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RTVs rejected at station

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Bletchleyite

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Which is why, when the problem came to light, LNER took steps to issue instructions to it's own Travel Centres and to all other TOCs on how the vouchers should be dealt with when presented. You obviously believe that proactive means something else, which you are entitled to do.

Yes, I'm meaning do it in a way which would cause least friction for the users, and to make them aware of the problem. Even a letter confirming that that was what the booking office should do would be better.

What they did was a bare minimum which anyone who even vaguely knows the railway knows was doomed to fail. "Box ticked, not our problem any more".
 
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MotCO

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You are right about knowing the timescale, but by no means all of the vouchers issued had that problem, and many (most?) that did have been accepted anyway. Therefore a general re-issue would cost a lot more than just the postage.

But surely that is the cost to them for making an error in the first place. If you make a mistake, you should expect some consequences. If their systems were sound in the first place, there woudn't be any cost to the TOC. They made a mistake, and they should expect some cost in sorting it out.
 

RJ

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Which is why, when the problem came to light, LNER took steps to issue instructions to it's own Travel Centres and to all other TOCs on how the vouchers should be dealt with when presented. You obviously believe that proactive means something else, which you are entitled to do.

Was Oban copied in on the telegram?
 

robbeech

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Nothing anywhere near that simple
As expected, though I’m not sure why that should therefore make it the passenger’s problem. (And I know you also don’t think it should).
It will cost them money, of course.....
What a shame. Meanwhile the only person affected is the passenger.
You are right about knowing the timescale, but by no means all of the vouchers issued had that problem, and many (most?) that did have been accepted anyway. Therefore a general re-issue would cost an lot more than just the postage.
Good. The more it costs the less likely it’ll happen again. If it costs them nothing but an hour of someone’s time emailing a bunch of operators then there’s no incentive to learn from it given that the whole is a potential financial benefit to them
What they did was a bare minimum which anyone who even vaguely knows the railway knows was doomed to fail. "Box ticked, not our problem any more".
Can you think of an operator that would have acted differently? I can think of a couple that would have handled it even worse.
Telegram? :D Scotrail’s retail team would certainly have been copied in and asked to inform all ticket offices.
And this is where part of the issue is. LNER has an issue, they admit it, and they’ve done something about it. They could have done much more but it chose not to, likely on financial grounds. Scotrail May or may not have received the message, if they have they may or may not have sent it on to ticket offices. Ticket offices may or may not have received the message, if they did some staff may or may not have read it, or may just ignore it because frankly they don’t want any extra work than they already do (or don’t). With the attitude shown by the member of staff it’s difficult to tell whether they’ve got the message and ignored it or haven’t had the message.
 

Bow Fell

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And this is where part of the issue is. LNER has an issue, they admit it, and they’ve done something about it. They could have done much more but it chose not to, likely on financial grounds. Scotrail May or may not have received the message, if they have they may or may not have sent it on to ticket offices. Ticket offices may or may not have received the message, if they did some staff may or may not have read it, or may just ignore it because frankly they don’t want any extra work than they already do (or don’t). With the attitude shown by the member of staff it’s difficult to tell whether they’ve got the message and ignored it or haven’t had the message.

Oh, trust me. You’d be surprised at the amount of stuff that gets missed, that is supposed to “trickle down” from Retail Management and Director Level.
 

RJ

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Telegram? :D Scotrail’s retail team would certainly have been copied in and asked to inform all ticket offices.

That's alright then!

I've had a dig through the retail briefs at work and there is a procedure in place where these RTVs are concerned - but it says under no circumstances should the check digit be changed. Which sounds spot on to me.

If the procedure fails then the customer should be advised to seek a replacement voucher.
 

robbeech

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If the procedure fails then the customer should be advised to seek a replacement voucher.

I would bet the value of the RTV in question that if they went back to lner and asked for a replacement it would be refused.
 

RJ

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I would bet the value of the RTV in question that if they went back to lner and asked for a replacement it would be refused.

At some point you have to give the railways some credit - I've seen nothing to suggest LNER wouldn't if asked. Evidently there has been some discussion at higher levels and that is the corrective procedure that has been agreed.

Suffice to say, communication in big companies can be difficult. The railways love a brief but pinning down shift workers and ensuring briefs are read and understood in full with the knowledge retained is easier said than done. If Milngavie were able to accept the RTVs when Dalmuir and Oban couldn't then there's something peculiar going on which probably needs sorting out. Railway IT can be funny - I've known some pretty serious technical issues only affect specific stations which don't affect neighbouring stations.
 
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Andy Pacer

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At some point you have to give the railways some credit - I've seen nothing to suggest LNER wouldn't if asked. Evidently there has been some discussion at higher levels and that is the corrective procedure that has been agreed.

I returned some to LNER after they were refused at Nuneaton (WMT managed) and they were reissued.
 

lyndhurst25

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I really can't see the point of RTV anymore.
Nor I. Delay Repay can be paid as actual money, and any other needs for them could be dealt with by TOCs issuing codes to redeem on their online booking sites.

Their only purpose, which is negative to TOCs, is basically acting as an insurance against the issue of a Penalty Fare when boarding at a station with a TVM but no booking office.

Some people seem to see the point of them, probably for the reason given above, There is currently a £10 RTV for sake on ebay and the bidding is up to £9.24 + 76p postage with 14 hours to go. Will it go above face value, I wonder?

 

Andy Pacer

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Some people seem to see the point of them, probably for the reason given above, There is currently a £10 RTV for sake on ebay and the bidding is up to £9.24 + 76p postage with 14 hours to go. Will it go above face value, I wonder?

Interestingly the bid + postage equals the £10 value!

Surprise surprise, just tried to use a LNER RTV at Marston Green station ticket office and it wasnt accepted because it wouldn't scan and the code wouldn't work. Looks like I'll be sending them back to LNER again.
 
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HSP 2

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I've got some LNER RTVs from march this year that I've not had chance to use YET but I will do soon (I hope). I did have some last year or early this year that the lass at the ticket office mentioned to her colleague that she had some LNER RTVs, now I understand why.

I much preferer the complimentary travel pass that Northern issue. I don't tend to use them for short journeys of less than about £20. It's a shame that more ToCs don't issue them.
 

SteveM70

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I much preferer the complimentary travel pass that Northern issue. I don't tend to use them for short journeys of less than about £20. It's a shame that more ToCs don't issue them.

Oh yes, a complimentary single to anywhere on the TOCs network would be fantastic for a 30 minute delay repay with XC, Avanti or LNER! Wonder why they don’t offer it?!?
 

Chew Chew

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Oh yes, a complimentary single to anywhere on the TOCs network would be fantastic for a 30 minute delay repay with XC, Avanti or LNER! Wonder why they don’t offer it?!?

How much does an Aberdeen to King's Cross single cost?

I returned some to LNER after they were refused at Nuneaton (WMT managed) and they were reissued.

That's Rob debunked pretty quickly.
 
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35B

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Oh yes, a complimentary single to anywhere on the TOCs network would be fantastic for a 30 minute delay repay with XC, Avanti or LNER! Wonder why they don’t offer it?!?
VTEC did do something similar for me on a very minor problem - actually 2 First Class returns. It cost them very little in cash terms, but gave real good will.
 

Andy Pacer

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VTEC did do something similar for me on a very minor problem - actually 2 First Class returns. It cost them very little in cash terms, but gave real good will.
Sounds good. I'm now awaiting the reissue of my £39.90's worth of RTVs by LNER
 

Bletchleyite

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VTEC did do something similar for me on a very minor problem - actually 2 First Class returns. It cost them very little in cash terms, but gave real good will.

There was a phase when VTWC would give out RTVs of fairly significant value without really reading your complaint letter in an attempt to reduce their backlog and because doing so was cheaper than more customer services staff. This did provide motivation to write and complain about the slightest minor thing as it pretty much always bore fruit.

The move to cash delay repay knocked all that on the head as it costs them actual money.
 

SteveM70

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I recall a pretty horrendous journey from Kings Cross to Leeds back in the GNER days - red hot day, complete aircon failure, ground to a halt for 90 minutes near Tallington. I’m pretty sure i got my fare back, and I definitely got a free return ticket too. It was a scratchcard for the dates and you had to write the destination in.
 

robbeech

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That's Rob debunked pretty quickly.

I certainly hope it is. I consider being "debunked" for this a win for the passenger as it means the passenger gets what they're entitled to. Of course, we haven't seen the OP return their RTVs and request for them to be replaced by LNER yet so we don't actually know for a fact that THEY will be reissued which is what i said, but going on the example above where someone else was successful we can certainly see that they appear to be doing the right thing. So i suggest the OP sends them back as this should be met with more success than i anticipated (based on experience sadly).
 

Andy Pacer

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I certainly hope it is. I consider being "debunked" for this a win for the passenger as it means the passenger gets what they're entitled to. Of course, we haven't seen the OP return their RTVs and request for them to be replaced by LNER yet so we don't actually know for a fact that THEY will be reissued which is what i said, but going on the example above where someone else was successful we can certainly see that they appear to be doing the right thing. So i suggest the OP sends them back as this should be met with more success than i anticipated (based on experience sadly).
Mind were reissued promptly last time I had to get them exchanged!
 

Mathieu

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I certainly hope it is. I consider being "debunked" for this a win for the passenger as it means the passenger gets what they're entitled to. Of course, we haven't seen the OP return their RTVs and request for them to be replaced by LNER yet so we don't actually know for a fact that THEY will be reissued which is what i said, but going on the example above where someone else was successful we can certainly see that they appear to be doing the right thing. So i suggest the OP sends them back as this should be met with more success than i anticipated (based on experience sadly).
I managed to get the tickets I was looking to buy the same evening at Milngavie station with no fuss whatsoever. Phoned ScotRail about the situation but I assume nothing will actually change from this incident sadly.
 

HSP 2

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Oh yes, a complimentary single to anywhere on the TOCs network would be fantastic for a 30 minute delay repay with XC, Avanti or LNER! Wonder why they don’t offer it?!?
The cost to the ToC would be the price of the postage and the man hours in working it out. The ticket price is not that much as,
A) the train is already running full or empty.
B) you will normally have to get back to your starting point, and the cost of a single is not far short of the cost of a return.
 

Andy Pacer

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Update on my reissued RTVs, they asked for a photo of the troublesome ones torn in half, and two days later replacements arrived with a full 12 months validity on from the date they were posted.
 

HSP 2

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Update on my reissued RTVs, they asked for a photo of the troublesome ones torn in half, and two days later replacements arrived with a full 12 months validity on from the date they were posted.

So a good result.
 
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