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Railway tresspass....how would you stop it?

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Kernowfem

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After reading the thread, Thick, stupid or what? i went to visit my husbands family who live next to a level crossing on the east coast route just north of newark. While there my father in law had to call the police three times due to children (around the age of ten) playing on the line, quite craftily away from the crossing so as not to be seen by the cameras. It was absolutely heart stopping seeing these children behaving so stupidly...no regard for theirs or anyone elses safety, (god knows what drivers and railway workers go through at times like ones described on this forum) Of course, by the time the police arrived the children had gone. It was the topic of conversation at the dinner table. How do you stop railway tresspass? More importantly is it possible to stop...or mearly reduce?
Id be very interested to hear your views and ideas on how you would try to stop/reduce it. How would you like to see kids and adults being educated on it? And how would you deal with offenders, both adults and children?

Over to you guys.
 
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Ben

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Shoot them








Ok, Better Education... the Australian Safety videos etc...
 

GB

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Sadly you will never eradicate tresspass...you can build the biggest and best defences but if someone wants to gain access they will find away.

However, with young children your best bet is education from both school and home. I dont know if it is already the case, but parents should automatically be held responsable if thier child tresspasses.
 
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As with most crimes in this country, the punishment is just not enough to make people think twice before they break the law (Life should be life, not 5 years if your a good boy etc.........)

What punisments should there be for tresspass on the railways? I have no idea!
 

GB

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What punisments should there be for tresspass on the railways? I have no idea!

If its just someone tresspassing to take a short cut etc etc then at the very least they should be fined and recieve an official police caution. If its tresspass to cause damage or theft then they should be fined and imprisoned.
 

Vulcan

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Education can only go so far when TV is full of american shows where people walk all over the railway track and nobody bats an eyelid (or gets killed).

Even on our little 2' gauge railway I see some disturbing things, parents walking along the track with their kids, who are sometimes only very young. What kind of message is this giving them? Would they do that on the mainline?
 

37401

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With a 12 gauge shotgun, I think hunting should be allowed
"If a person (mainly a chav) streays onto the rail line to commit an illegal act such as theft tresspass or vandalism then said person is legally allowed to be hunted and killed for sport"

There isnt really any way of stopping them, ive seen it happen outside a busy station like new street
 

Kernowfem

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Call me what you want I think they should be showed a body of someone whos been hit by a train and maybe then they will listen?

I was going to suggest this in my OP, but wasnt sure of the reaction i would get. Do you think the shock factor might just do the trick, or do you think parents of children would claim it to be barbaric and traumatising??
 

Bill EWS

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In the States you have to look after yourself, hense no fences on their railways. In The UK railways are fenced to protect the public rom themselves, at considerable expense and as it is the law the railway can be fined for unfenced areas, even if it is wilful damage by the public.

The problem with American films is that the public know their responsibility but when shown in the UK the public here think it looks good and simply copy what they see. Education is a big issue and American films with people walking on their lines should have a warning on that fact.

It will be interesting to see if the States start fencing off their railways when they open a new high-speed line anywhere. I don't recall seeing fencing when watching the east cost fast trains running past, at various places we visited.
 

xc170

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None... If you are stupid enough to trespass on the railway you should get what you deserve IMO.
 

SouthEastern-465

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I was going to suggest this in my OP, but wasnt sure of the reaction i would get. Do you think the shock factor might just do the trick, or do you think parents of children would claim it to be barbaric and traumatising??

It may traumatise them but they'll know not to do it again and warn there kids too when they have them.

But as for the parents they should know where there kids are or keep them under-control.

I have had the problem down here kids ran across the Hastings mainline and just skipped getting hit by a Class 375 traveling at speed but if the kids were to get hit who would get the blame....
 

Dai.

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Giant spikes... over the line so no one can cross.


If the giant spikes idea fails BTP slowly go round with CCTV Evidence and we up the fine -

Wasting police time,
Disregard for personal safety.
Disregard for others safety.

200 pound fine for each.
Governments in the money.
 

4SRKT

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Who remembers the days back in the 80s where trainspotting was like a kind of war of wits between the spotters and the Transport Police? Endless 'cabbing' of locos and log book nicking, with people 'keeping dick' for the peelers. Unofficial 'naming' of locos using a piece of chalk. The North Eastern Railway sign at the footbridge which crosses the ECML just south of Holgate Jn at York which threatened a fine of 40 shillings for trespassers wasn't much of a deterrent IIRR!

I'm not condoning any of this, but it is a world away from what happens now, so at least this form of trespass appears to have been pretty much eliminated. Possibly by making railway enthusiasts persona non grata all over the system. I'll wager that many posters on here who are around my age or above have a few guilty secrets in this regard that they're not owning up to......
 
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I think that there should be an automatic Machine Gun every 50 yards which shoots everyone without proper authorisation, then a device that mails the Body to their families with a covering letter stating that their loved one was trespassing on the railways and they were killed for public safety.

you may call this disgusting but its the only way to stop them
 

4SRKT

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I think that there should be an automatic Machine Gun every 50 yards which shoots everyone without proper authorisation, then a device that mails the Body to their families with a covering letter stating that their loved one was trespassing on the railways and they were killed for public safety.

you may call this disgusting but its the only way to stop them

I do call it disgusting TBF, although I realise you are not 100% serious.
 

gordonthemoron

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sunken poles scattered inbetween the rails, pressure pads to activate and hey presto, hoist by there own petard, they don't like it up 'em
 

graham125hst

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More education in schools about the dangers and maybe children/people tresspassing on the lines should be dealt with more severly.

Other than that I am not sure what else can really be done.
 

O L Leigh

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I'm not so sure. The problem is that the prevailing attitude is that "it won't happen to me". The problem is that this is precisely what all those who actually got hit also thought.

I honestly don't think any amount of pictures or witness testimony or anything much else will make a lot of difference. Trespass is a problem that the railway has to live with.

O L Leigh
 

4SRKT

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I'm not so sure. The problem is that the prevailing attitude is that "it won't happen to me". The problem is that this is precisely what all those who actually got hit also thought.

I honestly don't think any amount of pictures or witness testimony or anything much else will make a lot of difference. Trespass is a problem that the railway has to live with.

O L Leigh

I'm afraid I have to say I agree with this. You can only do so much to protect people from themselves without taking over the whole of society and telling everyone exactly what they can and can't do, and what they need to do to obtain permission.
 

Vulcan

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Another aspect to this is trespass by 'enthusiasts' around a charter or railtour. I went on the Scarbrough Spa Express earlier this year and was amazed to see one such idiot put his life at risk as he stood in the entrance to the tunnel at Knaresbrough (with his back to any oncoming trains) to take a photo of our locomotive. Fourtunately one of the footplate crew stopped him and gave him a good shouting at, but far too many times they get away with it.

I also see it when theres a railtour leaving Carnforth heading South. People stand all the way down the ramp at the end of platform 1, on what is essentially the P'way of the WCML, with Pendolinos screaming past at 100mph behind them. Yet they get away with it and these are the people that should really know better.

It will only take one fatality to put a question mark over any railtours on the mainline.
 

Kernowfem

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Having attended some 45 + fatalities, I'd call you one of the most sensible individuals I have encountered on this issue. I'd say that it wouldn't be going to far to show the stupid little sods some of the photo's taken at the site of fatal accidents. People think getting hit by a train has the same result as being hit by a car. Show them the pictures of 150 lbs of mincemeat or a roasted corpse on top of a coach and they may think twice before using the line as a playground.

G

As a member of the NHS i too understand how seeing this kind of thing can effect those who have to attend these god awful scenes.
I remember years ago when i was in school, we had to watch a video of a boy who cut across the line on the way to a football match...he got his foot stuck and then was hit by a train. It was a dramatisation based on a true story...it scared the hell out of me. But then again it was drilled into me from an early age not to go anywhere near a railway line without an adult.
Bottom line it's not just kids who tresspass..ive had people in my dept who have been out on the town, blind drunk, either missed the last train, walked along the line and been hit, or have been messing around on platforms. infact the amount of people coming into hospitals due to rail incidents is scary, but its the amount that end up in our morgue that really makes you wonder where the hell they left their brain cells that day....and i dont mean all over a main line!!!
 

Oswyntail

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In the gardening world there is a saying "1 year seed - 7 years weed". Unfortunately, we have had nigh on two generations of parenting where the idea of personal responsibility and looking after your own safety has been ignored. After that period of social neglect, even if we started tomorrow, it is going to take much longer to turn society back round. But we have to, and start with proper, effective education.
 

Vulcan

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Apache helicopter gunship patrols along the railways, with pilots trained to be able to shoot around the wires.
 

Nick W

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My approach would be to educate the police who deal with these incidents to communicate with the offenders in a way which shows sympathy, understanding and encourages them to realise for themselves that what they are doing is not a good idea. The following might be a good example.

Police: Hello kids, are you having fun there?
Kids: [Probably caught out because they were expecting abuse and somewhat confused] Yes, we are
Police: I can understand, when I was younger I used to <insert story here about how the policeman broke the law for fun when younger (which could be made up)> however I soon learnt that what I was doing was dangerous because .... You may be having fun now but you could end up like a kid I saw last week <insert horror story>, would you like that? Can you imagine how your parents would feel if you ended up like that?
Kids: [Would find it hard to say anything other than] No / We didn't think about that.
Police: Now, I can't stop you from trespassing, for all I know you could come out here again the second my back is turned, however it sounds like you yourselves have realised why it's not a good idea for you to be here. I'm sure there's plenty of other things you could do together. When I was your age I <insert something here which again could be made up>. Now would you like a lift to somewhere safer?

Now, for how many kids would that not work? If so, is there anything better they can do if current methods of failing?
 

David

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Err, no ....

It's that type of liberal do gooder attitute that has helped get the country in the mess it's in now. "Oh, so your breaking the law? Jolly good. Just make sure you don't get hit though, as I can't be arsed with the paperwork." :roll:

Trespass on the railways is a criminal matter, so should be treated as one. First offence, £1000 fine or 200 hours community service. Second offence double that. After hat, the offender should be made to help clear up after someone gets mullered by a train.

If that doesn't open their eyes to the danger, nothing will.
 
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