Caution is not imposing incredibly damaging restrictions without a clear evidence base and cost-benefit analysis. As opposed to engaging in whatever hair-brained hypothesis is being screamed for based on fallacious theoretical modelling.
-
Our booking engine at tickets.railforums.co.uk (powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!
Covid restrictions abroad: updates & observations
- Thread starter Butts
- Start date
- Status
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R
RailUK Forums
Nothing in the UK regulations require a person, vaccinated or not, to take a test to travel abroad.
According the government website a negative PCR test is needed to come back even from a Green list country and you have been vaccinated.
Not sure what other countries want to go there.
TravelDream
Member
- Joined
- 7 Aug 2016
- Messages
- 675
This is just total nonsense.
Would you like us imprisoned for 2+ years like New Zealanders and locked down at a moment's notice repeatedly like in Australia? That would be incredibly damaging.
It just wouldn't work here either.
a) Health regulations are devolved and the Scottish/ Welsh/ NI governments could have done something different.
b) You can't easily shut the border between north and south in Ireland. Many people work/ study/ shop across the border each day. At the same time, you can't shirt the border between the north and the rest of the UK. It's a political minefield.
c) Britain isn't an island nation like you think it is. Tens of thousands of lorries cross the Irish Sea and Channel on an average day. Dozes and dozens of cargo flights land here daily from around the world too. Britain relies on this trade to keep on going and feed us. Yes, Britain should produce more food here, but it doesn't and that won't change overnight.
d) Millions and millions of foreigners live here. We can't imprison them if they want to leave. At the same time, millions of Brits live abroad and it is their right as British citizens to return home.
It's certainly a very interesting definition of Green that they have.
LNW-GW Joint
Veteran Member
I doubt the UK restrictions will change until the "Indian" variant is visibly squashed (and another variant will be along soon).
Once the government has established its control-freakery it is very hard to remove.
Which countries get into Green status might improve though - the US would be a big one.
Meanwhile Ireland still has mandatory quarantine I believe, even though it's part of the CTA.
Once the government has established its control-freakery it is very hard to remove.
Which countries get into Green status might improve though - the US would be a big one.
Meanwhile Ireland still has mandatory quarantine I believe, even though it's part of the CTA.
And yet it’s worth remembering that Western countries that have gone down the road of hotel quarantines are very much the minority (I would struggle to name any apart from the UK and Ireland, plus Australia/NZ obviously, who have a very different strategy to us). And quite a few countries have no quarantine at all. For example, the Netherlands is yet to implement their mandatory quarantine, USA is state by state, etc.
The U.K. does seem to have gone down a pretty extreme path in terms of border controls, by a government you’d expect it from, cheered on by people you wouldn’t expect it from.
The U.K. does seem to have gone down a pretty extreme path in terms of border controls, by a government you’d expect it from, cheered on by people you wouldn’t expect it from.
berneyarms
Established Member
The CTA is only an arrangement between the governments - it isn’t enshrined in Irish law, but is governed by a memorandum of understanding, and both governments can implement controls as they see necessary, and public health legislation will trump it.
You have to remember that Ireland is still about six weeks behind the UK in terms of vaccination rollout - until we catch up there are going to inevitably be differences in the public measures in place. The 50-59 year old group is only starting to be vaccinated for the first time now.
Also the mandatory quarantine/self-isolation requirements apply equally to Irish citizens as anyone else.
I would expect some relaxation as the summer progresses though, and the UK would be top of the list.
johncrossley
Established Member
I see the Netherlands now allows in people from several EU countries, most with a worse Covid infection rate than the UK, including Ireland.
They told us Brexit wouldn't affect our ability to go abroad on holiday, only for living and working. They lied.
They told us Brexit wouldn't affect our ability to go abroad on holiday, only for living and working. They lied.
Nicholas Lewis
Established Member
Netherlands has one of the highest case rates / 100k across Europe so there not really taking much risk. The issue will be whether other countries make it easy for there citizens to visit or not ie England has them on the Amber list yet other countries with far less prevalence are on the Red list.
Mind you Portugal were on the Red list a few months back yet made it onto the Green list and data is trending nicely across Western Europe so reckon by late June they will be on the Green list based on criteria used for round one but there is a possibility they will relax that criteria once they have confidence vaccines are doing the job as expected.
I’m interested about the difficulty the government appears to be having in persuading people not to travel to amber countries for holiday. The problem is the only difference between Green and Amber in terms of testing is one extra test, which might well be offset by less onerous destinations testing requirements, so if someone doesn’t mind quarantining (eg they can work remotely), the appeal is obviously going to be there.
Reducing the testing requirements for green countries would do a lot to address this, I suspect. Obviously there’s an argument that travelling through an airport even from a green country deserves a test due to mixing with other amber/red list transfer passengers, but that applies equally for domestic flights and there’s no testing for them.
Reducing the testing requirements for green countries would do a lot to address this, I suspect. Obviously there’s an argument that travelling through an airport even from a green country deserves a test due to mixing with other amber/red list transfer passengers, but that applies equally for domestic flights and there’s no testing for them.
I feel that looking for logic and reason in all of this is pointless; these silly restrictions were introduced for political, not scientific, reasons.
kristiang85
Established Member
- Joined
- 23 Jan 2018
- Messages
- 2,657
Nothing makes sense. Countries that should be green are not. The government is promoting travel to a war zone, as apparently only covid is a danger now. And surely they would prefer people don't all go to the same destination? Its just going to mean hyper crowded airports at times flights come back from green countries, instead of spreading it through the day.
I'm just at a loss that I travelled four times between July and November last year with not too much stress (just some testing, masks and one quarantine) yet this year, despite vaccination, it brings so many hurdles that even Allen Johnson would find it a challenge.
I'm just at a loss that I travelled four times between July and November last year with not too much stress (just some testing, masks and one quarantine) yet this year, despite vaccination, it brings so many hurdles that even Allen Johnson would find it a challenge.
nlogax
Established Member
The only thing that persuades me not to travel to an amber country is the infinitely small chance that my travel insurance policy would cover me for any losses.
Nicholas Lewis
Established Member
Given the EU are looking like they will be opening up to all countries with a case rate of <75/100k means the UK should be on the list at 28/100k so that will drive demand to "Amber" countries even more. Govt really need to be clear about this.
https://www.politico.eu/article/amb...orders-to-vaccinated-third-country-travelers/
On tonight's presser Hancock was very clear that an Amber list country isn't for holidays and most people will have a holiday in the UK
https://www.politico.eu/article/amb...orders-to-vaccinated-third-country-travelers/
On tonight's presser Hancock was very clear that an Amber list country isn't for holidays and most people will have a holiday in the UK
Curious to know which these are?
Obviously, the destination being where you have travelled to and you need a test before you come home.
kristiang85
Established Member
- Joined
- 23 Jan 2018
- Messages
- 2,657
Norway, Finland, pretty much all the Pacific and Caribbean island nations, China to name a few off the top of my head.
Granted, not all will let us in, but that goes for some of the ones on the green list currently anyway.
Indeed of course that is what it means, but, it is not the best use of English language.
Do you really believe the China figures? Seems most of the western governments do not.
Last time they reported a death was May 1 and a total cases figure of 102785 as of yesterday, I think not.
Thanks
Romania and Slovakia have similar rates to Finland and Portugal. Norway significantly higher (I have friends and family there but....).
I suspect "Eastern Europe" figures are regarded with some suspicion, rihtly or wrongly.
I hope nobody here is watching Question Time
The overwhelming opinion from the entire audience is that the borders should be fully closed. Labour say they should be more closed than they are but not fully closed, and the Tory minister is getting it both barrels for allowing any overseas travel
The overwhelming opinion from the entire audience is that the borders should be fully closed. Labour say they should be more closed than they are but not fully closed, and the Tory minister is getting it both barrels for allowing any overseas travel
Increasing numbers of countries are and will open their borders and ourselves remaining closed will look increasingly illogical and insular as time goes by. It will be especially notable if the EU has a travel corridor (of some sort - even if for vaccinated only) with the US before we do.
One dose of closet racism plus one dose of “well I can’t afford to/don’t want to go abroad on holiday so nobody should be allowed”.
Travel is an easy thing to point the finger at.
Very easy for people to say whose entire life is centered in the UK and don't live their regular lives in an international setting. In my own case as a British (and Swedish) citizen living in Sweden but with close friends and family in the UK, none of whom I have seen since March 2020. I also have friends in other European countries. Other people have long-distance relationships with partners living in other countries, their day-to-day life may be split between countries, or especially young people want to work in different countries periodically. It's not just about "going on holiday".
In my own case at least I am living in one of the few sane countries left and can come and go as I choose (subject to other countries letting me in) but I won't be coming to the UK any time soon while its wide-scale social madness continues.
Butts
Veteran Member
Bunch of complete tools - if they don't want to travel just let them stay at home and the rest of us can enjoy quieter Flights and Resorts.
Spain opening with no requirements from Monday - Italy and France to follow - UK needs to respond to the Spanish Measure with a reciprocal arrangement.
Bantamzen
Established Member
Yes they do, although I expect a lot of huffing and puffing from ministers and of course SAGE.
kristiang85
Established Member
- Joined
- 23 Jan 2018
- Messages
- 2,657
The "Valencia Variant" has a ring to it...
With the infection rate still 5x higher in France than in the UK I wouldn't hold your breath.
- Status