Worst UK train?

[Bletchleyite]

The best 156s were I thought the NorthWest Express ones with the Chapman seating. The Northern Spirit ones had Richmond seats, which lasted only a few years before the bases collapsed.

 

[DB]

Whilst the obvious (and IMO fully-deserved) answer is the Class 142 with bus seats,)

The Merseyrail seat ones are even worse than the bus seat ones!

 

[Bletchleyite]

The Merseyrail seat ones are even worse than the bus seat ones!

Indeed. Designed by a short, skinny person who likes sitting bolt upright. Awful things.

 

[danielnez1]

Indeed. Designed by a short, skinny person who likes sitting bolt upright. Awful things.

Speaking about 142s ,the Valley Lines 142 refurbishment looked pretty extensive (N.B. I've only seen photos of those). The Merseyrail 142s are probably one of the quintessential examples of somehow making a bad product even worse.

 

[450.emu]

LUL 2009 stock on the Victoria Line. Absolutely filthy seats, and even dirtier arm rests make a mockery of adverts telling us how the trains are sanitized every day to prevent spread of COVID-19.

LNWR's ropey 319s between Euston and Watford Junction are a close contender, deafening traction motor thrash, tatty interiors, as they are showing their age...

 

[delt1c]

Speaking about 142s ,the Valley Lines 142 refurbishment looked pretty extensive (N.B. I've only seen photos of those). The Merseyrail 142s are probably one of the quintessential examples of somehow making a bad product even worse.

Travelled on the Valley Lines 142's just after they were refurbed and can tell you they transforned them, OK ride was still abit bouncy ( especially come down the valley) but all in good job done. It was a shame that other TOC's couldnt do the same with their.

 

[Bletchleyite]

LNWR's ropey 319s between Euston and Watford Junction are a close contender, deafening traction motor thrash, tatty interiors, as they are showing their age...

We've got the /2s with the low density Chapman seating, I'm happy when they turn up. There are some with irreparably (economically) failed heating, though, which really are past it.

 

[Railengineer]

Class 442's.....old wrecks that worst group have tried to get into service on the cheap, but it backfired.

 

[387star]

The best 156s were I thought the NorthWest Express ones with the Chapman seating. The Northern Spirit ones had Richmond seats, which lasted only a few years before the bases collapsed.

yeah on FGW 158s the seat bases would collapse with a simple tap and often the springs were damaged which made the seats painfully uncomfortable to sit on

 

[cambsy]

Worst trains to me are, old BR era units except the 158-159 which due to end doors and no hopper windows are reasonably quiet to travel on, so pleasant enough travel experience, as much as I love old loud Diesel locos like the 37’s, rattly, loud and tired units, which Come across on most day trips, are not to me pleasant to travel on, ie the Pacer, 153-155-156, 313-318-319-321 are units I would not aim to travel on.

 

[Railengineer]

Worst trains to me are, old BR era units

Ah.....then 442's clearly qualify!!

 

[mspljd1990]

150s, hands down. Every time I get a train expecting a 158 my heart always sinks when I see those horrible, dirty, uncomfortable sheds on wheels pull up to the platform.

At least Pacers have a bit of character about them and are, in a strange way, iconic. 144s were decent enough for use on local services in the Leeds/West Yorkshire area and I feel they were a staple of that region, a bit like 323s are in Manchester. And I've never minded 153s/155s/156s, they feel very outdated but at least they have a bit of soul about them. But 150s just have no redeeming qualities.

 

[86247]

I've said on here before about 150s but they are horrible and noisy with outdated 3 plus 2 seats and should be replaced ASAP with more 195. I've always liked the 156 and 158 big windows you can see out of and decent enough seats.

 

[py_megapixel]

The interior in the Wales & West 150s is more than perfectly adequate for the duties that both they and the Northern ones undergo (they are reasonably similar).

Clearly you have very short legs then.
I cannot fit my legs comfortably behind the seats of any 150 configuration for more than a few minutes, and I therefore have to sit in the bays.
They really need ironing boards in my opinion. Would reclaim a bit of space and allow me to actually sit in any of the seats!

 

[Bletchleyite]

I've said on here before about 150s but they are horrible and noisy with outdated 3 plus 2 seats and should be replaced ASAP with more 195. I've always liked the 156 and 158 big windows you can see out of and decent enough seats.

150s have exactly the same windows as 156s. It's just the poor alignment of the seats to them that causes the main issue. While they aren't by the same builder, they are to all intents and purposes just two versions of the same thing - one longer and end-doored and one shorter with doors at thirds.

I cannot fit my legs comfortably behind the seats of any 150 configuration for more than a few minutes, and I therefore have to sit in the bays.
They really need ironing boards in my opinion. Would reclaim a bit of space and allow me to actually sit in any of the seats!

Ironing boards turn the original as-built layout in a 158 from tight to generous. They do have their uses.

 

[py_megapixel]

a bit like 323s are in Manchester

The 323s have important differences though. They are quiet, accelerate quickly, have fairly spacious seating by the standards of a BR commuter train, plug doors (so they don't slam when passed by an express), and are a comfortable ride, if a little bumpy. The 142s and 150s are none of these things.

I have never seen anyone say that they particularly dislike the 323s, or that their heart sinks when one turns up, and as such they are one of my favourite train fleets in the whole of Britain.

 

[birchesgreen]

The 323 is the best train in Britain indeed, but that's another thread i am sure

Worst train for me would be... the old LM 150s, they stank of damp during the winter and staggered up the Lickey incline at what seemed to be about 1mp/h.

 

[DustyBin]

150s have exactly the same windows as 156s. It's just the poor alignment of the seats to them that causes the main issue. While they aren't by the same builder, they are to all intents and purposes just two versions of the same thing - one longer and end-doored and one shorter with doors at thirds.



Ironing boards turn the original as-built layout in a 158 from tight to generous. They do have their uses.

If you’ll excuse my pedantry, do 150’s and 156’s actually have exactly the same windows? The windows on 156’s look slightly longer and shallower but it may an optical illusion.... Genuine question by the way as I honestly don’t know!

 

[danielnez1]

Travelled on the Valley Lines 142's just after they were refurbed and can tell you they transforned them, OK ride was still abit bouncy ( especially come down the valley) but all in good job done. It was a shame that other TOC's couldnt do the same with their.

I always though they looked good from the variuos pictures. The Northern Spirit 142 refurb was ok IMHO, apart from making the lights even more dimmer and not touching the interior panels either.

 

[Recessio]

Never particularly minded some of the older BR stock, 319/321/313 are alright,I wouldn't go out of my way to avoid them. Not had much experience with DMU stock though.

Cannot stand the LU 1973 stock on the Picadilly line. Never understood why they made the interiors so horrible when they could have been lovely and retro like the Bakerloo.

 

[Bletchleyite]

If you’ll excuse my pedantry, do 150’s and 156’s actually have exactly the same windows? The windows on 156’s look slightly longer and shallower but it may an optical illusion.... Genuine question by the way as I honestly don’t know!

I'm pretty sure they are the same (Beclawat I believe) but I've never taken a tape measure to them! Though the inside frame looks a bit different in some 150s (/2s I think).

 

[xotGD]

Makes me feel old when people refer to old BR stock meaning the 'modern' stuff that replaced slam door stock!

But it is mostly worse than what it replaced.

 

[Mikey C]

Never particularly minded some of the older BR stock, 319/321/313 are alright,I wouldn't go out of my way to avoid them. Not had much experience with DMU stock though.

Cannot stand the LU 1973 stock on the Picadilly line. Never understood why they made the interiors so horrible when they could have been lovely and retro like the Bakerloo.

The 72 stock on the Bakerloo wasn't deliberately "retro", it was an earlier and less comprehensive refurbishment than later ones!

 

[yorksrob]

Yes, I like the Bakerloo stock as well.

 

[js1000]

The 323 is the best train in Britain indeed, but that's another thread i am sure

Worst train for me would be... the old LM 150s, they stank of damp during the winter and staggered up the Lickey incline at what seemed to be about 1mp/h.

It's unfair to label Pacers the worse are they are very much sui generis to suit the time (i.e. cheap units for local services) that just happened to overstay their welcome.

I think what gives the 150s and 319s my vote is how bad they are in comparison to other superior trains of the time. In comparative terms they are awful.

There was only 5 years between the 319s and 323s entering service. One is cramped, has slow acceleration, emanates weird noises and seat heights are designed for the Borrowers against one that is none of those things in the 323s. Likewise 6 years between the 150s and 158s entering service.

You'd think that there was 10-15 years between these units entering service.

 

[py_megapixel]

emanates weird noises

I think you'll find the 323s do that too, and I love them for it

 

[Class465pacer]

Class 442's.....old wrecks that worst group have tried to get into service on the cheap, but it backfired.

It was the DfTs idea I think

 

[mspljd1990]

The 323s have important differences though. They are quiet, accelerate quickly, have fairly spacious seating by the standards of a BR commuter train, plug doors (so they don't slam when passed by an express), and are a comfortable ride, if a little bumpy. The 142s and 150s are none of these things.

I have never seen anyone say that they particularly dislike the 323s, or that their heart sinks when one turns up, and as such they are one of my favourite train fleets in the whole of Britain.

I get what you mean and I agree. As far as local suburban/commuter trains go 323s are up there with the best.

But what I meant was that like how 323s are a staple and symbol of local routes in and around Manchester, the 144s were the same for Leeds and West Yorkshire. They weren't the greatest of course, but were decent for routes like the Castleford/Knottingley/Pontefract run.

 

[Jamesrob637]

The 323s have important differences though. They are quiet, accelerate quickly, have fairly spacious seating by the standards of a BR commuter train, plug doors (so they don't slam when passed by an express), and are a comfortable ride, if a little bumpy. The 142s and 150s are none of these things.

I have never seen anyone say that they particularly dislike the 323s, or that their heart sinks when one turns up, and as such they are one of my favourite train fleets in the whole of Britain.

My heart would sink if a 323 turned up when expecting a 331, especially a pair of.

But 319s are horrible things now and need getting in the bin. 769s should not enter service - we need more 195s here or Stadler bi-modes.

 

[Deepgreen]

The "Worst UK train?" My vote goes to that old one that used to run somewhere...