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New national restrictions in Wales

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island

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Mark Drakeford has just announced that from 18:00hrs on Friday all indoor hospitality will have to cease serving alcohol for consumption on the premises and close at 18:00 daily.

All indoor entertainment such as cinemas, arcades, bingo halls, and soft play must also shut.
(source: BBC news TV)


Welsh pubs, restaurants and cafes will be banned from serving alcohol from Friday and will be unable to open to customers beyond 18:00 GMT.
First Minister Mark Drakeford announced the new rules to tackle a rise in coronavirus cases.
Indoor entertainment and visitor attractions, including cinemas, museums and galleries, will also have to shut.
 
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bramling

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Mark Drakeford has just announced that from 18:00hrs on Friday all indoor hospitality will have to cease serving alcohol for consumption on the premises and close at 18:00 daily.

All indoor entertainment such as cinemas, arcades, bingo halls, and soft play must also shut.

(source: BBC news TV)

So much for the circuit breaker getting Wales through to Christmas then.

When are the politicians going to be held to account for their failures?
 

ainsworth74

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When are the politicians going to be held to account for their failures?

The next election. That's how it works in our system. Though I wouldn't hold out much hope of that happening as it seems like the electorate don't really care very much anymore about holding politicians to account.
 

brad465

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"The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result." -Einstein (if it definitely was him as some quotes have been misattributed as such)
 

Andyh82

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That Fire Break that as I recall Wales were praised for doing and England criticised for not doing, didn’t work well then?

Quite funny how in the next story on the BBC News, Starmer was complaining about England having to close pubs in Tier 3,whilst all this is happening in Wales!
 

joncombe

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So another lockdown then? Except not calling it that because otherwise that would mean admitting that the last one didn't work.
 

bramling

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The next election. That's how it works in our system. Though I wouldn't hold out much hope of that happening as it seems like the electorate don't really care very much anymore about holding politicians to account.

The trouble is none of the parties offer an alternative strategy nor really inspire confidence in what they would do. Starmer seems even more intent on lockdowns, though I think his communications would be better. This just leaves Farage, which is hardly a solution.
 

packermac

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The trouble is none of the parties offer an alternative strategy nor really inspire confidence in what they would do. Starmer seems even more intent on lockdowns, though I think his communications would be better. This just leaves Farage, which is hardly a solution.
Drakeford is the leader of the Labour Party in Wales so defacto Starmer's representative.
 

yorkie

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I have lost any respect I had for Drakeford, and on the evidence I have seen, so have many people.

The term "firebreak" lockdown was, I believe, fundamentally misleading. The idea of a "firebreak" is that you stop the spread. But this was only going to suppress and delay it, for a period of time.

If the aim is to keep the cases low, then clearly it was not going to be enough, and they were going to either have to have more full lockdowns or lengthy periods of harsh restrictions. This was obvious all along.

I think some people actually believed the "firebreak" analogy and thought that 2 weeks of locking down would make the issue go away. Those of us who have any sort of clue how viruses work (not that I did a year ago, really, but now I've read/listened to loads of experts, I do now!) will know that this was a totally unrealistic expectation.

The idea of saving thousands of lives being lost with an average age of 80+ due to one cause, but in exchange causing massive long-term damage to many younger people, is totally wrong in my opinion. There needs to be an acceptance, by those who propose, advocate, and support, lockdowns that lockdowns are a means of passing the burden from wealthier or older people down to poorer or younger people.

If they take the view that cases must be kept low at all costs, until the vaccine has been rolled out across all elderly people, this could take several months, by which time we are risking high levels of suicide (not just now, but some won't happen for months or years), poverty and deprivation, people losing hope, people losing faith in democracy. Harsh policing (see other thread) of these nonsensical rules also erodes trust in the police. This is creating an incredibly dangerous situation; I think the likes of Drakeford lack the intelligence to be able to see the bigger picture and spot the dangers.

People like Drakeford need to get into the real world and talk to ordinary working people; they are in a weird authoritarian 'socialist' bubble that the vast majority of the population cannot identify with.
 

Class 33

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Pubs not being allowed to serve alcohol, and having to close at 6pm every day!! They are going to get very very few customers, that it will hardly be worth them opening every day! Sadly I can see many pubs going under, thanks to these further restrictions.
 

joncombe

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Pubs not being allowed to serve alcohol, and having to close at 6pm every day!! They are going to get very very few customers, that it will hardly be worth them opening every day! Sadly I can see many pubs going under, thanks to these further restrictions.
Yes. It's essentially turning pubs into cafes.
 

Bikeman78

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So another lockdown then? Except not calling it that because otherwise that would mean admitting that the last one didn't work.
I doubt it will make any difference. Cardiff city centre was at a standstill at noon today. I doubt many people were heading for a meal or a pint at that time. No doubt they were heading for the shops, which they will continue to do.
 

52290

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Pubs not being allowed to serve alcohol, and having to close at 6pm every day!! They are going to get very very few customers, that it will hardly be worth them opening every day! Sadly I can see many pubs going under, thanks to these further restrictions.
One of the oldest breweries in Wales is Brains of Cardiff. They used to have an advertising slogan "It's Brains you want". Perhaps they should revive it.
 

Richard Scott

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The bloke is a total clown, there is nothing remotely scientific about this. I feel really sorry for those people who are just trying to make a living. It's wrong on so many levels.
 

DustyBin

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I have lost any respect I had for Drakeford, and on the evidence I have seen, so have many people.

The term "firebreak" lockdown was, I believe, fundamentally misleading. The idea of a "firebreak" is that you stop the spread. But this was only going to suppress and delay it, for a period of time.

If the aim is to keep the cases low, then clearly it was not going to be enough, and they were going to either have to have more full lockdowns or lengthy periods of harsh restrictions. This was obvious all along.

I think some people actually believed the "firebreak" analogy and thought that 2 weeks of locking down would make the issue go away. Those of us who have any sort of clue how viruses work (not that I did a year ago, really, but now I've read/listened to loads of experts, I do now!) will know that this was a totally unrealistic expectation.

The idea of saving thousands of lives being lost with an average age of 80+ due to one cause, but in exchange causing massive long-term damage to many younger people, is totally wrong in my opinion. There needs to be an acceptance, by those who propose, advocate, and support, lockdowns that lockdowns are a means of passing the burden from wealthier or older people down to poorer or younger people.

If they take the view that cases must be kept low at all costs, until the vaccine has been rolled out across all elderly people, this could take several months, by which time we are risking high levels of suicide (not just now, but some won't happen for months or years), poverty and deprivation, people losing hope, people losing faith in democracy. Harsh policing (see other thread) of these nonsensical rules also erodes trust in the police. This is creating an incredibly dangerous situation; I think the likes of Drakeford lack the intelligence to be able to see the bigger picture and spot the dangers.

People like Drakeford need to get into the real world and talk to ordinary working people; they are in a weird authoritarian 'socialist' bubble that the vast majority of the population cannot identify with.

The 'firebreak' analogy was a particularly misleading (and plain stupid) one with the 'fire' very much still raging and awaiting an escape route! I agree with everything you've said there, the damage being caused to our society is immeasurable.
 

Watershed

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One of the most concerning things about the latest sets of "second wave" legal restrictions is that they are being chosen as the automatic and default response to a rise in cases etc. What little reasoning has been published (e.g. as in the case of the latest English tier system) just says that it is too difficult to make an estimate of the economic costs. In other words, the economic and other non-Covid costs aren't of any relevance.

There is no serious or reasoned debate about whether imposing further legal restrictions is the most appropriate response. We have had months in which to develop a second wave strategy and yet this haphazard mess of constantly changing rules is the best we can conjure up?

We were woefully prepared for a pandemic like this as a country, and yet even now as we are coming out of the second wave, nothing has seemingly changed in that respect.

It is still a completely disjointed approach between the devolved nations, even though we are not really separate countries in the way that, say, Belgium, Luxembourg and the Netherlands are.
 

Skimpot flyer

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Pubs not being allowed to serve alcohol, and having to close at 6pm every day!! They are going to get very very few customers, that it will hardly be worth them opening every day! Sadly I can see many pubs going under, thanks to these further restrictions.
Upcoming future restrictions considered by Drakeford:

Butchers must not sell meat.

Bakers banned from selling bread.

Candlestick makers may stay open, but only for the sale of handles for forks
 

yorkie

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I see Drakeford is trending on Twitter; here is a selection of tweets about Drakeford:

Hats off to deranged Welsh first minister Mark Drakeford whose "fire break" lockdown was such a stunning success he's locking down his long suffering country all over again. Repeating a failed policy in the forlorn hope it will succeed in the end is the definition of madness.
Drakeford flexing his puny muscles again! All pubs in Wales have to close by 6pm Friday. So no evening meal out or drink with friends. Who else is getting fed up of this dictatorship!

What a grim place Wales has turned into under Drakeford. No Xmas cheer there at all.

My life was much more happier and simpler when I didn’t know who Mark Drakeford was
Here's my statement on Mark Drakeford's new Coronavirus restrictions: "Drakeford’s coronavirus policies have clearly failed. He’s making it up as he goes along and increasingly sounding like a tin-pot dictator....

Mark Drakeford’s latest decision to force pubs and restaurants to close at 6pm and introduce a total ban on alcohol sales in the hospitality sector will put thousands of jobs and livelihoods at risk.
Mark Drakeford is singlehandedly destroying small, Welsh businesses. These new rules are in no way stopping the spread of COVID, except making small businesses not being able to trade. He's completely useless.

Bear it in mind Kev that 2 week fire break was after a 3-5 week Welsh Local Lockdown. Drakeford could order every single Welsh person to stay locked up at home and then somehow announce another rise in infections a few weeks later. There’s no end to this madness.
Drakeford along with anyone endorsing these policies tearing businesses & families apart, inflicting untold suffering, casting the poorest & vulnerable into further grinding poverty, advocating for some portion of the population to be consigned to death are complicit in murder.
Suffice to say Drakeford will be remembered for a very long time...
 
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Bikeman78

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I went to the Beefeater yesterday. It was almost deserted. Meanwhile it was packed in Cardiff again today, although the valleys trains were lightly loaded. If Mark Drakeford thinks that shutting pubs and restaurants will make any difference then I think he is mistaken.
 

PHILIPE

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I went to the Beefeater yesterday. It was almost deserted. Meanwhile it was packed in Cardiff again today, although the valleys trains were lightly loaded. If Mark Drakeford thinks that shutting pubs and restaurants will make any difference then I think he is mistaken.
Have seen post on Facebook that he has been banned from over 100 pubs in North Wales

Have now found a link to an article in the Daily Mail

Wales's Labour leader Mark Drakeford has been banned for 'anti-social behaviour' from more than 100 pubs - after announcing the country's 'draconian' alcohol ban.

Furious landlords ruled the First Minister is barred from their premises for at least 18 months.

In a letter the West Conwy Pubwatch group said Mr Drakeford, 66, was being banned because of his 'anti-social behaviour' and told him he faced arrest if he turned up.

It comes after the Labour leader announced new rules on the hospitality industry on Monday - banning pubs and restaurants from selling alcohol from 6pm on Friday.

The move prompted bosses to issue a rallying cry and urge the Welsh government to provide 'proof' that their customers are more likely to catch Covid-19 in their establishments.
 
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yorkie

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Have seen post on Facebook that he has been banned from over 100 pubs in North Wales

Have now found a link to an article in the Daily Mail

Good on them!

I'd love to ban him from this forum for his anti-public transport rhetoric, as well as him indirectly causing suffering to people's mental and physical well-being, but of course given his anti-public transport stance, there is no chance of him joining anyway ;)
 

PHILIPE

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When the 2200 pub curfew was introduced in England several Tory MPs who voted for it got banned from all their constituencies.
 

Carlisle

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I suspect he doesn’t drink so it probably doesn’t affect him......
I wouldn’t be surprised if most Scientists & Politicians who vehemently support such draconian restrictions disproportionately targeting hospitality either don’t drink or if they do, hardly ever in pub or restaurant environments
 
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Dai Corner

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New travel restrictions applicable from 1800 tomorrow have been published


Wales’ coronavirus regulations will be amended to prohibit travel to and from tier three areas in England; level three and four areas in Scotland and the whole of Northern Ireland, which is currently in lockdown.

New travel guidance will be issued strongly advising people in Wales not to travel to other parts of the UK with lower levels of coronavirus – tier one and two areas in England or level one and two areas in Scotland – to help control the spread of the virus.

People from Wales will be required to follow any legal restrictions, including relating to travel, which are in place in other parts of the UK.

All travel restrictions within the UK will be suspended between 23 and 27 December to allow people to meet members of their Christmas bubble. People travelling to and from Northern Ireland will be able to travel the day before this period starts and the day after.

First Minister Mark Drakeford said:

There will be no restrictions on travel within Wales but we need to have some restrictions on travel across the border to those parts of the UK where infection rates are high to prevent the spread of coronavirus.
We are also advising people in Wales not to travel into those parts of England and Scotland where the infection rate is lower, to help prevent them taking coronavirus with them.
Coronavirus doesn’t respect borders – we all have a part to play in keeping Wales and the UK safe. Please think carefully about where you are going and what you are doing. This virus thrives wherever we come together with others.
Taken together with our other measures, these travel restrictions will help to keep us all safe.
The travel restrictions are likely to remain in place until at least January 2021 but will be kept under constant review.

International travel restrictions will continue and are also likely to remain in place until at least January, but will be kept under constant review.
 

joncombe

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How on earth is that going to be enforced? There are no restrictions on travelling from a Tier 2 to 3 area in England (only guidance). So if you leave Wales via a Tier 2 area how on earth can the Welsh Government enforce a law that prevents onwards travel into a Tier 3 area once you are outside of Wales?

Well I know the answer of course - they can't.
 

Dai Corner

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How on earth is that going to be enforced? There are no restrictions on travelling from a Tier 2 to 3 area in England (only guidance). So if you leave Wales via a Tier 2 area how on earth can the Welsh Government enforce a law that prevents onwards travel into a Tier 3 area once you are outside of Wales?

Well I know the answer of course - they can't.
Indeed. If you leave Monmouthshire via the M4 or Severn Tunnel you immediately enter the tier 3 area of South Gloucestershire. Presumably, if questioned by a Welsh police officer or other official, you have to undertake not to stop until you get to a tier 2 area?
 

island

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How on earth is that going to be enforced? There are no restrictions on travelling from a Tier 2 to 3 area in England (only guidance). So if you leave Wales via a Tier 2 area how on earth can the Welsh Government enforce a law that prevents onwards travel into a Tier 3 area once you are outside of Wales?

Well I know the answer of course - they can't.
The Heddlu might stop people leaving Wales to ask where they’re going. Only people who give a stupid answer will get themselves in trouble.
 

WelshBluebird

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Surely this is the same as before the UK and Welsh latest lockdowns where travel between Tier 2 or Tier 3 places and Wales was banned.
Sure there are different degrees of how enforceable this is but it isn't really new.
 
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