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Virgin Euston Barrier Staff Again Ignoring Ticket Rules

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embers25

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My work colleague traveled on an advance single from Surbiton to Birmingham New Street. He got the 0711 to Vauxhall and arrived on time at 0731. Due to Victoria Line delays there was a queue to even get on the tube and he finally arrived at Euston at 0825, missing his booked 0823 train. At the ticket barrier for the 0843, despite protesting he was late due to the tube, they insisted his ticket was no longer valid and forced him to buy a new one (he had a meeting to get to so couldn't wait around to argue). I realise this is a common occurrence at Euston (I've had numerous issues but stand my ground) but how can he now get his £58 back that he should not have had to pay.
 
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yorkie

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He needs to write to Customer Services.

I'd also be asking for an investigation to be carried out, but I expect nothing will happen. Virgin's Customer Services department have known for years that gateline staff reject valid tickets, yet the problem persists.

If Virgin don't agree to issue a refund of the monies due, he should write to the Ombudsman. I also know some retailers will back the customer up; which retailer did he use, do you know?
 

embers25

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Thanks Yorkie. He used our work retailer HRG (who use trainline).
 

najaB

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Due to Victoria Line delays there was a queue to even get on the tube and he finally arrived at Euston at 0825, missing his booked 0823 train. At the ticket barrier for the 0843, despite protesting he was late due to the tube, they insisted his ticket was no longer valid and forced him to buy a new one (he had a meeting to get to so couldn't wait around to argue).
The key question is if TfL would be able to confirm that there were Tube delays or not? If so then it's a straightforward breach of the rules.
 

ac-03

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Not the first time I’ve heard that VTWC staff causing agro. They refuse to accept TFL staff passes that are valid from EUS to WFJ on AC/DC lines.

What makes me laugh though is the non protected virgin staff then trying to get a safeguarded priv discount being loaded onto their Oyster card when there not entitled to the discount.
 

8J

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There was also an issue highlighted on Twitter from a Travel Vlogger Paul Lucas with the revenue officers at Euston. By the sounds of it he stood his ground and was eventually allowed on to the train but some of these Virgin staff are a disgrace to the railway and really put passengers off using the train in future.

What I found funny was seeing a Virgin member of staff who I recognise from the Euston barriers sat in first class on another TOCs service without a valid ticket and they got a lecture and stung by the conductor which personally I found quite satisfying. One rule for them....
 

matt_world2004

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I was doing a nightshift at euston and the amount of virgin staff that were trying to blag a free trip on the bus was ridculous.
 

yorkie

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There was also an issue highlighted on Twitter from a Travel Vlogger Paul Lucas with the revenue officers at Euston. By the sounds of it he stood his ground and was eventually allowed on to the train but some of these Virgin staff are a disgrace to the railway and really put passengers off using the train in future.
He is a member of this forum, as it happens ;)

And yes he is well aware of these issues, having previously provided (excellent) assistance in a professional capacity several years ago :)

What I found funny was seeing a Virgin member of staff who I recognise from the Euston barriers sat in first class on another TOCs service without a valid ticket and they got a lecture and stung by the conductor which personally I found quite satisfying. One rule for them....
Well they have been caught make up rules as they go along!
 
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The staff are only acting in a way they have been trained to act and following procedures which they have been deemed competent at.

As a company the ticket training was so poor and I learnt 95% of what I know from these forums, sadly it’s not a surprise that such a basic error has occurred.

I would have very little confidence that once your refund is issued that the member of staff ever realised that what they did was wrong.

I doubt the management team would even see this as anything but a very minor issue and as such nothing will be done to change it
 

Darandio

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He is a member of this forum, as it happens ;)

And yes he is well aware of these issues, having previously provided (excellent) assistance in a professional capacity several years ago :)

It was quite a funny exchange yesterday on Twitter, issues at Witham saw him set to miss his booked advance later at Euston so he had Tweeted Virgin who said don't worry, staff know about the disruption. Bloke finally gets to Euston, they effectively tell him he's made it all up. :lol:

I wasn't surprised, he wasn't surprised (we'd actually predicted as much in an exchange on Twitter) and i'm sure you aren't surprised either!
 

sheff1

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The staff are only acting in a way they have been trained to act

... and yet Virgin are always shouting about what a customer friendly outfit they are.

Obviously training people to repeatedly deny travel on perfectly valid tickets is not at all customer friendly, yet a surprising number of people are taken in by the Virgin hype.
 

Starmill

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Not the first time I’ve heard that VTWC staff causing agro. They refuse to accept TFL staff passes that are valid from EUS to WFJ on AC/DC lines.
Would VT staff be working at the entrances to platforms for London Overground or West Midlands Trains services to Watford Junction? Really?
 

MikeWh

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Would VT staff be working at the entrances to platforms for London Overground or West Midlands Trains services to Watford Junction? Really?
Not London Overground, but WMT can use any platforms as far as I know.
 

Ianno87

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Not London Overground, but WMT can use any platforms as far as I know.

Overground do use AC only platforms on occasion (e.g. Saturday nights/Sunday mornings, when the throat is partially blocked)
 

Nym

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Not London Overground, but WMT can use any platforms as far as I know.

It's also perfectly valid to hold a season ticket from Milton Keynes to Watford Junction and split ticket it with a Staff Pass from Watford Junction to London Euston, as one of them is a season ticket and the other is not. In spite of what even TfL Staff Travel have said over the years, the CoC are really quite clear on this. A Staff Travel pass is NOT a season ticket.
 

matt_world2004

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It's also perfectly valid to hold a season ticket from Milton Keynes to Watford Junction and split ticket it with a Staff Pass from Watford Junction to London Euston, as one of them is a season ticket and the other is not. In spite of what even TfL Staff Travel have said over the years, the CoC are really quite clear on this. A Staff Travel pass is NOT a season ticket.
There is a specific arrangment between virgin trains to allow this to happen. TfL staff can even buy a special 75% discounted virgin trains only season ticket that can only be brought for between Watford Junction and other VTWC stations. With the assumption that the staff pass covers the watford, Euston leg of the journey.

The VTWC Euston staff will often refuse to recognise the ticket or the pass. Despite the fact its a VTWC only ticket using an agreement between TfL and VTWC!

Ordinary customers with a valid split season ticket, where one component is on oyster have also been denied access to VTWC services

I have heard there has been at least one incident where in the early post silverlink days an LO driver was delayed in driving their train because VTWC didnt recognise that their staff pass was valid on the train that he was supposed to be driving!
 

Haywain

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I have heard there has been at least one incident where in the early post silverlink days an LO driver was delayed in driving their train because VTWC didnt recognise that their staff pass was valid on the train that he was supposed to be driving!
I do not believe a word of that. London Overground services at Euston can only use the platforms equipped with 3rd rail tracks, and these are 'protected' by barriers staffed by (at the time suggested) London Midland.
 

8J

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LO services can and have used platforms other than 9/10. It is rare but they will switch from AC to DC outside the station. Normally only happens late at night when a possession is on for platforms 8 - 11
 

matt_world2004

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I do not believe a word of that. London Overground services at Euston can only use the platforms equipped with 3rd rail tracks, and these are 'protected' by barriers staffed by (at the time suggested) London Midland.
This would have been in the days before the 378s.
 

geoffk

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Maybe not relevant, but today I used my TfGM pass on a diverted Euston - Glasgow Pendolino between Stockport and Wigan North Western. The train conductor examined my pass, which she said she had not seen before as she didn't normally work to Manchester. There was no problem and the departure screens at Stockport showed Piccadilly, then Wigan NW etc. At Piccadilly platform 13, the screen showed first stop Wilmslow for the Euston-bound train!
 

RJ

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I do not believe a word of that. London Overground services at Euston can only use the platforms equipped with 3rd rail tracks, and these are 'protected' by barriers staffed by (at the time suggested) London Midland.

When I worked at Euston the London Overground 313s (which were inherited from Silverlink) did use other platforms on occasion - platform 1 on top of a Pendo set seemed to be a favoured diversion route as was platform 17.

Even more occasionally Virgin did use platform 8 or 11 and the barriers had to be opened until the train left.
 

Deerfold

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Maybe not relevant, but today I used my TfGM pass on a diverted Euston - Glasgow Pendolino between Stockport and Wigan North Western. The train conductor examined my pass, which she said she had not seen before as she didn't normally work to Manchester. There was no problem and the departure screens at Stockport showed Piccadilly, then Wigan NW etc. At Piccadilly platform 13, the screen showed first stop Wilmslow for the Euston-bound train!

On-train Virgin staff seem to be a lot more knowledgeable/customer-friendly than some of the Euston staff.
 

yorkie

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@embers25 Please do update the thread once the customer has received Virgin's response. If it does not contain any assurances about the future conduct of this staff, I would make enquiries to that effect.

On-train Virgin staff seem to be a lot more knowledgeable/customer-friendly than some of the Euston staff.
Absolutely. While we do know a small number of their TMs act inappropriately, the vast majority are pragmatic and act in the passengers best interests.
It was quite a funny exchange yesterday on Twitter, issues at Witham saw him set to miss his booked advance later at Euston so he had Tweeted Virgin who said don't worry, staff know about the disruption. Bloke finally gets to Euston, they effectively tell him he's made it all up. :lol:

I wasn't surprised, he wasn't surprised (we'd actually predicted as much in an exchange on Twitter) and i'm sure you aren't surprised either!
Not at all; I expect such behaviour and I am well aware that Virgin HQ is unable to get them to behave. It's really strange when you compare it to other industries, but the rail industry really is unique in this respect.
 
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Not at all; I expect such behaviour and I am well aware that Virgin HQ is unable to get them to behave. It's really strange when you compare it to other industries, but the rail industry really is unique in this respect.

What is it about the Euston staff that they can’t control? If they replaced all the managers at the station would that help? Or would they need an entirely new set of staff?
 

embers25

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@embers25 Please do update the thread once the customer has received Virgin's response. If it does not contain any assurances about the future conduct of this staff, I would make enquiries to that effect.


Absolutely. While we do know a small number of their TMs act inappropriately, the vast majority are pragmatic and act in the passengers best interests.

Not at all; I expect such behaviour and I am well aware that Virgin HQ is unable to get them to behave. It's really strange when you compare it to other industries, but the rail industry really is unique in this respect.

The complaint is filed and I'll update. Does anyone know how long Virgin usually take as I've never complained to them as I always stand my ground and they end up caving. It is ridiculous that the only way to get through a Euston barrier with many perfectly valid tickets is to pretend you are using the LNWR train in the adjacent platform and so board via that ramp. Unfortunately that only works when the the adjacent platform is LNWR not VWC.
 

pitdiver

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Further to the point about having a ticket from MK to Watford Jct. When I lived in MK and worked for LUL/TfL I would purchase a Priv Season from MK to London but only have to pay to Watford Jct
 

philthetube

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Not the first time I’ve heard that VTWC staff causing agro. They refuse to accept TFL staff passes that are valid from EUS to WFJ on AC/DC lines.

What makes me laugh though is the non protected virgin staff then trying to get a safeguarded priv discount being loaded onto their Oyster card when there not entitled to the discount.

I travel around once a month up the west coast using a tfl staff pass to Watford and have never had a problem with Virgin staff, just the issue of getting through the gates without a "vlid ticket" which is understandable, there is no way the gates could be programmed for this instance.

Maybe I have just been lucky.
 

matt_world2004

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I travel around once a month up the west coast using a tfl staff pass to Watford and have never had a problem with Virgin staff, just the issue of getting through the gates without a "vlid ticket" which is understandable, there is no way the gates could be programmed for this instance.

Maybe I have just been lucky.
Staff passes work the gateline at watford and Euston.
 

philthetube

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They only work the gateline at Euston for platforms 8/11, not for some of the recently installed gates for other platforms.
 
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