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Where will the last semaphore signals be on the national network?

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Western 52

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With so few locations retaining semaphore signals, it's just a matter of time before the last ones will be replaced. But where will the last ones be? Maybe one of the locations which still have plenty, such as Worcester, Shrewsbury or Cornwall? Or maybe a smaller location somewhere? When will the last ones go I wonder?
 
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LowLevel

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There are still very many in use all over the place. Some inroads have been made over the last few decades but they're not an endangered species yet, in fact they're still being installed where it is more cost effective to replace an existing signal with a new semaphore rather than a colour light.

20-30 years might see the end of them but I wouldn't be surprised if not.
 

snowball

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Severn Bridge Junction box, Shrewsbury, has just been renovated, so it may be in with a chance.
 

Peter C

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Moreton-in-Marsh still has several semaphores and I've not heard of any plans to replace them yet, so they might be a contender.

-Peter
 

palmersears

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Would imagine the lines in and out of the Peak Forest quarries might be a good contender. Freight only so they'll bottom of the list.
 

Ken H

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Settle - Carlisle? But the running line signals have gone colour light at Blea moor so perhaps not.
 

DelW

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The "Island Line upgrade" thread has mentioned new fixed distants being installed this spring, so you'd expect them to be around for the indefinite future.
 

LNW-GW Joint

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The "fake" fixed distant signals painted onto boards at some locations might last indefinitely!
No wires or rodding, lamps or electrical connections to maintain.
Rust and weather damage might have an impact long term, maybe.
 

XAM2175

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The "Island Line upgrade" thread has mentioned new fixed distants being installed this spring, so you'd expect them to be around for the indefinite future.
The fixed distants are reflective boards, not actual semaphores.
 

brad465

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Is the Dudding Hill line the last part of London to have Semaphores? I know they were also replaced like-for-like not too long ago so don't think they're going anywhere anytime soon.

Does a fixed distant signal that is just a board showing a horizontal distant semaphore on it and linked with an AWS magnet count as a semaphore signal?
 

Western 52

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Is the Dudding Hill line the last part of London to have Semaphores? I know they were also replaced like-for-like not too long ago so don't think they're going anywhere anytime soon.

Does a fixed distant signal that is just a board showing a horizontal distant semaphore on it and linked with an AWS magnet count as a semaphore signal?
Are there still semaphores at Greenford?
 

InOban

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I believe that the semaphores associated with Anderson's piano on the Pass of Brander (WHL) have a preservation order.
 

SynthD

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Are there still semaphores at Greenford?
I expect Greenford's redevelopment (Chiltern to OOC) to be much later than Dudding Hill's (Overground from MML to Kew), so they'll be one of the latest in a city?
 

181

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I believe that the semaphores associated with Anderson's piano on the Pass of Brander (WHL) have a preservation order.

I guess they could be long term then. Are they the original signals?
There's quite a lot about them here. It says 'The signals were converted to upper quadrant type around 1968', so the signal arms themselves presumably date from then.
 

The Planner

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I expect Greenford's redevelopment (Chiltern to OOC) to be much later than Dudding Hill's (Overground from MML to Kew), so they'll be one of the latest in a city?
I beg to differ, I would expect that to be the other way around.
 

LowLevel

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Is the Dudding Hill line the last part of London to have Semaphores? I know they were also replaced like-for-like not too long ago so don't think they're going anywhere anytime soon.

Does a fixed distant signal that is just a board showing a horizontal distant semaphore on it and linked with an AWS magnet count as a semaphore signal?

Like for like replacement does not equal longevity. Many of Lincoln's semaphores were replaced with new ones not long before they were totally abolished.

There has been a big focus on unsafe lineside structures following things like rotten signal posts and OHLE masts collapsing and being crashed into by trains. Consequently anything at risk is being checked (particularly elderly signals) and if they're in poor condition they'll be replaced, even if it is only for a short period - replacing an unsafe structure can be done far more quickly and cheaply than designing and funding a resignalling and may be more urgent.
 

Western 52

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There's quite a lot about them here. It says 'The signals were converted to upper quadrant type around 1968', so the signal arms themselves presumably date from then.
Many thanks for the link, fascinating stuff! I knew of those signals, but not much detail.
 

Annetts key

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Are they allowed as a distant for a colour light?

It depends on the type of signalling system in use, but yes in certain circumstances a reflective board ‘distant’ can be used as a distant for a colour light signal.

They cannot however be used if there is a signal in rear (on approach to) where it is required to prove the signals ahead are lit…

Does a fixed distant signal that is just a board showing a horizontal distant semaphore on it and linked with an AWS magnet count as a semaphore signal?

That depends on your definition. Semaphore signals were not the first type of signal…
 

Meerkat

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The "Island Line upgrade" thread has mentioned new fixed distants being installed this spring, so you'd expect them to be around for the indefinite future.
The upgrade is leaving the impressive bracket signal and lever frame at St Johns isn’t it, so they will presumable last until they literally fall apart!

Shrewsbury Box is listed isn’t it? So the renovations are probably worthwhile even if the semaphores only lasted a few more years.
 

Ken H

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While this thread is about semaphores, can we widen it a little to include manual frames working powered points and signals, and even manual frames working unpowered points with rodding, while working colour light signals. Both are far more common than semaphore signalling, i would suggest.

Mods. split this off if you want. i was torn whether I should create a new thread or not.
 

Western 52

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While this thread is about semaphores, can we widen it a little to include manual frames working powered points and signals, and even manual frames working unpowered points with rodding, while working colour light signals. Both are far more common than semaphore signalling, i would suggest.

Mods. split this off if you want. i was torn whether I should create a new thread or not.
I'm happy to widen this thread to consider this. All relevant and interesting!
 

bearhugger

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Nunthorpe on the Middlesbrough to Whitby line has just had a semaphore signal replaced with a new semaphore at the other end of the platform from the signal box.
 

Peter C

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I was just thinking, and Banbury might be an example of how the installation of new semaphores doesn't necessarily guarantee that they remain for a long time after: new semaphores were installed in 2010, and then six years later (so not immediately, but still not a very long time after on the grand scale of things), in 2016, the area was re-signalled and all of the semaphores were removed. Although obviously it will depend on the priority of re-signalling an area for as to when it will lose its semaphores and a freight-only line, for example, with new semaphores is likely to retain them for longer than a mainline station (like Banbury) which gets them.

-Peter
 
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