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Network rail staff now get priv travel

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74A

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Apologies if this is in the wrong location. I understand that network rail managers are to get priv travel. Tessa have accepted a deal.

Does anyone know what this will be. Is it boxes or just the 25% discount card. Also is in contractual or can it be withdrawn in the future. And will you still get it when you retire as ex BR staff do.
 
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High Dyke

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Apologies if this is in the wrong location. I understand that network rail managers are to get priv travel. Tessa have accepted a deal.

Does anyone know what this will be. Is it boxes or just the 25% discount card. Also is in contractual or can it be withdrawn in the future. And will you still get it when you retire as ex BR staff do.
According to the communication from Network Rail: "75% discount on leisure travel for you, your partner and any dependents."

My understanding is that it will be on a par with Non-safeguarded travel facilities, which will be a discount card only, not boxes. I have no information about the actual way it will be administered.
 

357

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As far as I understand it, it will be the same as TOC NE PRIV
 

CAF397

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Network Rail staff will receive the same travel benefits as non-safeguarded TOC staff.

75% discount on full fare and off-peak tickets and rangers/rovers with no free boxes. I assume they also get the 'FIP' discounts for European travel.

Upon resignation, termination of employment and retirement the eligibility ends.

Is it only NR or freight emoloyees too?
NR only. FOCs have not negotiated such a deal for their pay awards.
 

Horizon22

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If accepted - I thought the disputes are still ongoing - I imagine it will be the "Rail Staff Leisure Card" (often referred to as 'Priv travel'). This equates to 75% off fares for leisure purposes only on par with what non-safeguared (i.e anyone post 1996) TOC employees get.
 

74A

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Thanks for the replies. I kind of thought that would be the case. Pity you lose it on retirement. Interesting to know Network Rail have to pay anything to the TOCs or the government has just told them to accept it.

Makes the TOC NE scheme a bit more secure. Up to now we are always told every year that it only continues with the agreement of the TOCs and can be withdrawn at any time. If its in Network Rail contracts makes it more difficult to cancel it.
 

Dunnideer

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If accepted - I thought the disputes are still ongoing - I imagine it will be the "Rail Staff Leisure Card" (often referred to as 'Priv travel'). This equates to 75% off fares for leisure purposes only on par with what non-safeguared (i.e anyone post 1996) TOC employees get.
Management bands 1 - 4 (with collective bargaining by TSSA) have accepted the deal including priv travel. The general grades, supervisors, control and bands 5 - 8 staff (with collective bargaining by RMT and TSSA respectively) has not accepted the deal and it doesn”t look like it’ll be accepted any time soon.
 

pdeaves

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If its in Network Rail contracts makes it more difficult to cancel it.
Without knowing the full ins and outs, I would be surprised if it were contractural, just as non-safeguarded TOC employees don't have contractural rights to privilege travel.
 

Horizon22

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May I remind people that this discussion is purely about the potential staff benefits of Network Rail staff getting "Priv" rate travel.

Any other wider discussion about ongoing industrial disputes is not for this thread.
 

74A

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Without knowing the full ins and outs, I would be surprised if it were contractural, just as non-safeguarded TOC employees don't have contractural rights to privilege travel.
Well it has been offered as part of a pay deal so it looks like it becomes part of your contract.

Unlike the TOCs which just offered it one year but not connected to any contract negotiations.
 

T-Karmel

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Well it has been offered as part of a pay deal so it looks like it becomes part of your contract.

Unlike the TOCs which just offered it one year but not connected to any contract negotiations.
HEX used FIP card as a tool in their pay talks of 2020 (just before covid) yet it doesn't form a contract.
 

357

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It won't go into people's contracts but it will be part of union-company agreements.

As a result of one day they are unavailable, NR will need to negotiate with the union to "sell" this perk.
 

tiptoptaff

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How much is the benefit in kind tax for this sort of thing?
I don't get taxed on mine as its "not contractually guaranteed" and would imagine NRs position will be similar
 

357

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How much is the benefit in kind tax for this sort of thing?
I don't get taxed on mine. When this question was raised before it came back as non taxable because it's a simple discount and not a scheme where your employer will pay 75% when you pay 25%.
 

pdeaves

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I don't get taxed on mine. When this question was raised before it came back as non taxable because it's a simple discount and not a scheme where your employer will pay 75% when you pay 25%.
I think the situation is different for protected staff (I recall some former colleagues in a previous employer getting rather upset at having to pay tax on travel, but then I have no idea whether the tax office changed the rules later).
 

74A

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I think the situation is different for protected staff (I recall some former colleagues in a previous employer getting rather upset at having to pay tax on travel, but then I have no idea whether the tax office changed the rules later).

The leisure travel has never been taxed. If it was it would be very complicated to work out as you would have to keep a record of all the journeys.

The only part that was taxed was if you used to the train to commute. I think you were taxed on what a season ticket would cost on the route to work.
 

357

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The leisure travel has never been taxed. If it was it would be very complicated to work out as you would have to keep a record of all the journeys.

The only part that was taxed was if you used to the train to commute. I think you were taxed on what a season ticket would cost on the route to work.
I've never been taxed on priv season tickets
 

74A

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I've never been taxed on priv season tickets
Ex BR staff get residential travel which is a free pass which they pay tax on. You have paid for a season ticket so don't need to pay tax on top.
 

357

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Ex BR staff get residential travel which is a free pass which they pay tax on. You have paid for a season ticket so don't need to pay tax on top.
Ah, understood :)
 

Mag_seven

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I think the situation is different for protected staff (I recall some former colleagues in a previous employer getting rather upset at having to pay tax on travel, but then I have no idea whether the tax office changed the rules later).

Safeguarded staff who work for Network Rail and other non TOC businesses pay tax on their travel facilities. I have no idea whether non safeguarded staff working for NR will pay tax if they take up the NR offer.
 

CAF397

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Is that not down to the fact ex-BR staff also have the 'free' Travel as mentioned. Whereas us non-safeguarded staff just get "free" travel on our own TOC, but pay 25% of all other fares?
 

edwin_m

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Part of the justification for BR travel facilities was so staff could travel around and get a better idea of how the railway operated. Does anyone think this will help reduce silo thinking by NR staff who may rarely if ever use a train?
 

zwk500

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Part of the justification for BR travel facilities was so staff could travel around and get a better idea of how the railway operated. Does anyone think this will help reduce silo thinking by NR staff who may rarely if ever use a train?
I think GBR would have more impact on that than priv travel. If you're the interested type who would use the opportunity to learn about the network, you were probably already travelling by train anyway. If you aren't interested then even if you now might travel by train a bit more, you won't be looking around you but just trying to complete your journey.

Fwiw nowadays you often get a better picture from RTT and OTT than you do as a passenger, unless you have all day to spare sitting at a station.
 

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Essentially it's down to whether you are receiving a benefit which comes at a 'marginal additional expense' to the employer. If so, then no tax is payable following the precedent of Pepper v Hart. HMRC's manual refers.

Therefore discounted/free services usually attract no tax but discounted/free goods do attract tax. The logic being that there is always some cost to providing goods but not necessarily to providing services.
 
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Interesting to know Network Rail have to pay anything to the TOCs or the government has just told them to accept it.
I would also be interested in such details. Would this likely be hidden under the 'commercial sensitivity of ongoing talks' for a FOIA request? Additionally, does this set a precedent for other organisations such as TfL being able to garner such priviledges with appropriate payment?
 

357

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I would also be interested in such details. Would this likely be hidden under the 'commercial sensitivity of ongoing talks' for a FOIA request? Additionally, does this set a precedent for other organisations such as TfL being able to garner such priviledges with appropriate payment?
TfL already pay an agreed fee for each PTAC issued to their old school staff
 
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