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Travelling with small children: What improvements could be made?

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al78

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They were loud, playing games and laughing with each other while the mums talked. I continued working on a project on my laptop, not exactly ignoring them all but never really interacting with them. When I stood up to leave I heard the child who was sitting next to me ask their mum why I was so serious. The response was "because he's a boring man who, if he doesn't like noise or sharing with children, shouldn't be on a train".
I would have been very tempted to tell the mother that I have no ill feeling towards children, but I do have little tolerance for ignorant judgemental idiots who make assumptions about people they know nothing about.
 

MadCommuter

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A soft play area where all the kids can go and play together to give the grown ups some peace....;)
 

Deafdoggie

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Designated family coaches on long distance, 5+ coach trains but exclusively on weekends with the following changes:
  • Giant stickers with board games printed on them, so they can be peeled off after the weekend ready for the Monday rat run. Dice and cards rentable at a deposit from the host/shop.
  • Pop music played through the coach (or maybe not, this could get grating)
  • Children's meals and other activities also buyable from the shop.
  • If licensing can be agreed, one or two TVs playing children's shows throughout the carriage, in lieu of how airplanes used to have movies on them, but with the relevant information still being displayed to one side.
You want to make family coaches as appealing as possible and give children plenty to do. This achieves that and more, and can all be packed away for normal weekday operation.
If table stickers can be peeled off, the children will do it! I don't see how anyone can't work on a table with a board game printed on it permanently.
Music & TV is unnecessary as they will have their own devices with their own favourite things on.
Whilst family meals are a good idea, I doubt the railways could compete on price. Most families are on a budget, an expensive meal on a train is a luxury.
 

Ianno87

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I once shared a Thameslink declassified first class table with 2 mums who had 5 children between them. The mums sat facing me and one of the children sat next to me, with the other 4 children on the table across the aisle.

They were loud, playing games and laughing with each other while the mums talked. I continued working on a project on my laptop, not exactly ignoring them all but never really interacting with them. When I stood up to leave I heard the child who was sitting next to me ask their mum why I was so serious. The response was "because he's a boring man who, if he doesn't like noise or sharing with children, shouldn't be on a train".

I didn't respond at all, but I genuinely had no ill feelings towards them as I had a new baby at the time. I was quite happy working on my laptop, their noise didn't distract me, I didn't (I don't think!) give off any vibes of annoyance, because I wasn't annoyed.

I've thought about how I would react differently if it happened again, and have decided to clearly explain upfront that they're welcome to make noise and play games, I am very good at tuning it out when working, and that I am in no way offended by them. Sadly the opportunity has never arisen to see if that works out any better!

And situations like that can be resolved by normalising passengers talking to each other. The Mum(s) probably just assumed you were annoyed by the kids, whereas a few bits of small talk between you would "break the ice".
 

flitwickbeds

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And situations like that can be resolved by normalising passengers talking to each other. The Mum(s) probably just assumed you were annoyed by the kids, whereas a few bits of small talk between you would "break the ice".
Agreed. But by the same token the passive aggressive comment made when I left (no idea if it was "designed" to be heard by me, or whether I only heard it because I have particularly good hearing!) based purely on me "being in the zone" on my laptop and able to tune them out felt very unnecessary.
 

Bletchleyite

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And situations like that can be resolved by normalising passengers talking to each other. The Mum(s) probably just assumed you were annoyed by the kids, whereas a few bits of small talk between you would "break the ice".

It isn't obligatory to talk to other passengers, and those who choose not to (other than acknowledging a polite hello or similar) should not be deprecated in any way for doing so.
 

Ianno87

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It isn't obligatory to talk to other passengers, and those who choose not to (other than acknowledging a polite hello or similar) should not be deprecated in any way for doing so.

Of course it's not. But if people did it more, confrontation and conflict would be reduced.
 

LSWR Cavalier

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I usually like talking to strangers, except if I am tired or want to read something.

Possible conversation:

Stranger: can I sit here?
Self: you can, but you may not!
 

TheSeeker

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Took the TGV from Brussels to Disneyland Paris once with my two small children and have taken them on the Eurostar to see family many times. The outward journey was very early so they just slept. Coming back on Sunday afternoon was a bit hectic as they were so excited. The key, from a parents point of view is to be well prepared. Bring your own games, colouring books, food and drinks (we always had a bag already prepared for going anywhere). Make up games to play with them "I spy", "First to spot ten of X", looking at the speed of the train on a phones GPS app etc.

Not so sure the train companies have to offer anything extra that they wouldn't offer normal passengers or groups. The new accessible toilets help a lot.

One other thing. Good research of the route and stations by the parents helps a lot. Knowing where the lifts are, how far there is to walk to the platform, where the toilets are, getting to the station in advance.
 

Robertj21a

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Of course it's not. But if people did it more, confrontation and conflict would be reduced.
Not necessarily. Unfortunately, there's a group of people who will object to virtually anything and be prepared to argue with anybody.
 

Bletchleyite

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Of course it's not. But if people did it more, confrontation and conflict would be reduced.

Though equally, to counter the extrovert's plea for a chat, if more people respected that others simply want "quiet enjoyment" and don't want smalltalk, then that would also help.

It's rude not to acknowledge a polite hello, but it's also rude to engage someone in conversation beyond that if they give signals that they don't want that (e.g. earphones in, reading a book or similar, or even an overt "I'm afraid I'm busy at the moment").
 

amarshe

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The biggest issue for me was space with very young ones still in pushchairs - particularly busy services. Even our compact pushchair had to be on occasion left in vestibules (because of lack of room) or precariously balanced. Second, and it's better these days! - is clean toilets. Once they're out of pushchairs it's easier; entertainment is nice but as parents we provide that. Intercity services were usually tolerable, it's the connecting services on packed DMUs (156s/158s).

Once they're out of pushchairs it's much easier and for the most part staff and passengers are fine. I always look up sporting events prior to travel to avoid trains supporting those - a guide to that would help those parents. I learned this the hard way with a three year old on a local train a few years back, most fans were fine but the stench of alcohol and banter is best avoided...
 

Bletchleyite

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Another thing that would help would be showing expected loadings on planners and departure screens. Someone with kids is very likely to choose to avoid a train that is very busy if there is a reasonable other option, even when reserving (as it can e.g. make accessing the toilet* difficult).

* Memories of travelling unreserved second class in India (aka sardine-can express) and passing a kid over our heads to the bog!
 

Rhydgaled

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5) Level boarding
Is it possible to increase platform heights to provide level boarding with UK stock where the doors are over the bogies? In some cases, over the bogies is the best place to put the doors for other reasons so if that prevents level boarding everywhere then we can't have level boarding everywhere.
 

47434

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I would have loved the idea of a family compartment (as the European trains enjoy) when our kids were young - whether we like it or not people still sniff at children as if they should be 'seen and not heard' - quite ludicrous.

Bottle warming was something we missed - will the plugs on modern trains cope with this now?
 

Emmsie

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.I remember those badges that said something like 'happy to chat' or words to that effect. The comments in the paper were along the lines of 'I don't want to chat to some stranger on a train' Well yes that was the point of the badges.
 

30907

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4) Dedicated seats for mums breastfeeding
My wife reacts - what's wrong with breastfeeding? (OK some mums are uncomfortable but a breast-friendly policy (no sniggers please) would be better).

5) Level boarding
....such as a wheelchair user might require, is really not essential for a buggy, though a reasonable vertical and horizontal distance is (try a buggy through a Mk 1 door with a 30cm drop to the platform.... I've done it).
 

MCSHF007

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I would have loved the idea of a family compartment (as the European trains enjoy) when our kids were young - whether we like it or not people still sniff at children as if they should be 'seen and not heard' - quite ludicrous.
Not ludicrous at all. I strongly prefer a journey free from shrill voices. Would definitely support the idea of family compartments though (provided usage thereof was compulsory for those with younger children ;))
 

peteb

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The single thing UK railways could do to improve long distance travel with kids would be to end its total resistance to compartment stock. Many EU countries run a semi open carriage on IC trains with the 3 or 4 compartments dedicated to families and sometimes a double compartment play area. This not only improves safeguarding but contains children safely.....imagine a toddler wandering off if parent falls asleep. It also reduces antagonism amongst other passengers due to excited shouts, noise from video games etc. So better for everyone, except perhaps the train companies!
 

Robertj21a

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Not ludicrous at all. I strongly prefer a journey free from shrill voices. Would definitely support the idea of family compartments though (provided usage thereof was compulsory for those with younger children ;))
A good point. If dedicated facilities for families with young children were to be supplied does it become compulsory for them to use it?
What if a family refuses?
 

peteb

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A good point. If dedicated facilities for families with young children were to be supplied does it become compulsory for them to use it?
What if a family refuses?
From the many continental journeys ive made there are far more families per train than dedicated compartments, but thats because ive always travelled in school holidays. Its not compulsory in France or Germany.
 

Robertj21a

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Why would a family refuse to use a coach specifically designed for their needs if it wasn't full?
?? Numerous reasons I would have thought. Many might NOT want to be separated from the general public, facility not appreciated by all age groups in family etc.
 

Bletchleyite

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?? Numerous reasons I would have thought. Many might NOT want to be separated from the general public, facility not appreciated by all age groups in family etc.

I bet the number of people who actively want to mix with the general public on public transport is somewhere around 0. The public is considered by most as something that must be tolerated. "A coach to yourself" is a prize.

I can't see anyone not wanting a table seat with a decent table and power sockets.
 

Mikey C

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I bet the number of people who actively want to mix with the general public on public transport is somewhere around 0. The public is considered by most as something that must be tolerated. "A coach to yourself" is a prize.

I can't see anyone not wanting a table seat with a decent table and power sockets.
Many people are happy with the airline seats as there's nobody opposite you fighting for foot room and you avoid the couples/groups on the table
 
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