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Metric / Imperial

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MattA7

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Given imperial measurements are now in the school curriculum (in addition to metric measurements) maybe not. I also recall a few years back trading standards all Unofficially agreed to no longer prosecute stores who only sell in imperial units.
 
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Millisle

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Certainly true for wine but, oddly, spirits seem to come in 70 cl bottles.
Those canny Scotch distillers diddle you out of more than a wee dram in every bottle.

A bottle of spirits was 26 2/3 fluid oz or 75.7 cl before metrication. I was working for a wine merchant at around the time of the change by law to 70cl for all spirits to harmonise spirit bottle sizes across the EEC. Not a popular change with those customers who noticed. I don't remember any price reductions either.
 

Trackman

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I remember at Primary school being told soon we wouldn't be able to have a pint of milk or ask for a quarter of sweets from the shops.
We had a display on the wall saying 'Save our daily pinta!' plus other metric scaremongering.
 

Bald Rick

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As I always say in posts about this subject, I was taught at school in metric, but I also understand and perceive imperial units better.
I can imagine 6ft, but not if someone were to say 1.8* metres
I can imagine 3 miles, but not 4.8* kilometres
I can imagine 16 stone, but not 101* kilos
(*approximately, nobody takes things to 3 or 4 decimal places)

Well of course, but then I can imagine 1 metre much more easily than 3.28 feet, or 80kg more easily than 176.3 pounds.

When cycling, I know that 100k is a long morning ride (in preference to 62.3 miles) but 100 miles is a long day (in preference to 160.9km).

What we are good at is remembering approx round numbers, and trying to convert an approximate round number to an exact non round number is of course not a fair comparison.
 

najaB

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Is there another currency, anywhere in the world, that still persists with a monetary system that doesn't use base 10?
I believe there are still three: Mauritania, Madagascar and Malta (though none of them actually are non-decimal in day to day use.
 

mmh

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Car engines are cubic inches, rather than ccs

That's not correct. Car engine sizes in the US are described in litres (or liters) just as they are here and have been for decades.

I've never known of a preference for pounds for honey, but I agree with pints of beer; less so pints of milk I'd say that's a 40/60 split pints vs litres.

(Fresh) milk is always sold in multiples of pints at supermarkets, but is also bottled in multiples of litres for sale at corner shops where a pint becomes less than a pint.

The metrication fetishists don't seem to realise everyone else realised this years ago.
 

najaB

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Malta uses the euro.
Sorry, my mistake - it's the Sovereign Military Order of Malta that "uses" a non-decimal currency - in air quotes because, while it is technically a country, they don't really exist on a day to day basis.
 

xotGD

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Of the pre-decimalisation currency. thruppeny bits have at least survived in rhyming slang.

Is 'bob-a-job' still a thing with the Scouts?
 

Mojo

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Oh my goodness, just had to recover from trying to work out how to buy a broom. For the benefit of any imperial phobes like me, then might I suggest you ask for help from someone who talks in backwards measurements if you ever need to purchase one.

I had just about got my head around the fact that one option was a diameter of 1 1/8 inch and what exactly this meant, to then be hit with another option that was 15/16! The worse part of that the catalogue for the heads describes the dimension of the bracket as in mm! What a cack handed way of going about business.
 

py_megapixel

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Oh my goodness, just had to recover from trying to work out how to buy a broom. For the benefit of any imperial phobes like me, then might I suggest you ask for help from someone who talks in backwards measurements if you ever need to purchase one.
Or just pop to Wilkinsons - keeps a very good (imo) chain of shops in business and they'll have them on display so you can just see what size they are for yourself!
 

Mojo

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Or just pop to Wilkinsons - keeps a very good (imo) chain of shops in business and they'll have them on display so you can just see what size they are for yourself!
It's my favourite shop, spend hundreds in there! However on this not enough choice and not good enough quality. Also too expensive.
 

DerekC

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Given imperial measurements are now in the school curriculum (in addition to metric measurements) maybe not.

What backwards-facing politician decided that? I appreciate that many of those as old as me are going to think imperial, but I recall that my children, who are now in their forties, learned only metric at school. Why on earth does the government not at least try to simplify things? (Silly question - of course the Daily Mail is probably against metrication!).
 

Bald Rick

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What backwards-facing politician decided that? I appreciate that many of those as old as me are going to think imperial, but I recall that my children, who are now in their forties, learned only metric at school.

Almost certainly Rees-Mogg. He famously insists to his staff that any measures given to him in briefings are in imperial measures. If it was me I would be referring to links, rods, perches, gills and cwt.
 

ABB125

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I think it's sensible to have imperial measures in the curriculum, but only to the extent that pupils are aware they exist, not using them for calculations etc.
 

JonasB

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Sorry, my mistake - it's the Sovereign Military Order of Malta that "uses" a non-decimal currency - in air quotes because, while it is technically a country, they don't really exist on a day to day basis.
True, forgot about them. (Which is probably an easy thing to do.)
 

swt_passenger

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What bugs me is dual labelling of stuff like machine screw threads. If you go in a typical mass market hardware or diy place, you’re highly likely to find stuff dual labelled, but they really shouldn’t be. They’re either metric or imperial, but they aren’t equivalents. Mixing similar sized metric and imperial nuts and bolts will randomly work, or jam, and could be unsafe.
 

ABB125

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What bugs me is dual labelling of stuff like machine screw threads. If you go in a typical mass market hardware or diy place, you’re highly likely to find stuff dual labelled, but they really shouldn’t be. They’re either metric or imperial, but they aren’t equivalents. Mixing similar sized metric and imperial nuts and bolts will randomly work, or jam, and could be unsafe.
My dad has the same attitude: if it's dual-labelled, it's neither size!
 

DerekC

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I think it's sensible to have imperial measures in the curriculum, but only to the extent that pupils are aware they exist, not using them for calculations etc.

That's a sensible approach - and (alleluia) it looks as though that's what is taught - see:


https://www.theschoolrun.com/what-are-imperial-units

When do children learn about imperial units in primary school?​

In Key Stage 1, children will be introduced to standard and non-standard measures and required to use vocabulary such as taller, shorter, longer, heavier, lighter, empty, half-full and full.

In Year 3, they will be introduced to the metric units of measurement and will be asked to measure length, mass and capacity and then record their measurements.

By Year 4, they will be expected to convert metric measurements; for example, they may be told that a door is 2 metres tall and then asked to give this measurement in cm (200 cm). They continue this work in Year 5, going onto harder tasks, such as converting 0.3cm to mm (3mm) or 3.7kg to grams (3700g).

In Year 5, imperial units will be introduced. Children will be asked to find approximate equivalences between the metric and imperial units. The curriculum states that they need to know about inches, pounds and pints.

In Year 6, children will be asked to convert between miles and kilometres. It is possible your child's teacher will broach this by telling them that 5 miles equals approximately 8 kilometres; therefore, if you are given a journey in kilometres and want to convert it to miles, you divide by 8 and then multiply by 5. If you are given a journey in miles and want to convert it to kilometres, you divide it by 5 and then multiply by 8.

Please do not worry if this all seems totally baffling! Imperial units represent a very small part of the maths curriculum, and there is likely to be only one question in the SATs on it. It is however, very important that your child is confident with the metric system (reading scales, converting measurements, calculating with measurements), so spend plenty of time on this before attempting to think about imperial units.
 

Bald Rick

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I think it's sensible to have imperial measures in the curriculum, but only to the extent that pupils are aware they exist, not using them for calculations etc.

Indeed, in the same way that it’s important to tell pupils that steam trains, floppy disks and teletext still exist, but only used by a small subset of the population who are afraid of making a change that will benefit them ;)
 

ABB125

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That's a sensible approach - and (alleluia) it looks as though that's what is taught - see:


https://www.theschoolrun.com/what-are-imperial-units
That's good. Common sense prevails!
Indeed, in the same way that it’s important to tell pupils that steam trains, floppy disks and teletext still exist, but only used by a small subset of the population who are afraid of making a change that will benefit them ;)
Heresy! :D
I'm trying to think of something from my childhood (it's a scary thought that I officially left that behind earlier this year!) to add to the list, but I'm struggling! BBC red button? Blackberry phones?

Although I use both systems interchangeably I can see the benefits of standardising on metric. The main issue for me will be no longer using miles for distances (but only by road; I could cope fine if railway mileages went metric, I'd just have to update my spreadsheet. Incedentally, I've been meaning to start a thread about metricisation of railway mileages for ages, but never gotten around to it!), but that's not a good enough reason not to change.
 

Mcr Warrior

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I could cope fine if railway mileages went metric
London Underground and Manchester Metrolink track distances are both all metric aren't they?

Also, London Tramlink, Docklands Light Railway, Midland Metro, Blackpool Trams, Edinburgh Trams, Glasgow Underground, Nottingham Express Transit, Sheffield Supertram and the Tyne & Wear Metro.
 

Bald Rick

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London Underground and Manchester Metrolink track distances are both all metric aren't they?

Also, London Tramlink, Docklands Light Railway, Midland Metro, Blackpool Trams, Edinburgh Trams, Glasgow Underground, Nottingham Express Transit, Sheffield Supertram and the Tyne & Wear Metro.

And HS1. And most OLE electrified sections of the NR Network have masts marked in metric.
 

ABB125

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London Underground and Manchester Metrolink track distances are both all metric aren't they?

Also, London Tramlink, Docklands Light Railway, Midland Metro, Blackpool Trams, Edinburgh Trams, Glasgow Underground, Nottingham Express Transit, Sheffield Supertram and the Tyne & Wear Metro.
But they aren't "proper" railways!
 
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