Showing split e-tickets before the starting point

[mm333]

When doing split ticket journeys with paper tickets, say A-B and B-C, if a ticket check happened before B, I would only show my A-B ticket to them, in case my B-C was clipped and a new guard came on and questioned after leaving B, why my ticket was already clipped.

But now with the prevalence of e-tickets, is there still a reason not to show the B-C e-ticket before getting to B. Will the e-ticket checking machine know that the ticket has previously been checked and throw an error?

 

[JonathanH]

The train manager on the service I caught from Leeds to London this evening was encountering a lot of passengers with etickets to Stevenage and asking them if they had split tickets. Many had so he asked to see the second leg as well.

I guess in this case the train manager was working the whole journey so the issue raised by the OP about a second check doesn't apply.

The train manager will have presumably been checking to ensure that passengers had not simply bought a 'short' ticket.

 

[185143]

When a ticket is scanned, it should record who scanned it. So the TM scanning it later should be able to see it had been scanned on that service.

 

[bcarmicle]

Last time I split tickets, I just told the guard that I was doing so and asked if they wanted to see all of them (which as it happens, they did).

 

[W-on-Sea]

I usually show any parts of split e-tickets relating to the train I'm on. The attitude of TMs towards scanning them has varied.

 

[yorkie]

I will show all relevant tickets unless the crew changes.

In general, the staff will want to see all tickets that cover the part of the journey with them; they usually aren't interested in other tickets.

There are times when it may be better to show all tickets (or at least state your final destination) such as when disruption occurs.

Split tickets can be good for staff at some TOCs as they can get paid on the basis of the number of scans they make.

If travelling south of Sheffield and showing a ticket to Derby, it is very common to be asked if you have any other tickets beyond Derby; most passengers near me have done.

Split ticket websites are getting really good now at calculating the cheapest splits, and with e-tickets it couldn't be easier as you get one PDF containing all tickets (one page per ticket) which makes it super easy to show tickets and also to make Delay Repay claims.

 

[Taunton]

and with e-tickets it couldn't be easier as you get one PDF containing all tickets (one page per ticket) which makes it super easy to show tickets

I suppose the next thing will be that the multiple transaction details will be all shown within one "ticket".

Which is where we came in ...

 

[Wallsendmag]

I suppose the next thing will be that the multiple transaction details will be all shown within one "ticket".

Which is where we came in ...

At least one TOC already offers this.

 

[dingdinger]

I will show all relevant tickets unless the crew changes.

In general, the staff will want to see all tickets that cover the part of the journey with them; they usually aren't interested in other tickets.

There are times when it may be better to show all tickets (or at least state your final destination) such as when disruption occurs.

Split tickets can be good for staff at some TOCs as they can get paid on the basis of the number of scans they make.

If travelling south of Sheffield and showing a ticket to Derby, it is very common to be asked if you have any other tickets beyond Derby; most passengers near me have done.

Split ticket websites are getting really good now at calculating the cheapest splits, and with e-tickets it couldn't be easier as you get one PDF containing all tickets (one page per ticket) which makes it super easy to show tickets and also to make Delay Repay claims.

Out of interest do you know which tocs get commission on e-ticket scans?

 

[Bletchleyite]

At least one TOC already offers this.

One of the (seemingly abortive) fares reform proposals was the ability to put together Advance (and if necessary walk up) fares for a journey into one ticket, wasn't it? It was aimed at removing anomalies caused by splitting by officially embracing it.

 

[Paul Kelly]

Which TOCs pay guards/revenue inspectors per scan? Really interesting as it's not unknown for split ticketing sites to offer more tickets than actually required for the cheapest price.

 

[Wallsendmag]

I think it may be Northern

 

[Aaron1]

I always use split tickets and when the conductor comes round I only ever show them the ticket I currently using to travel, and even when that ticket has stopped being used and I am using the following ticket (but on same train) at no point have they come round again and told me he wanted to see my other ticket as I have travelled past the destination as printed on my first ticket.

 

[317 forever]

I always use split tickets and when the conductor comes round I only ever show them the ticket I currently using to travel, and even when that ticket has stopped being used and I am using the following ticket (but on same train) at no point have they come round again and told me he wanted to see my other ticket as I have travelled past the destination as printed on my first ticket.

When I travelled from Crewe (actually Heaton Chapel having changed at Crewe) to Wolverhampton and had a split ticket at Stafford, I merely showed him my ticket to Stafford. Had he then had a recollection that my ticket had only been valid to Stafford, I would have shown him my Wolverhampton ticket.

In a more glaring example - Leeds to Manchester - I showed him both my WY Bus & Train Day Rover and my onward ticket to Manchester. Then he would have had no reason to suspect I was over-riding.

 

[WelshBluebird]

I'll generally show all tickets that make up my journey, though at least once I've been told by a train manager not to bother as it takes up too much time. So who knows!

 

[Dood75]

Or to make things more simpler, bring the actual fare down from A-B to stop having to do A-C splitting at B

 

[zero]

I always use split tickets and when the conductor comes round I only ever show them the ticket I currently using to travel, and even when that ticket has stopped being used and I am using the following ticket (but on same train) at no point have they come round again and told me he wanted to see my other ticket as I have travelled past the destination as printed on my first ticket.

I get the feeling that they mentally mark each person as "checked" but they don't necessarily remember what was on the ticket.

I've had a single for one or two stops and then a rover, only showed the single and then stayed on for several more hours on the rover but wasn't asked again.

I've seen people get away with short faring too, after th guard is out of earshot they boast about only having a ticket to B and then staying on until C, or even more brazenly buying to B from the guard and then staying on beyond (and once someone called the guard back and asked to buy another ticket as they felt guilty - the guard admitted he forgot where their original ticket was to)

 

[toffeedanish]

The majority of tickets are now just scanned. A positive beep and the guard moves on. I do wonder if mindsets have changed as a result of this and paper tickets without Aztec coded are checked less thoroughly. Anecdotally, I would suggest that this is the case, at least in Northern land. My period returns are no longer taken, scribbled on with a biro, and returned, merely acknowledged. Electronic scans and not physically touching tickets must result in individual passenger destinations being less likely to stick in the mind.

 

[zero]

The majority of tickets are now just scanned. A positive beep and the guard moves on. I do wonder if mindsets have changed as a result of this and paper tickets without Aztec coded are checked less thoroughly. Anecdotally, I would suggest that this is the case, at least in Northern land. My period returns are no longer taken, scribbled on with a biro, and returned, merely acknowledged. Electronic scans and not physically touching tickets must result in individual passenger destinations being less likely to stick in the mind.

I guess if you have a scanner in one hand it's harder to hold a pen at the same time, but I don't think anything has changed that much even since 3-4 years ago; Northern guards mostly didn't scribble on my tickets then as well.

 

[pne]

I get the feeling that they mentally mark each person as "checked" but they don't necessarily remember what was on the ticket.

I've had a single for one or two stops and then a rover, only showed the single and then stayed on for several more hours on the rover but wasn't asked again.

I've seen people get away with short faring too, after th guard is out of earshot they boast about only having a ticket to B and then staying on until C, or even more brazenly buying to B from the guard and then staying on beyond (and once someone called the guard back and asked to buy another ticket as they felt guilty - the guard admitted he forgot where their original ticket was to)

Reminds me of the time I took the Looe branch railway in Cornwall – I walked down from Liskeard to Coombe just to get onto one of the few services a day that stopped there.

The guard said, "I hope you'll be buying a ticket from me!" and indeed that had been my plan; I got a return from Coombe to St Keyne's (the next stop) even though I didn't need the ticket (since I had a day ranger ticket I was using). I just wanted a paper ticket for the novelty of having one from COE (and to slightly skew with the statistics of how many people "use" those two stops, which were both fairly low down on the list).

The guard never came back to me even though I stayed on until Looe; even though buying a ticket from Coombe must have been an unusual occurrence for her, the ticket she sold apparently didn't stick in her mind for her to check again after my supposed destination.

I assume it was something like the "mentally marked as 'checked'" that went on there.

 

[philthetube]

Working as a bus driver, similar job in the context of this thread, I would always clock one or two passengers who I thought might be at it and keep and eye on those