VTEC Remove 1st Class Quiet Coach

[mpthomson]

Another of the joys of Virgin / Stagecoach extends to the ECML, then. What a surprise.

Dogmatic as usual. No attempt to consult passengers, unlike First / MTR with South Western Railway (where 90% of over 2000 respondents selected the answer "Quiet Zones should stay!").

That's most likely because only the people that were bothered about losing it responded to the survey in any number.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I think it to some extent has obsoleted itself, anyway. Most people you see using a mobile phone on a train aren't making a call, they're texting, Facebook messaging, Whatsapp-ing, browsing, posting on here or whatever, and that's not noisy.

 

[RAPC]

I usually do a 1st class round trip on VTWC to London each week and I do miss the quiet coach, but more often than not it is no better or worse than the previous quiet coach system.

I've had a couple of journeys where people have decided that they are having a conference call on a table with full speaker blaring out. A quiet word worked first time, second time I was given a patronising 'shuffle along' with a rather rude hand gesture. In that scenario it was sorted by me (and another passenger who decided to back me up) by joining said conference call. You have to have a special lack of social awareness to think that a conference call in public on a speaker is acceptable.

 

[F Great Eastern]

Perhaps just a notice in all coaches asking passengers to consider their fellow passengers when making calls or using personal electronic equipment would be suffice?

That makes absolutely no difference - they have such notices on Greater Anglia and they are routinely ignored but they do seem more respected on GWR.

I like the idea of quiet coaches but the problem is that in my last 6 times on them, I've had children screaming, youths drinking and all sorts of stuff going on and it's been anything but quiet.

Many passengers just treat it as a coach where they are more likely to get a seat

 

[Halish Railway]

My thoughts
First, it could be VTEC getting rid of the old East Coast influence as they were the ones who first introduced it.

Second, it makes it easier when the Azumas are introduced.

I think XC have it right by having massive unmissable banners on the windows saying to keep noise and phone calls to a minimum.

 

[Mag_seven]

That makes absolutely no difference - they have such notices on Greater Anglia and they are routinely ignored but they do seem more respected on GWR.

I like the idea of quiet coaches but the problem is that in my last 6 times on them, I've had children screaming, youths drinking and all sorts of stuff going on and it's been anything but quiet.

Many passengers just treat it as a coach where they are more likely to get a seat

I was actually thinking that if the quiet coach was abolished such a notice could be put in all coaches - it doesn't deem those coaches be "quiet" just a request that people consider other passengers.

 

[F Great Eastern]

Realistically there should be a byelaw that says if you make excessive noise in a quiet coach you can be fined - that's the only way it will work I think.

 

[ainsworth74]

I'm not fussed by first class quiet coaches to be quite honest so I have no objection to this being removed.

In any event it was poorly implemented on VTEC anyway with coach J being the buffet so having lots of noisy kitchen equipment in it and coach K having a staff area where they often liked to gossip (nothing wrong with that of course!). This meant that neither quiet coach was really that quiet.

It always struck me as a bit of a fad anyway! "A few other long distance inter-city TOCs are doing it so we have to as well!"

 

[skyhigh]

Realistically there should be a byelaw that says if you make excessive noise in a quiet coach you can be fined - that's the only way it will work I think.

I'd say it's covered by byelaw 6(8):

No person shall molest or wilfully interfere with the comfort or convenience of any person on the railway.

Is it enforced? Well...

 

[greyman42]

In all honesty, from my experience First has always been quiet, even outside the quiet coach.

Yes I agree. It is because you get a better class of passenger in first who tend to have manners and consideration for others. It is not always the case in standard and that is why they are keeping the quiet coach.

 

[greyman42]

Certainly quieter ambience than Standard but I've noticed it getting increasingly noisy at weekends.

That will be due to Weekend Firsts.

 

[BluePenguin]

I think the quiet coach should be kept. I don't like it and don't agree with it as it is not for me. It is like being in church but nowhere near as quiet as the engines make a lot of noise in the background. Nobody dares to speak and anyone who dares to answer their phone is in trouble. However for some people, peace and quiet is all they want and need - and they are entitled to it. The quiet coach is the perfect place for that much needed nap back from the airport or for those who want to be able to concentrate and work on their laptop.

From a different perspective, I also think that a loud coach should be introduced for people who like a bustling and social atmosphere. Sometimes when it is unusally quiet and I am talking on the phone, I worry that the people around me are listening in or annoyed because they are being forced to listen to my low level noise. This makes having a conversation and deciding whether or not to answer a call a difficult one. I can't count how many times I have received calls on the train that need answering. I don't want to go out to the vestibule to stand but neither should anyone else.

I find myself wanting there to be more background noise so that I can speak freely and not have to whisper without disturbing anyone else. Another time I forgot my headphones and wanted to watch some BBC iPlayer but couldn't watch any as the people around me would have been annoyed.

Other people who would benefit are teenagers and school children who like to blast the latest chart music on full volume and those who need somewhere to have an argument. Parents who have a baby and little children have the same problem. But in the loud coach children can cry, scream, shout and jump all they want. It should be compulsory for hen parties and stag does to sit in this carriage and conductors should be allowed to ask anyone making too much noise to move to this carriage immediately when asked to.

Meanwhile, the rest of the train would be for civilised and sensible passengers who sit inbetween the two extremes.

What do people think about this idea?

 

[tiptoptaff]

Parents who have a baby and little children have the same problem. But in the loud coach children can cry, scream, shout and jump all they want.

My (very) young child is asleep on the train. Why should I have to sit in said loud carriage and disturb them?

 

[BluePenguin]

My (very) young child is asleep on the train. Why should I have to sit in said loud carriage and disturb them?

Good point, of course you shouldn't have to. If your baby is asleep then the quiet coach is probably best for them, another reason they should stay.

 

[Darandio]

Good point, of course you shouldn't have to. If your baby is asleep then the quiet coach is probably best for them, another reason they should stay.

But with your idea, if the baby wakes up and starts crying, they then have to be turfed into the loud coach?

Turfing people into there sounds like it's more like a naughty coach to me. To enforce it properly, does the guard carry a decibel meter?

 

[tiptoptaff]

I never take my baby in to the quiet coach, as I know I cannot guarantee her level of quietness. She is, after all, only 1. But I do not expect to be told I have to sit in a loud coach full of pissheads and raucous teenagers, as that is not an environment I want to be in myself, let alone put my 1 year old there too. It is quite frankly, a stupid idea.

 

[Breadman]

I understand that the atmosphere on trains can SOMETIMES be unpleasant, but has anyone ever been on a Megabus! Now that is noisy

 

[ChathillMan]

I don't mind to be honest. Coaches L and M are pretty quiet anyway. Its hardly like getting the 2213 York to Leeds pacer on a Saturday night...

 

[Halish Railway]

I have to agree with the above messages. In my opinion, a responsible parent should take their children into the vestibule area if they are being disruptive, partly to save a lot of embarrassment and to solve the issue.

The issue of the lively lads on the weekend is a more difficult issue, partly as there is no real measurement of how loud you can be in common knowledge. Also as trains are formed of many carriages they are more difficult to moderate (unlike planes of course), so it's easy to get away with things.

 

[DesireToFire]

The last two times I was in the VTEC quiet coach I had the pleasure of sitting next to the sliding door separating staff seating, I was able to listen to them flirting with each other whilst listening to music with head phones at a reasonable volume. On one occasion a person sat nearby asked them to shut up!

 

[Halish Railway]

The last two times I was in the VTEC quiet coach I had the pleasure of sitting next to the sliding door separating staff seating, I was able to listen to them flirting with each other whilst listening to music with head phones at a reasonable volume. On one occasion a person sat nearby asked them to shut up!

Was this in coach K? I've had them come into Coach B, sit down and just chat really loudly despite them knowing that it was the quiet coach!

 

[cuccir]

Dogmatic as usual. No attempt to consult passengers

As an infrequent first class user I'll leave others to comment on the rights and wrongs, but I'm pretty confident that this will have come from consultation. Virgin's Customer Panel included quite detailed questions on what passengers expected and/or desired from a first class offering - this was in September I think. Looking at the wording of the statement and thinking back to the wording on the questions, I'm sure that it will have come from that consultation.

 

[boxy321]

I understand that the atmosphere on trains can SOMETIMES be unpleasant, but has anyone ever been on a Megabus! Now that is noisy

http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/news/...ily-forced-to-travel-on-megabus-2014100791446

 

[Breadman]

http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/news/...ily-forced-to-travel-on-megabus-2014100791446

That’s pretty funny

 

[DesireToFire]

Was this in coach K? I've had them come into Coach B, sit down and just chat really loudly despite them knowing that it was the quiet coach!

Yes, it was coach K. I don't understand why anyone with any sense would choose to make that the quiet coach, surely the far end/s of the train would be best, less people walking through etc. When fitting the staff sitting area the might as well have changed it to the noisy coach.

 

[jopsuk]

As an infrequent first class user I'll leave others to comment on the rights and wrongs, but I'm pretty confident that this will have come from consultation. Virgin's Customer Panel included quite detailed questions on what passengers expected and/or desired from a first class offering - this was in September I think. Looking at the wording of the statement and thinking back to the wording on the questions, I'm sure that it will have come from that consultation.

As I said further up thread, I wonder if they've used the information from their own booking system as well? If, say, 9% of people booking 1st class tick the box for "Quiet Coach" that's a useful and valid data set to use to influence such a decision.

 

[anti-pacer]

Backward step in my opinion!

 

[Mordac]

The last two times I was in the VTEC quiet coach I had the pleasure of sitting next to the sliding door separating staff seating, I was able to listen to them flirting with each other whilst listening to music with head phones at a reasonable volume. On one occasion a person sat nearby asked them to shut up!

Don't leave us hanging. Did anyone seal the deal?

 

[takno]

As I said further up thread, I wonder if they've used the information from their own booking system as well? If, say, 9% of people booking 1st class tick the box for "Quiet Coach" that's a useful and valid data set to use to influence such a decision.

It's a factor, but I always tick quiet coach in First class because nobody takes any notice of it anyway and you get served quicker. I seem to recall that it unhelpfully remembered the option when I switched back to standard last time and tried to dump me in coach B

 

[AnonymousUser1]

I usually do a 1st class round trip on VTWC to London each week and I do miss the quiet coach, but more often than not it is no better or worse than the previous quiet coach system.

I've had a couple of journeys where people have decided that they are having a conference call on a table with full speaker blaring out. A quiet word worked first time, second time I was given a patronising 'shuffle along' with a rather rude hand gesture. In that scenario it was sorted by me (and another passenger who decided to back me up) by joining said conference call. You have to have a special lack of social awareness to think that a conference call in public on a speaker is acceptable.

Or a desire to be on The Apprentice... actual important business people don't do that. It was the fact that the costs of micing up all the phones in early series would have been prohibitive