Vaccine Passports/Permanent restrictions

[bspahh]

Personally when travelling in Europe I have rarely bothered with travel insurance and never had any problems. Perhaps I have been reckless. Perhaps I have been astonishingly lucky. I have the EU health card that covers health care costs (yes I know you might have to pay costs first and claim them back later, but I could use savings to do so). My home insurance covers possessions that are away from home if they are stolen. Airlines have to compensate under the EU261 if the flight is delayed/cancelled and you need overnight accommodation or incur other expenses. (I have only had to put this into practice once, but I was put up for the night, transport and meal costs paid for, so I had no complaints). I wouldn't take the risk of travelling to other countries, like the US with no insurance. So the question might be more of the EU health card covers Covid in which case it may not be such an issue if insurance excludes it if you are travelling in Europe.

By way of comparison, I did take out travel insurance in 2019 which covered me through to 2020. When I did try to claim on it, for a trip I couldn't make due lockdown restrictions and that the hotel refused to refund, the travel insurance company told me that according the UK Government (the competition and markets stuff) they believe they should be refunding so I must take it up with the hotel as they won't pay out where the hotel is liable to refund. I had already done so and provided all communications where they flat out refused. In any case the hotel was outside the UK, so whatever the UK Government thinks they should be doing is largely irrelevant. In addition the hotel had gone bankrupt between me booking and the date I was due to travel. It was still open, as the result of a management buy out. The hotel explained this (and provided details of the old company number that was now bankrupt and so on), explaining that the money I paid had been paid to a now bankrupt company and as a result they could not legally refund it. When I pushed back AXA then changed their tune to the fact the hotel had offered a change of dates (which is true) so the money was "recoverable" and they wouldn't pay out. They ignored the fact the hotel had offered to change the dates of the booking but had also stated that if I arrived on that date I would have to pay again. I.E. they wern't offering to change dates for free, they were effectively offering to make a second booking, for which I'd have to pay again.

Unfortunately there are other issues around potentially having to qurantine/self isolate but most don't seem to cover that now.

As to the driving license that's a very different issue. You are legally required to posses a driving license in order to be able to drive without an instructor present. So it seems perfectly logical to check that. You are not, yet, required to have a vaccine passport in order to travel. So I see now issue with asking to prove you are legally qualified to drive considering not everyone is.

A distant relative had a serious medical problem when they were in the UK, but checked themselves out of hospital, and headed off to the EU to meet up with a partner. They were relying on the EHIC card (it was a few of years ago) got ill again, and found that they weren't covered, because they had left the UK hospital against the medical advice. I don't know what the bill was for their treatment and repatriation to the UK, but it was a lot. Luckily they have enough assets to pay for the bill.

Personally, I would always get travel insurance, perhaps with a hefty excess so its cheaper and only worthwhile for life changing bills.

Insurance companies aim to make a profit. Insurance companies that make a loss are really scary.

 

[SouthEastBuses]

Greece and Israel will allow people in with a vaccine OR negative covid test so unvaccinated can travel.

But it questions how we get tests? How long do they allow you in after a negative result? How many tests on a 2 week holiday?

Spain too apparently will continue to allow people to enter the country without the need to be vaccinated.

 

[Bantamzen]

BBC is reporting that Greece and Austria are encouraging EU states to introduce vaccine passports. Although there's evidently not a consensus in the EU and continuing with self-isolation would somewhat ruin your holiday / make it pointless for a young couple / young family / group of friends.

Coronavirus: EU urged to adopt 'vaccine passports'

Greece and Austria want coronavirus-free tourists this summer, but other EU states have concerns.

www.bbc.co.uk

And its exactly for these reasons that Germany & France among others are not happy about the idea because it risks discriminates against those yet unable to have a vaccine. Testing of course is another option (and one I suspect will be the fall back), but isolation even on a 14 day holiday isn't going to work. And two week holidays are not the only lengths taken, making the idea of isolation even dafter. I have no idea why Greek politicians seem to think its a good idea, but with holidays flying off the shelves I'm sure pressure will be growing from the various islands for them to engage brain before mouth. The last thing their economy needs is another round of last minute cancellations.

There is of course another reason why vaccine passports are not a good idea, especially this year. Notwithstanding the fact that we don't yet know if further boosters will be needed in the years to come, but a sudden imposition of their requirements around the globe is going to drive commercial demand for the vaccines. With the WHO pressuring governments to start to distribute excess vaccines to poorer nations, the very last thing they need is a demand for them from rich countries to enable travel. Because it won't be very long before the private sector, and indeed medical practices see value in selling them on demand, breaking any chain of publicly funded rollout. Its about time that politicians around the world gave their heads a wobble. If their countries are still rolling out vaccination programmes to their vulnerable, do they really want to risk supplies running dry because demand from the private sector suddenly gets priority?

Then I'm sorry you've missed the whole element of the purpose of that propaganda, and how it supported the agenda of the Party. For your argument to work, the propaganda would have to be intended to support that kind of totalitarian government.

Well then I'm sorry to say my English Literature teacher who marked my work & gave me an A+ for it would disagree. We were asked to choose a character for the assignment, and imagine ourselves seeing Orwell's world through their eyes, I chose Big Brother. And yes I know there was no "Big Brother" as a person, and that was the whole point of my work. I looked at the story through the eyes of the regime, including how it came into existence & evolved. And I used research on real dictatorships to gain an insight into how these evolve in the real world, because after all this was written by a man who had seen the world on the brink & saw what might have become.

I'm not going to take this any further on this thread, other than to say I think your interpretation doesn't match what I have experienced whenever I have read the book. And judging by other responses to current government messaging both here and elsewhere, I am not alone.

 

[takno]

A distant relative had a serious medical problem when they were in the UK, but checked themselves out of hospital, and headed off to the EU to meet up with a partner. They were relying on the EHIC card (it was a few of years ago) got ill again, and found that they weren't covered, because they had left the UK hospital against the medical advice. I don't know what the bill was for their treatment and repatriation to the UK, but it was a lot. Luckily they have enough assets to pay for the bill.

Personally, I would always get travel insurance, perhaps with a hefty excess so its cheaper and only worthwhile for life changing bills.

Insurance companies aim to make a profit. Insurance companies that make a loss are really scary.

If you travelled in those circumstances with travel insurance, you'd likely find that didn't cover you either. The fact that they might have put you in more expensive facilities before they found out your cover was invalid, and the addition of another company chasing you for the debt, may even mean it cost more

 

[ainsworth74]

Okay, the diversion into Orwell and 1984 along with musings on freedom of speech and the limits there of is very interesting but it is also very off-topic at this stage. I'd ask that members take it to a new thread in General Discussion and otherwise focus back on matters related directly to vaccine passports in this thread please

 

[Gadget88]

Right as vaccine passports may be coming for travel I seen a negative covid result may be accepted. I often travel to France for a day visit so I guess that result could do be going out and return? Also would the saliva tests from Superdrug be accepted as they are lab tested? Should I expect to pay more for travel insurance?

If anybody could help that would be great I would he interested in heading abroad for a day visit but question is how safe would it be after May when things open? Given Europe is vaccinating slower?

Spain too apparently will continue to allow people to enter the country without the need to be vaccinated.

Yep my fear is any tests would need done in Spain if going for maybe a week? Just for the return leg. I was considering France for a day trip as that negative result could do me for a day there and back?

 

[35B]

And its exactly for these reasons that Germany & France among others are not happy about the idea because it risks discriminates against those yet unable to have a vaccine. Testing of course is another option (and one I suspect will be the fall back), but isolation even on a 14 day holiday isn't going to work. And two week holidays are not the only lengths taken, making the idea of isolation even dafter. I have no idea why Greek politicians seem to think its a good idea, but with holidays flying off the shelves I'm sure pressure will be growing from the various islands for them to engage brain before mouth. The last thing their economy needs is another round of last minute cancellations.

There is of course another reason why vaccine passports are not a good idea, especially this year. Notwithstanding the fact that we don't yet know if further boosters will be needed in the years to come, but a sudden imposition of their requirements around the globe is going to drive commercial demand for the vaccines. With the WHO pressuring governments to start to distribute excess vaccines to poorer nations, the very last thing they need is a demand for them from rich countries to enable travel. Because it won't be very long before the private sector, and indeed medical practices see value in selling them on demand, breaking any chain of publicly funded rollout. Its about time that politicians around the world gave their heads a wobble. If their countries are still rolling out vaccination programmes to their vulnerable, do they really want to risk supplies running dry because demand from the private sector suddenly gets priority?

I take your point about the risk of private demand, but think it rather contradicts your challenge to the use of vaccine passports for international travel. Discrimination is not always a bad thing, and if the use of vaccine passports helps protect public health, then that discrimination may well be justified.

As for the reactions from France and Germany, I'll just observe that they are two countries where the vaccination programmes are not performing hugely well, and politicians in those countries may find it rather difficult to explain to their voters why they've been so great if those voters aren't allowed to travel.

 

[Erniescooper]

I have an app on my phone called MyGP which i use for repeat prescriptions and booking appointments which is linked directly to my NHS records. I've noticed this morning on the homepage it has added "Coming soon MyGP TICKet, a simple and assured way of showing your vaccine status" and then in the explanation it describes it as your TICKet back to normal.

 

[LAX54]

Again 3 weeks.. now approaching over a year... Will the goalposts be moved again let’s see..

But is already 'over a year' ? many reported symptoms the same a covid back in December and January, I know we had some off sick from work, who were really bad, which was unusual for them, but put it down to a bad bout of flu, a bit like the bad season of 17/18

Whilst I do not agree with 'passports' in general, what do we do if the Country that you wish to visit says you must have one, surely the UK should be prepared for this, and have them ready if people want them ?

 

[Yew]

I take your point about the risk of private demand, but think it rather contradicts your challenge to the use of vaccine passports for international travel. Discrimination is not always a bad thing, and if the use of vaccine passports helps protect public health, then that discrimination may well be justified.

As for the reactions from France and Germany, I'll just observe that they are two countries where the vaccination programmes are not performing hugely well, and politicians in those countries may find it rather difficult to explain to their voters why they've been so great if those voters aren't allowed to travel.

We've spent the last year being told how it is unfair to not allow the elderly to do things whilst the rest of us go about outlives. Yet now we seem to be actively considering creating vaccine-status apartheid, in complete violation of this argument.

 

[Bantamzen]

I take your point about the risk of private demand, but think it rather contradicts your challenge to the use of vaccine passports for international travel. Discrimination is not always a bad thing, and if the use of vaccine passports helps protect public health, then that discrimination may well be justified.

As for the reactions from France and Germany, I'll just observe that they are two countries where the vaccination programmes are not performing hugely well, and politicians in those countries may find it rather difficult to explain to their voters why they've been so great if those voters aren't allowed to travel.

Justified on what basis? Whilst the vaccine may help slow spread, it's primary purpose is to protect the person vaccinated. So as such it's going to be a limited use at best in preventing spread. This is why I object to the idea of vaccine passports, they are yet another political solution to a biological problem. We are still some 3 months away before holiday travel abroad will likely be possible again, and we've seen what we can do in less time than that. Countries like Germany & France are right to be sceptical on their merits, and despite you dismissing rights of unvaccinated people they also recognise why you can't do that. Long may that live.

 

[kez19]

But is already 'over a year' ? many reported symptoms the same a covid back in December and January, I know we had some off sick from work, who were really bad, which was unusual for them, but put it down to a bad bout of flu, a bit like the bad season of 17/18

Whilst I do not agree with 'passports' in general, what do we do if the Country that you wish to visit says you must have one, surely the UK should be prepared for this, and have them ready if people want them ?

I have been saying this very thing (to myself).

 

[35B]

We've spent the last year being told how it is unfair to not allow the elderly to do things whilst the rest of us go about outlives. Yet now we seem to be actively considering creating vaccine-status apartheid, in complete violation of this argument.

Unfair, or simply impractical? And if unfair, can I suggest there's a wee difference between the unfairness of not being allowed to go somewhere on public health grounds, and the reasoning behind the restrictions that are now coming to an end.

Justified on what basis? Whilst the vaccine may help slow spread, it's primary purpose is to protect the person vaccinated. So as such it's going to be a limited use at best in preventing spread. This is why I object to the idea of vaccine passports, they are yet another political solution to a biological problem. We are still some 3 months away before holiday travel abroad will likely be possible again, and we've seen what we can do in less time than that. Countries like Germany & France are right to be sceptical on their merits, and despite you dismissing rights of unvaccinated people they also recognise why you can't do that. Long may that live.

The benefit is both personal and collective. And the collective benefit in ensuring that visitors won't require limited intensive health care facilities may be significant.

 

[Bikeman78]

In fact why stop at covid, let's include all the childhood vaccines, maybe add influenza, then maybe in time add your mental wellbeing, your occupation, your political alignment.

Not all children have all the routine vaccines. When I was a kid, I didn't know who had or had not been vaccinated and I cared even less. Why should it be any different for Covid? Yet we're already at the stage where people who don't want it are branded "selfish" and potentially face being unable to do lots of normal everyday things. It's just bizarre.

By way of comparison, I did take out travel insurance in 2019 which covered me through to 2020. When I did try to claim on it, for a trip I couldn't make due lockdown restrictions and that the hotel refused to refund, the travel insurance company told me that according the UK Government (the competition and markets stuff) they believe they should be refunding so I must take it up with the hotel as they won't pay out where the hotel is liable to refund. I had already done so and provided all communications where they flat out refused. In any case the hotel was outside the UK, so whatever the UK Government thinks they should be doing is largely irrelevant. In addition the hotel had gone bankrupt between me booking and the date I was due to travel. It was still open, as the result of a management buy out. The hotel explained this (and provided details of the old company number that was now bankrupt and so on), explaining that the money I paid had been paid to a now bankrupt company and as a result they could not legally refund it. When I pushed back AXA then changed their tune to the fact the hotel had offered a change of dates (which is true) so the money was "recoverable" and they wouldn't pay out. They ignored the fact the hotel had offered to change the dates of the booking but had also stated that if I arrived on that date I would have to pay again. I.E. they wern't offering to change dates for free, they were effectively offering to make a second booking, for which I'd have to pay again.

I've only bothered with travel insuarance for trips to Europe since I've had it as a perk with my bank account. A few years ago we went to America. About two weeks before, our daughter caught Chicken pox. She was fine because she got better more than seven days before travel. We were concerned that our son might catch it. Rang insurance company, they wouldn't entertain cancelling or redating the trip unless he actually had Chicken pox. So of course we went. Long story short, he came out in spots the day after we got back home! Which means he was probably highly contagious on the 10 hour flight.

 

[Horizon22]

I take your point about the risk of private demand, but think it rather contradicts your challenge to the use of vaccine passports for international travel. Discrimination is not always a bad thing, and if the use of vaccine passports helps protect public health, then that discrimination may well be justified.

Only it won't necessarily protect public health - its also not justified if millions of young people would happily have a vaccine but are barred from doing so and as a result of that are barred from travelling through and have had no control of either of those circumstances whilst older generations are theoretically free to travel wherever they want.

 

[Bantamzen]

The benefit is both personal and collective. And the collective benefit in ensuring that visitors won't require limited intensive health care facilities may be significant.

If only there were some form of insurance for travellers that would fund illness abroad....

 

[RT4038]

If only there were some form of insurance for travellers that would fund illness abroad....

I don't think that funding is the point here, it is the capacity issue of dealing with ill travellers.

 

[Bantamzen]

I don't think that funding is the point here, it is the capacity issue of dealing with ill travellers.

Given that most people likely to become seriously ill have now been vaccinated, its not really going to be a problem.

 

[35B]

Given that most people likely to become seriously ill have now been vaccinated, its not really going to be a problem.

The indications are positive there, but I’d forgive politicians with a limited health service and grave risk of downturn due to customer fear being rather cautious on the point.

 

[Bantamzen]

The indications are positive there, but I’d forgive politicians with a limited health service and grave risk of downturn due to customer fear being rather cautious on the point.

I suspect people whose livelihoods on the line will be less forgiving.

 

[ainsworth74]

Vaccine passports definitely seem like they're on the horizon for the EU. Nothing certain of course but it feels like the mood music is only pointing one way:

Commission to propose digital green pass for travel this month​

The document would have to include a range of information in order to prevent discrimination.

The Commission will put forward a legislative proposal this month on a digital green pass that proves a traveler has been vaccinated against the coronavirus, President Ursula von der Leyen said Monday.

"The aim is to gradually enable them to move safely in the European Union or abroad — for work or tourism," she announced on Twitter.

But in order to prevent discrimination, the pass would also have to include other information such as results of recent COVID-19 tests or proof of immunity.

A package of measures focused on travel is due to be adopted on March 17, ahead of a meeting of EU leaders on March 25, Commission Vice President Margaritis Schinas said. "The aim would be to set a common direction towards Europe's safe opening ... Of course, this is a legislative proposal ... so this is not something which could be optional," he said.

EU leaders agreed in January on what a vaccine certificate should look like — although that was intended for medical purposes only. The incoming legislative proposal will add to that.

The certificate should be in place in three months "if everything goes according to plan," a Commission spokesperson said — something von der Leyen flagged last week.

Several EU leaders, including Austrian Chancellor Sebastian Kurz, lobbied during last week's meeting for a green pass to restart the freedom to travel. However, French President Emmanuel Macron warned Thursday that a vaccine can't be a precondition for travel.

Commission to propose digital green pass for travel this month

The document would have to include a range of information in order to prevent discrimination.

www.politico.eu

Thinking about a big destination for UK tourists, Spain, it appears that come what may they are thinking about a vaccine passport. The question for them appears to be less whether to have a vaccine passport or not but if they go in with the EU scheme or go their own way (probably depending on whether they EU get their act together or not!). Though detail on what a "green corridor" might be (and so if that does include a vaccine passport) is scant!

Spain may allow in Covid-vaccinated UK tourists if no EU pass agreed​

Minister says country will act unilaterally if Europe does not bring in vaccination passports

Spain will consider a “green corridor” for vaccinated British tourists if there is no EU agreement on vaccination passports, the country’s tourism minister has said, as the European commission prepared to table a proposal for leaders this month.

Fernando Valdés said his government would seek to find agreement on a common system among the 27 member states to allow tourism to restart, but Madrid would probably open bilateral talks with non-EU countries if that failed.

“Right now we have discussions with our colleagues in the UK,” Valdés told Bloomberg TV. “For us the British market is our main market. But obviously since we are a member of the European Union, the solutions have first to be part of the discussions in the EU.

“And obviously if that cannot be reached, we will be thinking of other corridors like green corridors with third countries that can help us restart tourism flows.”

British tourists spent around £18bn a year in Spain in 2019, making it the most popular holiday destination for UK travellers, but numbers were down by more than 80% in the summer of 2020.

The UK’s health secretary, Matt Hancock, confirmed that discussions were under way with governments and the EU. “We are absolutely working with our international partners on the need for certification in terms of having had a vaccine to be able to travel to another country,” he said during a Downing Street press conference.

“If another country wants to say that you need to have been vaccinated with a recognised vaccine to travel there we want to enable Brits to be able to take that journey. So we are working with international partners, and the EU is part of those discussions, as are several other countries around the world, and it’s obviously important work.”

Hancock said it was crucial to ensure the scheme allows people to travel who have been unable to have a jab in time. “As I understand it from the details set out, the EU proposal is that certification includes both whether you’ve had the vaccine and also whether you’ve recently had a test so those who can’t get vaccinated yet, which is particularly important,” he said. “It matters that we get the details of this right for international travel.”

...

Spain may allow in Covid-vaccinated UK tourists if no EU pass agreed

Minister says country will act unilaterally if Europe does not bring in vaccination passports

www.theguardian.com

Like I've said previously I really wouldn't be betting against needing some sort of vaccine certification/passport if you want to go to the EU this year.

 

[DB]

What none of these passport proponents ever explain is what the point is - the only time it would make any sort of sense is if they were going for zero Covid (which most, sensibly, are not). If it's circulating in the population at some level anyway, and a good number of vaccinations have been carried out, what is the point? Especially in the summer when spread will be low anyway (and by the winter they will hopefully have vaccinated enough people that it's no longer a problem anyway).

 

[ainsworth74]

What none of these passport proponents ever explain is what the point is - the only time it would make any sort of sense is if they were going for zero Covid (which most, sensibly, are not). If it's circulating in the population at some level anyway, and a good number of vaccinations have been carried out, what is the point? Especially in the summer when spread will be low anyway (and by the winter they will hopefully have vaccinated enough people that it's no longer a problem anyway).

I suspect it's almost entirely politics. A mixture of "Something must be done! This is something, so it must be done!" and politicians who are aware that they've screwed up their responses so are now trying to win over the population by being seen to take steps to protect them. I suspect it's basically just the same thing as the sort of security theatre you'd see outside a sports ground. Yes we're searching bags but not that thoroughly but at least it will help reassure many people that it's safe. Well here it's: Yes we're only allowing people who have had the vaccine into the country and it won't really do much of anything to improve the situation but it helps to reassure many people that they're safer.

 

[Bantamzen]

I suspect it's almost entirely politics. A mixture of "Something must be done! This is something, so it must be done!" and politicians who are aware that they've screwed up their responses so are now trying to win over the population by being seen to take steps to protect them. I suspect it's basically just the same thing as the sort of security theatre you'd see outside a sports ground. Yes we're searching bags but not that thoroughly but at least it will help reassure many people that it's safe. Well here it's: Yes we're only allowing people who have had the vaccine into the country and it won't really do much of anything to improve the situation but it helps to reassure many people that they're safer.

If they are only to let vaccinated people in, there are going to seriously stifle demand. As you say it is all theatre, but frankly its time for politicians worldwide to give their heads a wobble and stop trying to "beat the virus".

 

[takno]

If they are only to let vaccinated people in, there are going to seriously stifle demand. As you say it is all theatre, but frankly its time for politicians worldwide to give their heads a wobble and stop trying to "beat the virus".

In this particular case we're talking about the weakest and wrongest European Commission in decades. They don't seem to be able to hold a line or communicate a difficult message at all. Rather they just cave in the direction of whoever shouted at them last, and then look confused that everybody else is angry with them. All important decisions will be hammered out between the national leaders anyway, so this week's sop to Austria will doubtless be cancelled out by not introducing it for 12 months, at which point everybody will have forgotten about it anyway.

 

[jumble]

What none of these passport proponents ever explain is what the point is - the only time it would make any sort of sense is if they were going for zero Covid (which most, sensibly, are not). If it's circulating in the population at some level anyway, and a good number of vaccinations have been carried out, what is the point? Especially in the summer when spread will be low anyway (and by the winter they will hopefully have vaccinated enough people that it's no longer a problem anyway).

I c

So 54 million will get the vaccine offer as under 18 don’t get it. Those with allergies can’t take it and some others don’t take it maybe 20% maybe 5 million so what next?

*Vaccine passports? Would they allow a nasal spray as an alternative to travel? A negative COVID test? Or is it no jab no fly? Would it be every single country world wide?

*Would vaccine passports be forever like airport security or short term to see how the virus is?

*Lockdown has seen an increase of suicides and depression how would someone have any quality of life if they were banned from weddings pubs football and holidays. Effectively living in lockdown? Now would this be short term or forever?

*If the government don’t vaccinate everybody every year what then? What if it’s at risk groups only then someone unvaccinated is the same as someone who had the vaccine but the protection has expired?

*What exemptions would there be for vaccines to travel? Would it cover any mental health issues?

*Vaccine passports in development are digital what if you don’t have a smart phone? How do they know the passport is genuine if it’s paper?

*How would EU countries deal with 5 million barred Brits and possibly many more in Eu countries as I heard take up is low in France? Would it be the end of EU’s open borders? Are they going to stop cars crossing the border and have border checks?

*What do you do if you have 5 million who can’t take it for health reasons or other what do you do about the rapid increase of suicides with people who have nothing left and even banned from weddings? Two tier society?

or would better treatments possibly oral vaccines be the future or even single dose vaccines maybe better testing would this be the future and options will improve or are we stuck in a two jab every year society forever?


We need an open debate in society about this ..

Vaccine passports are a bit of a nonsense domestically
I can fully understand a foreign country or a cruise company saying we don't want someone who is more likely to get seriously ill coming but how on earth does anyone think this be enforced domestically?

( it is easy to enforce on aeroplanes with their rigorous security
Busy pub. I go with mates and I sit in the corner and they buy the beer
Does someone come over and bother me to ask if I have a Vaccine passport ?
If I have been there for 30 minutes before they do come then what next?
My battery on my phone is flat.
What pub wants me to start arguing that I have been vaccinated and stopping them checking their other customers whilst we debate why I am not allowed in

Our local Spoons did not deploy their track and trace bouncers for very long presumably as there was not much to stop people taking 2 forms filling one out and depositing the blank one in the box and so the whole exercise was rendered pretty pointless
The emperors new clothes springs to mind
Our local Adsa had covid security for a week or 2 handing out masks but they gave up as well.
Our local Tesco Metro is not in the slightest bit concerned if people wear masks or not.
(For clarity I am going to have my jab next week because I personally believe it is irresponsible as part of my job not to do so as my customers expect me to so.)
I am very much opposed to the passports on behalf of those who cannot have the vaccine for health reasons

 

[SouthEastBuses]

Vaccine passports definitely seem like they're on the horizon for the EU. Nothing certain of course but it feels like the mood music is only pointing one way:

Commission to propose digital green pass for travel this month

The document would have to include a range of information in order to prevent discrimination.

www.politico.eu

Thinking about a big destination for UK tourists, Spain, it appears that come what may they are thinking about a vaccine passport. The question for them appears to be less whether to have a vaccine passport or not but if they go in with the EU scheme or go their own way (probably depending on whether they EU get their act together or not!). Though detail on what a "green corridor" might be (and so if that does include a vaccine passport) is scant!

Spain may allow in Covid-vaccinated UK tourists if no EU pass agreed

Minister says country will act unilaterally if Europe does not bring in vaccination passports

www.theguardian.com

Like I've said previously I really wouldn't be betting against needing some sort of vaccine certification/passport if you want to go to the EU this year.

So does this mean that if I don't get vaccinated, will I still be able to travel to Spain this summer, provided I test negative for the virus?

 

[Horizon22]

If they are only to let vaccinated people in, there are going to seriously stifle demand. As you say it is all theatre, but frankly its time for politicians worldwide to give their heads a wobble and stop trying to "beat the virus".

It’s going to be a real mess when all those who’ve already booked summer holidays aren’t able to travel suddenly and will insurance pay out...

Personally it’s made me rather annoyed very few have stood up to this considering how many people would be stuck inside the UK. Hundreds of thousands of young people, a significant minority of who will be EU nationals and may not have seen their family in over 12 months might be further delayed, through no fault of their own. As I’ve said countless times it’s not as though these people are vaccine refusers - I’m sure many would jump on it. Also the EU is even further behind so that’s even fewer of their citizens able to travel.

Whether they can arrange this in the next 3 months is another matter and it might be scaled back to “negative test required” which isn’t great but more feasible considering many local authorities are now doing free testing (at least in London).

 

[35B]

It’s going to be a real mess when all those who’ve already booked summer holidays aren’t able to travel suddenly and will insurance pay out...

Personally it’s made me rather annoyed very few have stood up to this considering how many people would be stuck inside the UK. Hundreds of thousands of young people, a significant minority of who will be EU nationals and may not have seen their family in over 12 months might be further delayed, through no fault of their own. As I’ve said countless times it’s not as though these people are vaccine refusers - I’m sure many would jump on it. Also the EU is even further behind so that’s even fewer of their citizens able to travel.

Whether they can arrange this in the next 3 months is another matter and it might be scaled back to “negative test required” which isn’t great but more feasible considering many local authorities are now doing free testing (at least in London).

It may be a mess, but I've scant sympathy for those who've just booked holidays based on a set of target dates on a roadmap that's been declared as subject to data supporting it, and where rapid changes of policy have left people in tight corners in the last year. Caveat emptor applies in that case.

As for how the EU decides to implement vaccine passports, that is up to the EU - I'm just glad to see that what is being discussed is being discussed on the basis of working together.

 

[ainsworth74]

So does this mean that if I don't get vaccinated, will I still be able to travel to Spain this summer, provided I test negative for the virus?

I think you'd need to ask the Spanish government about that. But I've not found any detail of what they're planning beyond that Guardian article.