Rail warrant question

[Marty82]

Hello all,

I tend to lurk and read all your interesting discussions but I hope you don't mind me asking a wee question.

I was sent a rail warrant for a return journey from Aberdeen to Glasgow with the dates of travel being 20/2/15 (outward) and 21/2/15 (return). I presented it at the ticket office today and was given my tickets. On moving my tickets from one wallet to another when I returned home, I noticed that I had been issued an off peak return so I will only be able to travel after 9.30am The rail warrant didn't state "off peak only" (I'm not even sure whether this is an option) but I was issued this ticket.

Was the ticket office correct or should the issuer of the warrant have been more specific on the ticket type and if so how? It's rather annoying as I was planning to travel in the morning and I'm sure peak/off peak rules operate on all routes.

On a side note, the issuer of my warrant needs to be a bit more careful. They didn't select standard or first, the didn't score through the empty "children" and "via" fields and put a numeric "1" in the "adults" field rather than in words. If I was a dishonest person, which I am not, I could have easily altered it and taken a lot of extra people with me!

I've had a look at the ATOC rail warrant site and can't see an answer so I thought I'd turn to the knowledgeable forum members here. Thanks in advance.

 

[hairyhandedfool]

The Off-Peak Return on that route is for use after 0915 Mon-Fri or anytime at weekends or Bank Holidays.

Did the clerk ask you when you were travelling during the day?

Is it possble the rail warrant had "Off-Peak" in the 'Type of ticket' field?

 

[Marty82]

The Off-Peak Return on that route is for use after 0915 Mon-Fri or anytime at weekends or Bank Holidays.

Did the clerk ask you when you were travelling during the day?

Is it possble the rail warrant had "Off-Peak" in the 'Type of ticket' field?

Thanks for the reply.

Oops! I thought it was 0930 so thanks for the correction to 0915.

No, she didn't ask at what time of day I was planning to travel.

There was no "peak/off peak" field on the warrant: I only know this as I took a photo to show a friend who didn't know what a rail warrant was. His response was "weird" and couldn't understand why anyone wouldn't just buy a ticket and claim it back.

 

[CyrusWuff]

The clerk is supposed to treat a warrant like any other method of payment, so should ask relevant questions to determine the most appropriate ticket to sell. The difference being that if they make a mistake, they can't alter the details on the warrant for any difference in fare that may be due.

As for completion of the warrant, it's best not to specify a ticket type in case plans change. Suppose they put "Off-Peak Return" and you subsequently need to travel at peak time, or a specific product which subsequently gets withdrawn. All the clerk can do is issue what's on the warrant and charge you the difference.

 

[hairyhandedfool]

....There was no "peak/off peak" field on the warrant: I only know this as I took a photo to show a friend who didn't know what a rail warrant was. His response was "weird" and couldn't understand why anyone wouldn't just buy a ticket and claim it back.

There is a 'Type of Ticket' field, or atleast there should be. Do you still have the picture? There might be something on it you missed?

Rail Warrants allow companies to make sure the person gets a ticket to and from particular places, the person cannot benefit from a refund on the ticket as a refund would go to the warrant account, and there is no need to claim expenses because the company is already paying for the ticket.

 

[LWB]

Hello all,

I tend to lurk and read all your interesting discussions but I hope you don't mind me asking a wee question.

I was sent a rail warrant for a return journey from Aberdeen to Glasgow with the dates of travel being 20/2/15 (outward) and 21/2/15 (return). I presented it at the ticket office today and was given my tickets. On moving my tickets from one wallet to another when I returned home, I noticed that I had been issued an off peak return so I will only be able to travel after 9.30am The rail warrant didn't state "off peak only" (I'm not even sure whether this is an option) but I was issued this ticket.

Was the ticket office correct or should the issuer of the warrant have been more specific on the ticket type and if so how? It's rather annoying as I was planning to travel in the morning and I'm sure peak/off peak rules operate on all routes.

On a side note, the issuer of my warrant needs to be a bit more careful. They didn't select standard or first, the didn't score through the empty "children" and "via" fields and put a numeric "1" in the "adults" field rather than in words. If I was a dishonest person, which I am not, I could have easily altered it and taken a lot of extra people with me!

I've had a look at the ATOC rail warrant site and can't see an answer so I thought I'd turn to the knowledgeable forum members here. Thanks in advance.

Sorry to butt in but is it the done thing to exchange Rail Warrants for tickets? I have a relative who is travelling on a warrant next week and had thought you just presented it to the guard. They did this a week or so ago and were not troubled.

 

[First class]

Sorry to butt in but is it the done thing to exchange Rail Warrants for tickets? I have a relative who is travelling on a warrant next week and had thought you just presented it to the guard. They did this a week or so ago and were not troubled.

The whole point of a warrant is to exchange it for tickets!

Conductors can accept them on board, but the usual rules apply (no discounts, full fare etc, if ticket office open)...

 

[Rick1984]

My warrant is normally stamped "saver ticket only" but even when it wasn't they issued a super off peak return.

I always get a ticket beforehand to avoid any complications with guard.

Strangely when I Travel from Ryde to Great Yarmouth they issue me a ticket from Ryde to Portsmouth and then Portsmouth to London, stating a saver ticket isn't available for first portion. going the other way they issue a ticket for the whole journey.

 

[LWB]

The whole point of a warrant is to exchange it for tickets!

Conductors can accept them on board, but the usual rules apply (no discounts, full fare etc, if ticket office open)...

Ohh dear! I'd better pass that on. Many thanks!

 

[Marty82]

There is a 'Type of Ticket' field, or atleast there should be. Do you still have the picture? There might be something on it you missed?

Rail Warrants allow companies to make sure the person gets a ticket to and from particular places, the person cannot benefit from a refund on the ticket as a refund would go to the warrant account, and there is no need to claim expenses because the company is already paying for the ticket.

The type of ticket field has "return" written in it.

 

[CyrusWuff]

Conveniently, ATOC have written a cheat sheet for completing warrants.

For "Type of Ticket" it has the following to say: "Please state either ‘single’ or ‘return’ only. Do not state ticket type as if this ticket type is not available when the warrant is presented then another type of ticket cannot be issued as a rail warrant cannot be amended in any way"

 

[tsr]

The whole point of a warrant is to exchange it for tickets!

Conductors can accept them on board, but the usual rules apply (no discounts, full fare etc, if ticket office open)...

I don't often have anything to do with warrants, and will try to check up on this, but IIRC there are some TOCs where there is no penalty/full fare for presenting it after passing a ticket office, as the warrant will in any case cover the full amount demanded (per its conditions) and thus it is of little benefit to penalise an organisation on behalf of the person who passed said ticket office - but also that railcard discounts do not apply anyway.

I am doubtful that this appears in public anywhere, but if anyone can find out, I will be most grateful.

Ohh dear! I'd better pass that on. Many thanks!

Quite! A warrant is effectively a means of providing assurance of payment for as much as the TOC demands per the conditions of said warrant. As much as some whom I've spoken to seem to think, I cannot see that it is a ticket, as no record of the contract entered into would have been made available by the TOC involved in any initial transaction. Also, warrants used by the customer should be detailed for accounting purposes by the ticket seller.

Conveniently, ATOC have written a cheat sheet for completing warrants.

For "Type of Ticket" it has the following to say: "Please state either ‘single’ or ‘return’ only. Do not state ticket type as if this ticket type is not available when the warrant is presented then another type of ticket cannot be issued as a rail warrant cannot be amended in any way"

Indeed. I've seen some issued where there was either no way the person could comply with the restrictions of the ticket type incorrectly entered, or where the ticket type didn't exist for that specific journey in the first place. This caused some confusion!

 

[CyrusWuff]

Indeed. I've seen some issued where there was either no way the person could comply with the restrictions of the ticket type incorrectly entered, or where the ticket type didn't exist for that specific journey in the first place. This caused some confusion!

Unofficially, I suspect you'd have no issues if they'd used the pre-complification names under ticket type (i.e. Cheap Day Return, Saver, etc), but if the ticket type is completely non-existent (e.g. Anytime Return to return a different day where only Anytime Day Returns are available), you can't accept the warrant.

 

[Haywain]

There would be problems though if they have written something like Cheap Day Return without understanding the restrictions that apply.

 

[causton]

A lot of warrants I get have "Valid up to £xxxx on it" which was fun when in January they had the old prices on, with the dates that the new prices applied on... A lady even filled out the date right in front of me after I triple checked she knew that everything was correct, wrote the wrong date "Sorry, you'll have to get a new warrant now!"

 

[CyrusWuff]

A lot of warrants I get have "Valid up to £xxxx on it" which was fun when in January they had the old prices on, with the dates that the new prices applied on... A lady even filled out the date right in front of me after I triple checked she knew that everything was correct, wrote the wrong date "Sorry, you'll have to get a new warrant now!"

Technically, a warrant with "Valid up to £xxxx" written on it is invalid, per the "Not valid if altered, defaced or mutilated" clause...But that's a whole other can of worms.

 

[Rick1984]

Looking at the regs your supposed to get ticket before travel and issuser is to give the cheapest ticket.

Is the 'save ticket only stamp' on my warrents also inccorect?

 

[island]

"Save ticket only" is meaningless.