'Peaks' on the Southern

[70014IronDuke]

They were fairly frequent visitors to Meldon Quarry to pick ballast up and for a time the viaduct was used as a headshunt, not sure if the two things coincided though.

I'm not sure I wouldn have wanted to be in the cab if they did
I had no idea Cl 45s got there!

 

[Cowley]

I'm not sure I wouldn have wanted to be in the cab if they did

Just the sound of creaking and the cry of a circling Buzzard…

 

[ungreat]

Looking at the loco number and the driver, I think that was one of the occasions in 1985 when I was the guard.

I worked on them as a secondman...now I go Gatwick as a driver!

 

[D1537]

The Brighton diagram from 85/86 was one you really had to keep your eye on as a 47 basher - since it was the last train north on Table 116 you didn't want to be stranded at places like Banbury, so whilst 16-wheelers weren't regular it was always very wise to find out what had done 1O74. I remember in summer 85 Saltley chucking one out for at least four days in a row - seriously, behave!

 

[D6130]

I remember in summer 85 Saltley chucking one out for at least four days in a row - seriously, behave!

Yes....those were the very ones that I worked!

 

[Roger1973]

They worked regularly on the Northfleet coal trains to the cement works there (class 45s).

I remember seeing a Peak hauling this, by chance, midday at Sidcup in the late 1980s.

Having grown up fairly close to the Sidcup line (and gone to a school where you could see the line if you were in the right place) I'm surprised by that - don't remember them on the line at all. pairs of 33s, the occasional 47 and then 56's on the coal trains, yes.

(I should add that I'm not questioning what you say, just surprised)

 

[Taunton]

I was standing just here, having walked up Sidcup Station Road at lunchtime.

123 Station Rd - Google Maps

The Balfour Beatty company, I seem to recall, had an office in Marlowe House which I was visiting, just through the bridge. The Peak and loaded train were doing a considerable speed, probably 50mph-plus, at full throttle, it having burst on the scene with a considerable Sulzer roar. I was surprised, too, to see a Peak there. Some time in the mid/late-1980s. The workings seem to be quite well-known.

 

[eastwestdivide]

Having grown up fairly close to the Sidcup line (and gone to a school where you could see the line if you were in the right place) I'm surprised by that - don't remember them on the line at all. pairs of 33s, the occasional 47 and then 56's on the coal trains, yes.

(I should add that I'm not questioning what you say, just surprised)

Definitely 45+47 combos with coal in HAAs to Northfleet from at latest the late 70s when I started spotting in the area. Don’t know when they finished.

 

[alistairlees]

Definitely 45+47 combos with coal in HAAs to Northfleet from at latest the late 70s when I started spotting in the area. Don’t know when they finished.

A picture and good explanatory text (click on the other picture in the comments to get to more explanations of these workings)

Dartford Duo

MGR empties returning to the midlands from Northfleet cement works are recorded at Dartford with 47327 and 45004 at the helm on 27 September 1979. The 47 would be removed at Cricklewood. Pentax SP1000/105mm Ilford FP4

www.flickr.com

(Not my pictures)

 

[33011]

I remember seeing two peaks once at Eastleigh at the same time. 45052 was about to leave on the Eastleigh to Severn Tunnel speedlink when 45144 appeared on the Fareham stone train. In a book Diesels on the Southern there are pictures of Peaks including 46007 on a stone train to Botley In May 1976 whether that was a regular class 46 turn I'm unsure. There is also a pic of 45065 on a the 11.00 Waterloo Exeter in the snow as the only loco available so very rare.

 

[nw1]

When I was a guard at Brighton, there was one week in the Summer of 1985 when I was on the middle Manchester turn every day from Monday to Friday, with two loco-hauled return trips from Brighton to East Croydon and back each day. On this particular week, the afternoon (to us) Manchester - Brighton produced a different 45/1 every day - instead of the booked 47/4 - and driven, of course, by "Saltley Seagulls" with a Norwood conductor driver. Unfortunately, I don't currently have access to my 1985 train log books, but the aforementioned website '1o76' will have full details.

The train being referred to would have been the 10:59 off Stafford, so around 10:00 from Manchester, if that helps.

 

[Roger1973]

A picture and good explanatory text (click on the other picture in the comments to get to more explanations of these workings)

Dartford Duo

MGR empties returning to the midlands from Northfleet cement works are recorded at Dartford with 47327 and 45004 at the helm on 27 September 1979. The 47 would be removed at Cricklewood. Pentax SP1000/105mm Ilford FP4

www.flickr.com

(Not my pictures)

Wonder if 'Bingley Hall' who commented on that photo went to the same school I did? (From his profile, he would have left some time before I started there.)

and I found this one of a 45 on its own at Sidcup

45125

45125 near Sidcup working 6Z52 1700 Northfleet APCM to Toton Yard on Tuesday 30th April 1985. 65-36.

www.flickr.com

If the train that could have a class 45 went through Lee around 0850, and the return working was 1700 from Northfleet, that might explain why I wouldn't have been that likely to see it (and in the school holidays, if I was going out anywhere (either with parent or a bit later on my own), I / we would usually not go out until the first train that off peak fares were available on - think that was about 0930.)

 

[Taunton]

and I found this one of a 45 on its own at Sidcup

That's pretty much where I saw it (going the other way). Those 1980s office meetings were in that large high-rise office building in the background, but always in rooms on the non-railway side - we were out getting lunch when it thundered past. I've seen it written elsewhere that these trains "always" had a Slow Speed Class 47 added as pilot from Cricklewood to suit the Northfleet discharge loop, which the one I saw didn't, so I'm pleased to see evidence that Peaks really did work it on their own as well.

I'd be surprised if the train actually came through in the rush hours in those times, as the Southern Region had a longstanding embargo on freight services, almost all of which came through from other regions, in the London suburban area in peak hours - any that turned up, possibly late, would be looped until the rush, maybe 0700-0900 and 1600-1800, was over. I go through Lewisham at about 1630 nowadays on occasion, and see one of the aggregates trains come through there, always punctual to the minute, but think that would never have been allowed in those times.

 

[eastwestdivide]

On the timings of the working to Northfleet, I saw it around Northfleet from the first off-peak train from Strood, the 0905 I think, which would put it at maybe 0900-0915ish at Dartford, tying in fairly well with the Lee observation above.

 

[37166]

08/05/1983 i was on a Merrymaker tour from Kettering to Paignton and from Cricklewood it made its way over to the Waterloo Exeter line, loco was a 45/0, possibly 45070, a very rare run along the Mule.

 

[Roger1973]

I'd be surprised if the train actually came through in the rush hours in those times, as the Southern Region had a longstanding embargo on freight services, almost all of which came through from other regions, in the London suburban area in peak hours - any that turned up, possibly late, would be looped until the rush, maybe 0700-0900 and 1600-1800, was over. I go through Lewisham at about 1630 nowadays on occasion, and see one of the aggregates trains come through there, always punctual to the minute, but think that would never have been allowed in those times.

Good question.

On the Sidcup line, these trains would have been against peak direction, which might have been less of an issue, but can't think of anywhere on the south eastern bit they could have been looped anywhere, unless they went in to one of the yards at Hither Green, but that would have meant the loco would have had to change ends.

What route would they have taken? I'm guessing Midland as far south as Cricklewood, then the Dudding Hill line, Kew Bridge, Clapham Junction, South London Line, Nunhead, Lewisham.

There were south eastern trains via Lewisham and Nunhead at that time, but possibly less than now (from memory, just a few peak direction Dartford - Blackfriars / Holborn Viaduct trains) but would have thought that fitting freight trains through the junction at Lewisham somewhere round 0830 and 1730, even if in the off peak direction, would not be that good an idea.

 

[alistairlees]

Good question.

On the Sidcup line, these trains would have been against peak direction, which might have been less of an issue, but can't think of anywhere on the south eastern bit they could have been looped anywhere, unless they went in to one of the yards at Hither Green, but that would have meant the loco would have had to change ends.

What route would they have taken? I'm guessing Midland as far south as Cricklewood, then the Dudding Hill line, Kew Bridge, Clapham Junction, South London Line, Nunhead, Lewisham.

There were south eastern trains via Lewisham and Nunhead at that time, but possibly less than now (from memory, just a few peak direction Dartford - Blackfriars / Holborn Viaduct trains) but would have thought that fitting freight trains through the junction at Lewisham somewhere round 0830 and 1730, even if in the off peak direction, would not be that good an idea.

Surely a Peak was always going in the 'peak direction', and never against it?

 

[Cricketer8for9]

Heading eastwards is less conflicting than westbound from Denmark Hill onward. The Catford Loop, Hayes line, south eastern main line all head away to the right. There is a clash at Lewisham with trains to Cannon St ex Hayes, Sidcup and Grove Park, but it’s not as bad as a westbound journey.