Stopping points - signage, driver discretion

[py_megapixel]

I do not work in the railway industry, so I thought a thread here would be the best bet to answer my questions.

Many stations across the network have information for drivers about train stopping points, assuming I am not getting anything horribly wrong. For example, "5-car stop" presumably means that drivers of 5-carriage trains should stop there.

I have also seen S-car stop, which leads me to my first question. What does this mean?

A few stations also seem to have TOPS numbers (for example, at Cheltenham Spa, a board which says "VT220" appears to correspond to where CrossCountry. (ex-Virgin Trains) class 220s stop. Am I right about this?

What is the case at stations with no stopping position boards?

May drivers ever choose to stop elsewhere (for example, close to a waiting shelter during heavy rainfall)?

 

[pdeaves]

S-car = everything stop here.
VT220 is as you state (VT was Virgin Trains but can now be interpreted as Voyager Trains to save changing it!)

 

[Peter C]

I don't work on the railway, but I have been to Oxford a lot and I think there is an S-Car Stop marker at the end of Platform 4, but all of (what I call them at least) the Didcot Shuttles, which are GWR Turbostars, all stop at the section of the platform covered by a canopy.
I have seen VT signs without "220" on, so yes - it just means Voyager Train nowadays!
At a station with no stopping boards, I would assume that the driver simply stops at the end of the platform, or maybe if the platform is really long they would be kind and stop near the entrance/exit or covered area, if there is one.
An awful lot of stations across the network have stopping boards - I'd go as far to say that 80% of them do - but please correct me if I'm wrong. Kingham station is greedy and has some signs for HST sets - both 7 and 8 car formations!

-Peter

 

[bramling]

I do not work in the railway industry, so I thought a thread here would be the best bet to answer my questions.

Many stations across the network have information for drivers about train stopping points, assuming I am not getting anything horribly wrong. For example, "5-car stop" presumably means that drivers of 5-carriage trains should stop there.

I have also seen S-car stop, which leads me to my first question. What does this mean?

A few stations also seem to have TOPS numbers (for example, at Cheltenham Spa, a board which says "VT220" appears to correspond to where CrossCountry. (ex-Virgin Trains) class 220s stop. Am I right about this?

What is the case at stations with no stopping position boards?

May drivers ever choose to stop elsewhere (for example, close to a waiting shelter during heavy rainfall)?

The problem with stopping in the wrong place is it's okay until something happens, but if it does then the driver will potentially be in hot water.

It certainly used to be common practice at Hitchin on the up side, where the 6-car stopping mark (for 2x313 formations) was level with the 8-car mark. Some 2x313 drivers used to stop short in order to place the majority of the train at the rear end of the platform, which is where the entrance is. This practice stopped a few years ago as part of a greater focus on avoiding "stop shorts".

I think it's better all round simply for drivers to observe the correct stopping positions as far as possible, as at least then everyone knows where they stand. Regular passengers do get to know where the normal stopping positions are, so if a subset of drivers work in a different way then all it does is mess everyone around.

 

[High Dyke]

You will see a variety of stop markers and other associated signs regarding where trains should stop all around the network. For a good point of reference try here: http://www.railsigns.uk/sect21page1/sect21page1.html

 

[Lemmy99uk]

There are a few places where the mess room door acts as the stop board.

 

[DMU180]

My favourite of all the stop boards is the Caledonian Sleeper which uses ZZ!

 

[Peter C]

My favourite of all the stop boards is the Caledonian Sleeper which uses ZZ!

I remember seeing something about that online - proving the railway does do comedy!

-Peter

 

[Crossover]

May drivers ever choose to stop elsewhere (for example, close to a waiting shelter during heavy rainfall)?

Disclaimer being that I also don't work in the industry, but with the advent of ASDO (Automatic Selective Door Operation), I believe the stop boards will be home to workings for those - in some cases this is in the form of balises or some work on GPS. The stop boards in some areas are also next to DOO (Driver Only Operation) monitors.

On the flip side, I have seen places where the boards are sometimes not adhered to (including an Up Highland Sleeper recently which stopped nowhere near the ZZ board at a station on the West Highland Line), though I am unsure if they are for the new stock rather than the old

So it probably depends on where as to whether stop boards must be observed

 

[Crossover]

My favourite of all the stop boards is the Caledonian Sleeper which uses ZZ!

I remember seeing something about that online - proving the railway does do comedy!

-Peter

Yes, very much a thing. I took a photo of the one on the Up platform at Motherwell last week and also saw some on the West Highland Line the weekend just gone

 

[Mordac]

The problem with stopping in the wrong place is it's okay until something happens, but if it does then the driver will potentially be in hot water.


.

Wish someone would tell Cross City Line drivers that. They seem to stop completely at random.

 

[Eccles1983]

Depends if it's raining or not.

I don't want to see passengers trundle down the platform in the rain when I know the length of my train fits on the platform. Some of the stop boards are ridiculously placed.

Some require stopping at correctly to ensure wheelchairs can get the correct door without hindrance.

As always route knowledge is key - any driver worth his/her salt knows when to comply with the board and when they are useless.

 

[marks87]

My favourite of all the stop boards is the Caledonian Sleeper which uses ZZ!

On Sunday I noticed two different Sleeper stop boards on platform 19 at Edinburgh Waverley. One, near platform 2 (actually, it might have been on 2) was "ZZ/Lowlander", while at the far end it was "8 car/Sleeper".

Can anyone explain those? The only reason the Sleeper would face that way is from an ECML diversion, but in that case I'd have thought the "ZZ" should be at the end of P19 so that the full 16 coaches could be accommodated along the length of 19/2. But I'm probably missing something obvious.

 

[Islineclear3_1]

In Thameslink-land, there are stop boards telling drivers where to stop

RLU = Reduced Length Unit (e.g. for 8-car Class 700s)
FLU = Full length Unit (e.g. for 12-car Class 700s)

 

[Deepgreen]

At Redhill, platform 0 (opened in 2017) has NB stopping boards which are obviously aimed at GTR trains, and which ignore GWR. This means, for the want of a simple 2/3car board, that GWR trains stop way down the platform, needlessly far from the platform entrance and almost completely outside the canopy! Passengers get wet and are more likely to miss connections just because no-one could be bothered to provide a single extra sign in the botched platform construction project. I've complained to GTR three times and have been fobbed off. I threatened to make a sign myself and stick it up!
Photo attached, showing a reversing GWR train sitting conveniently way down the platform and outside the canopy. SB 12car trains (toward the camera) stop right by the railing, so there's no reason not to permit reversing trains to stop accordingly. Even with the blank canvas of a new build, it's been messed up.

 

[ComUtoR]

Haven't we had the discussion about the stopping point at Redhill before. There was a whole thread about it, even the same picture.