve from the easing of restrictions further on Monday.

 

[OmniCity999]

Moving on, had my first ride on one of the new buses. Really impressed by the interior, I find the seats are actually more comfortable than the ones on the MCVs and XLBs etc. Ride quality is excellent and seem to be more powerful than earlier B5TLs.

Build quality is excellent too, hardly a creak and no rattles at all.

As an aside, it's really good to see buses looking busy again. Majority of services I've seen so far today have very good loadings - hopefully that'll only improve from the easing of restrictions further on Monday.

View attachment 96312

Having gone through the ADL familiarisation, the bodies are a lot lighter than their Wright Bus counterpart. The thing that is preferred on the ADL front as well is their higher capacity. As well as a better experience for the driver.

Even with two actual wheelchair spaces (as opposed to a wheelchair space and a buggy space) a high seating capacity is maintened!

Everything is nice and snug on the bodywork front, little room for rattles - that's not to say they definately won't develop them!

Advancements in body weight has lightened the overall weight and engine, gearbox and emissions equipment updates and tweaks have made them rather nippy, better for the environment and fuel efficient - better on hills too

Lack of glass staircase can be attributed to weight, maintenance (re-damage from little so and sos in service) and cost - in that order.

Weight and cost has also been saved by seat choice, change of AV/PIS equipment and change of lighting.

 

[Jordan Adam]

I've said neither, just that from what I've seen both companies have similar loadings. Sometimes there'll be an empty First Bus, sometimes there'll be a busy LCB bus and vice versa. Either way it's not sustainable for two operators but we all know how that discussion ends so I'd rather not get into it.

Just for clarity i wasn't saying you were, it was just a generalisation. Anyway!

Moving on, had my first ride on one of the new buses. Really impressed by the interior, I find the seats are actually more comfortable than the ones on the MCVs and XLBs etc. Ride quality is excellent and seem to be more powerful than earlier B5TLs.

Build quality is excellent too, hardly a creak and no rattles at all.

As an aside, it's really good to see buses looking busy again. Majority of services I've seen so far today have very good loadings - hopefully that'll only improve from the easing of restrictions further on Monday.

View attachment 96312

They certainly look fantastic. It was mentioned earlier in the thread but i don't think there's been an answer yet, are they fitted with USB chargers?

Glad to hear the build quality is good, ADL can be very hit or miss at times, one of new the E400MMCs has already had issue with water ingress causing issues with the electrics and it's not even two months old yet!