Rail Freight Flows and News UK

[Dr Hoo]

I thought that there was now Tesco fresh produce from Spain to GB in containers (some refrigerated) sharing the long-standing Ford car components train.
(I can accept that the Ford boxes aren’t really a classic intermodal operation in themselves.)

 

[BRX]

To me a "true" intermodal service both
- carries containers that are transferred to and moved by a different mode of transport at both ends of the rail leg
- carries goods from multiple origins to multiple destinations

Does the Tesco train meet either of those criteria?

 

[Oxfordblues]

I spent 2-3 wasted years at Railfreight Distribution on the project team to clear various routes for swap-body traffic to/from Europe via the Channel Tunnel. This is to my eternal regret as, after a brief period of limited success, the much-vaunted intermodal service to Europe has been almost completely abandoned. The Channel Tunnel was the great "white hope" for UK rail freight and it's a tragedy that huge convoys of polluting juggernauts are seen to be preferable to electric freight trains.

 

[Greybeard33]

I spent 2-3 wasted years at Railfreight Distribution on the project team to clear various routes for swap-body traffic to/from Europe via the Channel Tunnel. This is to my eternal regret as, after a brief period of limited success, the much-vaunted intermodal service to Europe has been almost completely abandoned. The Channel Tunnel was the great "white hope" for UK rail freight and it's a tragedy that huge convoys of polluting juggernauts are seen to be preferable to electric freight trains.

However, Brexit customs checks now mean that the huge army of HGV drivers criss-crossing the Channel are spending increasing amounts of unproductive time sat in lorry parks and motorway queues. This is going to get worse when the EU introduces biometric entry checks later this year. These will require every driver to leave their cab for fingerprint and facial scans, which will inevitably slow down the boarding process of the ferries and Eurotunnel shuttles.

Additionally it seems likely that cross Channel private car traffic will recover this year, adding to the queues at the ports and terminals.

I wonder if the increased cost of sending a (scarce) HGV driver across with every container will tip the balance in favour of sending unaccompanied containers through the Tunnel by rail?

 

[furnessvale]

However, Brexit customs checks now mean that the huge army of HGV drivers criss-crossing the Channel are spending increasing amounts of unproductive time sat in lorry parks and motorway queues. This is going to get worse when the EU introduces biometric entry checks later this year. These will require every driver to leave their cab for fingerprint and facial scans, which will inevitably slow down the boarding process of the ferries and Eurotunnel shuttles.

Additionally it seems likely that cross Channel private car traffic will recover this year, adding to the queues at the ports and terminals.

I wonder if the increased cost of sending a (scarce) HGV driver across with every container will tip the balance in favour of sending unaccompanied containers through the Tunnel by rail?

My comments at #750 will still apply.

 

[Dr Hoo]

My comments at #750 will still apply.

Could you provide any more detail of Getlink’s ‘price list’ for lorry shuttles and a conventional train?

I am well aware that specific customer contracts will be subject to commercial confidentiality but even some ballpark figures would be really helpful.

 

[Wyrleybart]

My comments at #750 will still apply.

Thanks for "reposting" that.
What an absolute shocking state of affairs particularly when so many politicians convened on Glasgow for COP(out)26. I was in freight at Bescot from 1980 until 2001 when EWS effectively cut my job out and forced back into pax. I recall one day our yard staff found a couple of stowaways in some wagonsfrom Dollands Moor. Our instructions back then were to tell them to make their own way to an address in Crawley to be "processed". They walked off and that was that. My faith in the UK government and UK railfreight took another hit.
Since then of course there were plans to build a concrete sleeper factory on the yard, bringing thousands of lorryloads of concrete and aggregate by road from the Peak district Fortunately it was abandoned evwen though at the time a new greenfield rail connected warehousding site at Four Ashes was being planned.

Good job we have motorways in the UK

 

[Greybeard33]

My comments at #750 will still apply.

But slower boarding means the ferries and shuttles will have longer turnaround times. Therefore the combined capacity of the Port of Dover and Eurotunnel will likely be insufficient to meet demand.

No point in predatory pricing unless you have spare capacity.

 

[BRX]

There is the additional problem of a depleted/neglected pool of class 92s which I think means that even if there were a sudden increase in demand it would be difficult to respond to it in the short term.

 

[Oxfordblues]

Good news today for those who regret the end of wagonload freight in the UK: DB Cargo are trialling "combi-consists" on the ECML with a mixed train from Doncaster Belmont to Ripple Lane. They're hoping to extend the concept elsewhere. This opens-up the prospect of less-than-trainload volumes being attracted back to rail following the untimely demise of Speedlink and Enterprise. I can think of several flows that could be combined in this way. https://uk.dbcargo.com/rail-uk-en/n...lly-trials-the-use-of-combi-consists--7347716

 

[Speedlink]

"combi-consists" - These are not wagonload services, but rather two full trainloads that been combined for part of their journey in order to save a path.

 

[Dr Hoo]

"combi-consists" - These are not wagonload services, but rather two full trainloads that been combined for part of their journey in order to save a path.

Quite. Two block trains of empty spoil wagons being returned to London coupled together (albeit with a locomotive 'dead in consist'). Nothing to do with 'wagonload'.

This sort of thing was quite common in BR days. For example block loads of empty oil tanks being coupled to block trains of empty fertiliser vans returning to Stanlow/Ince from Peterborough. Without the intermediate locomotive though.

 

[furnessvale]

Could you provide any more detail of Getlink’s ‘price list’ for lorry shuttles and a conventional train?

I am well aware that specific customer contracts will be subject to commercial confidentiality but even some ballpark figures would be really helpful.

The attached document gives the (complicated) charging regime for railfreight users. Having calculated the cost for a train, and divided that by the potential container numbers on a train, this then needs to be compared with Eurotunnel's standard charges per HGV. Having said that, I have no doubt Eurotunnel have "special" rates for regular heavy users.

https://www.getlinkgroup.com/content/uploads/2019/12/DRR_NS_2021_EN_Final1.pdf

 

[Dr Hoo]

The attached document gives the (complicated) charging regime for railfreight users. Having calculated the cost for a train, and divided that by the potential container numbers on a train, this then needs to be compared with Eurotunnel's standard charges per HGV. Having said that, I have no doubt Eurotunnel have "special" rates for regular heavy users.

https://www.getlinkgroup.com/content/uploads/2019/12/DRR_NS_2021_EN_Final1.pdf

Thank you for that. It is clearly a helpful part of the financial jigsaw.

The real difficulty for rail freight is finding a (regular) full load of boxes in both directions between a location in GB and another in Mainland Europe. The classic 'Manchester-Milan' (or 'Doncaster-Valencia', etc.) issue.

Obviously less of an issue with block trains of steel, china clay and so on.

To me a "true" intermodal service both
- carries containers that are transferred to and moved by a different mode of transport at both ends of the rail leg
- carries goods from multiple origins to multiple destinations

Both factors that imply high costs, high variability/uncertainty and a need for a great deal of 'management' compared to each individual through HGV trip being relatively straightforward in itself.

 

[BRX]

Thank you for that. It is clearly a helpful part of the financial jigsaw.

The real difficulty for rail freight is finding a (regular) full load of boxes in both directions between a location in GB and another in Mainland Europe.

That was presumably the hope with the Duisburg<>London Gateway service but obviously it didn't work out.

I was however quite surprised how quickly they seemed to abandon it. I'd have thought you need to run something for a while to induce the demand.

 

[The Ghoul]

"combi-consists" - These are not wagonload services, but rather two full trainloads that been combined for part of their journey in order to save a path.

Exactly what I thought!

 

[Wyrleybart]

That was presumably the hope with the Duisburg<>London Gateway service but obviously it didn't work out.

I was however quite surprised how quickly they seemed to abandon it. I'd have thought you need to run something for a while to induce the demand.

A bit like how many matches a footy team lose before the new manager gets the heave ho for "failure" !!

 

[Donny_m]

Has the new Newton Abbot Hackney Yard aggregate contract been bought up in here? Tonnes of photos on Flickr, and freight on the south west main line, I would have thought it would have been a big talking point.

 

[ExRes]

Has the new Newton Abbot Hackney Yard aggregate contract been bought up in here? Tonnes of photos on Flickr, and freight on the south west main line, I would have thought it would have been a big talking point.

This was only a trial/proving run and, as I understand it, the permission for movement of aggregate from Hemerdon by road to Newton Abbot is still under discussion, this load is due to be delivered to Hitchin Engineers Sdgs on Tuesday hence no panic over 60055 being temporarily unhelpful

 

[Donny_m]

This was only a trial/proving run and, as I understand it, the permission for movement of aggregate from Hemerdon by road to Newton Abbot is still under discussion, this load is due to be delivered to Hitchin Engineers Sdgs on Tuesday hence no panic over 60055 being temporarily unhelpful

Thanks. So many photos on Flickr I assumed it had ran all week. Seems like a lot of gravel at hackney yard so it seems they are hoping for more workings. That yards been overlooked for my whole life, would be good to see it revived into something useful.

Freightliner seemed to have stopped the Bristol aggregate collections, DC rail only now, seems like they’re getting all the small virtual quarry jobs.

 

[The Ghoul]

Thanks. So many photos on Flickr I assumed it had ran all week. Seems like a lot of gravel at hackney yard so it seems they are hoping for more workings. That yards been overlooked for my whole life, would be good to see it revived into something useful.

Freightliner seemed to have stopped the Bristol aggregate collections, DC rail only now, seems like they’re getting all the small virtual quarry jobs.

The DCR Bristol job is generally once a week now

 

[ExRes]

DCR schedule now up for tomorrow, 1336 6Z60 Hackney Yard to Willesden to form 1004 6Z55 to Hitchin on Tuesday


* Two schedules now as an 0420 0V60 Willesden to Hackney Yard is showing

 

[Wandering pete]

Unusual working today(Sunday 20.3.22)..Mountsorrel sidings-Sellafield routed via Cumbrian Coast through BiF..top n tailed by DRS 66/68

 

[The Ghoul]

DCR schedule now up for tomorrow, 1336 6Z60 Hackney Yard to Willesden to form 1004 6Z55 to Hitchin on Tuesday


* Two schedules now as an 0420 0V60 Willesden to Hackney Yard is showing

60046 sent to rescue 60055

 

[Adrian Barr]

A couple of updates that might be of interest - spoil trains to Peterborough and steel slabs to Sunderland Docks.

Spoil update

A while ago on this thread we were discussing the start of spoil trains from London to Tinsley, with a potential new spoil receiving terminal at Peterborough being mentioned.
I believe the first spoil train to Peterborough ran in February and they are now regular runners, usually one train per day running overnight to/from Acton.

It's been difficult to find any pictures or publicity about this new terminal at Peterborough, or even it's exact location, but after a bit of hunting on YouTube it became a bit clearer. If you watch a video titled "Peterborough Railway Station (15/03/2022)" by ECMLexpress, just after the 18 minute mark the camera zooms out to watch a class 156 unit passing Peterborough TMD. There are bogie box wagons loaded with spoil stabled next to the TMD, and the offloading appears to be taking place on a dead-end siding with a buffer stop just north of the shed building itself. On google maps there is a patch of overgrown wasteland here.

These London spoil flows have been changing origin and destination fairly frequently, but this is the current pattern:
Spoil to Peterborough is being loaded at DB's Cricklewood terminal and at Neasden Engineering Sidings, running as separate trains to / from Acton yard.
Spoil to Tinsley is being loaded at Bow and Barking, with the Bow workings running to/from Wembley yard. The empties from Tinsley also sometimes run as a "combi-consist" from Doncaster (mentioned a few posts back), being combined with empty scrap wagons off the Barking - Immingham flow.

Generally these spoil trains load and unload during the day at each end of the flow, and then run on overnight paths on the ECML, with one train per day arriving into each terminal at Peterborough and Tinsley.

Sunderland slabs

There's an article here about a new flow of steel slab from Scunthorpe to Sunderland Docks: https://www.railfreight.com/railfre...-sunderland-vindicates-port-rail-renaissance/
Embedded on that page is a YouTube video by Andy Foster with some good footage of the train arriving and being offloaded.

Trains of steel slab for export from Scunthorpe have run every now and then to both Tees Dock and Immingham for many years - I don't know if this is the same traffic running to a different port, or completely new traffic (I've no idea where the slabs end up).

There were also some movements of imported steel coil from Sunderland Docks to Wolverhampton last year: https://www.railfreight.com/railfreight/2021/07/01/steel-customer-tests-the-mettle-of-db-cargo-uk/
Another video on YouTube by Andy Foster titled "2nd Steel Coil load out from Port of Sunderland to the West Midlands" shows the upgraded track layout on the docks more clearly, which can be compared to the imagery on google maps.

There are also regular scrap metal trains from Sunderland to Cardiff Celsa, but these load in the vicinity of Londonderry sidings rather than on the dock itself - on google maps there is a "Ward Bros Steel Ltd" scrapyard next to the line, at the entrance to Londonderry sidings.

 

[Freightmaster]

Sunderland slabs

There's an article here about a new flow of steel slab from Scunthorpe to Sunderland Docks: https://www.railfreight.com/railfre...-sunderland-vindicates-port-rail-renaissance/
Embedded on that page is a YouTube video by Andy Foster with some good footage of the train arriving and being offloaded.

Trains of steel slab for export from Scunthorpe have run every now and then to both Tees Dock and Immingham for many years - I don't know if this is the same traffic running to a different port, or completely new traffic (I've no idea where the slabs end up).

Although it looks like typical export traffic, this train actually serves a small plate rolling plant at Gateshead,
which until a few weeks ago used to receive its raw materials from Azovstal Iron and Steel Works in Mariupol,
Ukraine, which obviously will not be possible for the foreseeable future.




MARK

 

[Oxfordblues]

A timber train from Aberystwyth last night, possibly a trial run, no doubt hauled by a yellow Class 37: https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:R03653/2022-04-29/detailed

 

[Iskra]

3 extra cross-border daily mail/parcels trains planned

Royal Mail to run more cross-Border trains in expansion of 192-year-old service

Trains with parcels crossing the Border evoked by the classic film Night Mail are to be stepped up as part of a remarkable rail renaissance by the Royal Mail.

www.scotsman.com

 

[Jacob Porrett]

A timber train from Aberystwyth last night, possibly a trial run, no doubt hauled by a yellow Class 37: https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:R03653/2022-04-29/detailed

2x 97s it was. 97303/304 I think it was.

 

[FrodshamJnct]

2x 97s it was. 97303/304 I think it was.

56113 from Chirk to Shrewsbury, then the 97s.