London North Eastern Railway (LNER) First Class service

[Bungle73]

But this has only just appeared on their website.

 

[ainsworth74]

How would one know which crew one was getting?

You can guess (roughly) that the first few services from a main EC stations (so Edinburgh/Inverness/Aberdeen/Leeds/Newcastle/London) and the last few services to those stations will be most likely crews from that geographic area. During the middle of the day however it's pretty much pot luck and really the whole thing pretty much just guesswork.

 

[Blindtraveler]

you do get to know them. The London ones Iv had have true to form been bad both lately and in NX days. Yorkshire and Newcastle guys great, Edinburgh hit or miss Iv found. The Aberdeen gang are mainly good.

As for the advertising poster at EDB I'm surprised its not been wripped out to match the rest of the building site. I had noted the website and am wondering if its iether a menue change (beetroot thingy anyone)? Or perhaps the high number of mumbles and grumbles about the service, combined with a bit of extra in the PR Budget has led them to go for a bit of a relaunch which they are trying (not all that hard) to keep quiet.

 

[calc7]

Until you asked if you could also have some cheese with it.

Not sure what everybody else thinks, but I received the above cheese platter on a southbound ex-GLC Virgin service that I boarded at Lancaster on Friday.
Three biscuits, a piece of fruit bread, two big wedges of cheese (mature cheddar and some very interesting looking and tasting green stilton) as well as butter, plenty of grapes and served along with coffee and wine.

This was after a decent portion of chilli con carne (made with beef steak rather than mince, very avant-garde I thought) and frequent runs of the drinks trolley, with fantastic smiling service from motivated staff.

Such a shame that East Coast cannot hit this level of consistency and generosity.

 

[jon0844]

If management take it seriously enough (having employed mystery shoppers) and make it more consistent, I'd say that this 'new' offering might work after all.

A kick up the backside of the bad London crews (why doesn't that surprise me as a Londoner myself?!) also seems to be another job to do!

 

[Crossover]

That stilton looks erm...interesting, calc7 :P (we got cheddar and something similar the other week)

To echo what Yorkie has said, the crew on the 1903 on Thursday were very good - very prompt and friendly and being as helpful as they could be
Could tell by the accents of the majority of them that they were Leeds/York based

 

[bnm]

That stilton looks erm...interesting, calc7

Looks more like Sage Derby to me.

 

[Aictos]

In defence of East Coast though, the number of 1st Class passengers I've assisted at work have always said they're really enjoyed the service with hardly any complaints made.

I've used it a number of times myself, the only downer is some staff like Yorkie has said could be more friendly but that applies across the UK across all TOCs.

 

[Butts]

Not sure what everybody else thinks, but I received the above cheese platter on a southbound ex-GLC Virgin service that I boarded at Lancaster on Friday.
Three biscuits, a piece of fruit bread, two big wedges of cheese (mature cheddar and some very interesting looking and tasting green stilton) as well as butter, plenty of grapes and served along with coffee and wine.

This was after a decent portion of chilli con carne (made with beef steak rather than mince, very avant-garde I thought) and frequent runs of the drinks trolley, with fantastic smiling service from motivated staff.

Such a shame that East Coast cannot hit this level of consistency and generosity.

How does this shape up against the East Coast offering the other night - Dave Newcastle

 

[DaveNewcastle]

How does this shape up against the East Coast offering the other night - Dave Newcastle

It looks good!
East Coast have progressively reduced their offering over the past year and in recent months have (as it appears to me) attempted to regain some of the lost ground.
That image from VT presents a more appealling cheese platter than on any of my EC journeys this year and certainly than on my only evening EC journey last week.

(A year ago, the EC Cheese platter would have consisted of 3 cheeses, countless assorted biscuits, several sticks of celery, some wedges of apple and butter & spread and a significant degree of customer care and atention from staff). Now, by contrast, the EC offering is more likely to be 2 or 3 biscuits, some celery (or not), some butter/spread (or not), and 2 maybe 3 cheeses. The quality and variety of cheeses has remained high. But sometimes absolutely none of the above have been loaded on-board. Nothing.

My assessment over the last few weeks is that the loading of the components onto the trolley has been compromised in terms of range and quantity, but (and this is the factor which affects passengers the most), it is the staff who, in atempting to assess the demand over all 3 coaches, will be more or less generous. I've seen a very well laden trolley with piles of cheese, celery etc pass through the FC coaches and return almost bare.

And (as I've probably already posted) seen absolutely no main, dessert or cheese dish available. Its the lack of consistency that really annoys me the most. If I cant expect to eat then I'll eat elsewhere. Either EC do it or they don't!

 

[Blindtraveler]

such is the popularity of cheese and biscuits! wonder if we wil soon be seeing a menue change to some salads again? I rather hope not as the current hot meals although stil small are generally not bad. X

 

[calc7]

I would quite happily take a decent cheese platter every time. As would a good chunk of the customers I should think.

Virgin do this quite well inasmuch as the other dessert options tend to be prepacked puddings (some are very nice in my opinion, others just serve to sweeten the palate after the main). But the trolley comes stacked full of cheese and biscuits (if you are in coach K) so they must get some decent economies of scale in its service - how hard can it be to cut up a few blocks of cheese and plate up a few biscuits and grapes?

The fact that EC can't even seem to manage that worries me. Cheese isn't even perishable in the medium term, so I am interested to hear reasons why overstocking the train with cheese, biscuits and other accompaniments would be a ludicrous idea given any surplus can be used either the next day or even offered as an off-the-menu option on the next journey. It is not uncommon for Virgin crews to offer it on the post 7pm services on sets that have previously been used for evening meal services.

 

[DaveNewcastle]

I'll confess that I'm quite an enthusiastic consumer of cheeses!

I'll also agree that the current hot meals on EC are 'not bad'.

But none of us can rely on them. That's their problem.
I now cook my breakfast at home before travelling (not because of what is offered but because of if it will be offered).
I now buy snacks (which I tend to avoid at other times and elsewhere) on Greys Inn Road (not because of what is offered on board but because of if it will be offered).

East Coast are surely delighted to have me as a passenger because of my love of cooking. If I didn't enjoy cooking, even at 23:00 at night, then I'd probably spend more of that time composing eloquent, lengthy and regular letters to the Company.

. . . I am interested to hear reasons why overstocking the train with cheese, biscuits and other accompaniments would be a ludicrous idea given any surplus can be used either the next day or even offered as an off-the-menu option on the next journey.

Good questions, and I don't know the answer.
I have a suspicion, though, that there is a procedure in place with RG that all unsold perishable stock is discarded.
(I have some reports from staff to support this view, but I haven't a second source to confirm at present.)

 

[Blindtraveler]

happy Birthday to this truly diverse and detailed thread! I'd never have thought, nor Im sure did Mat E 2010
who started it that we would still be posting daily in it a whole 12 months on.
Lets celibrate with 2 sandwitches, 1 whisky and 2 cups of cold coffee on a delayed KGX to INV HST service with not enough stock loaded and what has been quickly going off due to the faulty fridges.

heres to another year and hopefully bigger and better things onboard EC.

Incidentally iv gone the whole thing from page 1 today, what a ride!!
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
that should say through the whole thing

 

[wintonian]

and has the offering or consistency improved in the last year?

Having only done 2 trips (hardly ever have a reason to go EC) I couldn't judge, though it is obvious that you never know quite how much you are going to get.

 

[Blindtraveler]

goles for the next 12 months I feel should include consistancy, and perhaps maybe possibly if wee keep at it trial a full dinner service southbound and maybe a few more northbound esp on longer runs.

 

[ainsworth74]

and perhaps maybe possibly if wee keep at it trial a full dinner service southbound

I doubt that's going to happen. When I asked EC about the possibility of introducing a few southbound evening meal trains they made it clear that due to the numbers (well more the lack of) that were taking up the restaurant and at-seat dining they felt that there was not sufficient demand for that offer southbound, but they did agree that the all-day offer as it stood wasn't enough hence why it go beefed up slightly a few months ago. But unless something radical happens we can expect there to be no introduction of evening meal services.

 

[lm321412]

I'm not interested in all the moaning and whining amongst this thread, it seems very much so a witch hunt by enthusiasts because the restaurant car has been withdrawn.

I was very impressed with both the Breakfast and the All Day Offer. The staff were all excellent and the product matched Virgin Trains equal offer. The breakfast was of good quality and they came through with drinks FIVE times between Doncaster and Edinburgh which was more than enough, and also offered Toast twice also between that journey.

I'm not sure what you expect? The breakfast was of good quality, fresh, hot and enough for a breakfast. It seems many of you want it lumped on the table, heaped upon so you don't have to eat anything else in the rest of the day. I think many of the moans are because they expect sometimes to get more than there monies worth; which shows because often it is the people who pay the cheapest tickets is often who want the most!

The All Day Offer (which some of you did initially make me wonder), I found was excellent, again on a Edinburgh - Doncaster journey. The staff were excellent and very attentive, asking me how many sandwiches I want and serving Alcoholic Drinks 3 times between that journey (I suppose thats not enough and you have to be obliterated out of your mind to get the money back?). They also offered me more Sandwiches enroute, plenty of Cake and Biscuits to be also had. I was very impressed with the All Day Offer as well.

I know this isn't going to go down too well with some people on here, but this is how I see it and my personal experience with East Coast.

 

[Blindtraveler]

youve traveled on a good time I think, coming as it does on the back of an EC Forum. I wil agree though it has been a good deal better lately and although its not what it was for what it öw is it has on my last 2 trips, the most recent being today delivered what it should.

1 gentleman on my table clearly didnt agree and came onboard with a chinese takeaway, complete with soup!

 

[DaveNewcastle]

I was very impressed with both the Breakfast and the All Day Offer.

. . . .

I know this isn't going to go down too well with some people on here, but this is how I see it and my personal experience with East Coast.

Thanks for your report. Good to hear it went well and was to your liking.
It seems odd that you should expect that others on here will not be pleased to hear that it was to your approval - I hope we will all share in your appreciatation of the good service.

While I can't speak for others, I think the "moaning and whining" you have detected is applied directly at those experiences when the service has NOT met expectations (or not existed at all, which have been recurrent experiences). That would be a very different type of report.

 

[MidnightFlyer]

I'm not sure what you expect?

Consistency would be most welcome.

 

[Greenback]

I'm not interested in all the moaning and whining amongst this thread, it seems very much so a witch hunt by enthusiasts because the restaurant car has been withdrawn.

That's your opinion, and one you are perfectly entitled to hold. However, in my opinion, it does overlook some of the points that regular travellers have made about the service.

I was very impressed with both the Breakfast and the All Day Offer. The staff were all excellent and the product matched Virgin Trains equal offer. The breakfast was of good quality and they came through with drinks FIVE times between Doncaster and Edinburgh which was more than enough, and also offered Toast twice also between that journey.

That's very good, but some of the regular and recurring complaints that have been, and are still being made, are about the consistency of the deliveyr. You may well get this sort of service one day, but by all accounts it is not guaranteed. In fact, from reports it seems that even two runs of drinks may be a rarity!

I'm not sure what you expect? The breakfast was of good quality, fresh, hot and enough for a breakfast. It seems many of you want it lumped on the table, heaped upon so you don't have to eat anything else in the rest of the day. I think many of the moans are because they expect sometimes to get more than there monies worth; which shows because often it is the people who pay the cheapest tickets is often who want the most!

There may be an element of truth in that!

The All Day Offer (which some of you did initially make me wonder), I found was excellent, again on a Edinburgh - Doncaster journey. The staff were excellent and very attentive, asking me how many sandwiches I want and serving Alcoholic Drinks 3 times between that journey (I suppose thats not enough and you have to be obliterated out of your mind to get the money back?). They also offered me more Sandwiches enroute, plenty of Cake and Biscuits to be also had. I was very impressed with the All Day Offer as well.

I know this isn't going to go down too well with some people on here, but this is how I see it and my personal experience with East Coast.

That's excellent, and I'm pleased you enjoyed the experience. If only this sort of service was a regular occurrence I'm sure there would be less complaints!

All anyone can go on is their own personal experience. But what regular passengers seem to be saying is that they cannot rely on getting a hot meal at all after a long day. And also that the delivery of snacks and drinks can be patchy. I don't think we should dismiss all other views on the evidence of one or two good journeys.

 

[Failed Unit]

I know this isn't going to go down too well with some people on here, but this is how I see it and my personal experience with East Coast.

As many have said consistancy, I am not sure if you would have being as happy if you had bieng at work all day, got on the 1630 Edinburgh - London and got the all day offer when last year the equivalent trains (1600 and 1700) would have both had restaurants which apperently were never used but had normally sold out of all food by Darlington.

On my last northbound journey, I got 4 sandwiches - 2 of each kind and a choice of a hot-cross bun or cake. So got what I was supposed to get. However if you had joined the same train at York you probably would not be as happy, considering by York all the hot-cross buns and cakes had gone so all that was left were the sandwiches. Even now if I am on the trains I know serve dinner there is alway doubt in my mind about if they will have loaded enough food as it is a long way until Edinburgh, again running out is not as frequent, but it is still not as substantial as the restuarant.

I am confused as others have touched on, you have had one return journey and you enjoyed it, which I am happy about. Why do you feel on that experience that the rest of us should enjoy it, do you think the problems we experience are a figment of our imagination? I still don't see an increase in 1st Class loadings on the trains I use. The 1700 and 1800 ex Kings Cross are full as they were previously. Which is a surprise considering the no-one would heading north of York would use the 1630 now, they would wait for the 1700, but when it is fully reserved you can't ask for better than that. (but it was pre-timetable change as well!)

 

[calc7]

I'm not interested in all the moaning and whining amongst this thread, it seems very much so a witch hunt by enthusiasts because the restaurant car has been withdrawn.
....
I know this isn't going to go down too well with some people on here, but this is how I see it and my personal experience with East Coast.

I am also happy to hear you had a good experience. If all my experiences (and those of the other regulars in this thread) were good, I wouldn't be moaning. Expectations may be a little high (especially from those of us fortunate enough to regularly travel in First Class on Virgin Trains), but this does not invalidate points made in this thread.

Greenback has hit my main gripe on the head. The service is patchy. If East Coast want to run their "First Class" service as a frillier version of Standard, then fine. I salute their strategic decision! But when they promise everything ("25 reasons to go First Class") and deliver little or, occasionally nothing - when you have to get on the train not knowing whether you will be fed or watered after walking past some nice fayre in M&S on the concourse; it's ****ing irritating.

I do like to get value for money for my ticket. The difficulty in ascertaining this value is most of the problem. If I'm not going to get food and a drink then I'd rather pay to go in Standard and have the certainty in buying stuff beforehand (and have been doing this on EC recently). As mentioned previously, if the poor service happened on an airline, compensation would be offered. But instead we are just left feeling cheated out of the money we have paid due to the clause "subject to availability".

Anyway, in the absence of flat-fare promotions I have been sticking up two fingers to EC FC. And I've been buying dirt cheap &connections tickets to deprive them of every penny I can. Meanwhile, Virgin continue to do well out of my custom.

 

[sidmouth]

I'm not interested in all the moaning and whining amongst this thread, it seems very much so a witch hunt by enthusiasts because the restaurant car has been withdrawn.

You've been lucky then! If your experience could be replicated consistently then I am sure this thread would have died out 11 months ago. The issues have been
- Consistency: A 100% dependable service. Zero point otherwise
- 70min rule (southbound PBO - KGX). A stale croissant does not constitute breakfast, nor a biscuit as lunch.
- Evening dinner on southbound service
- Adequate portions: Now seems addressed but has taken 12 months. I would consider two quarters of a sandwich over a 4 hour journey as being totally inadequate.

I have travelled EC on several occasions, upgrading to 1st based on the complimentary offering being advertised but have learnt the hard way not to use this as a reason for upgrading. I would otherwise.

 

[lm321412]

Thank You for the summary of your experiences with East Coast.

I will be using them again in a few months time, I will dig up this thread to see if they match what I had previously when travelling between Doncaster and Edinburgh last week.

I do agree that the 70 minute rule could somewhat be dropped (I have had full service on VT between Euston & Nuneaton before - 62 mins). I also agree that there should be a southbound evening meal service, although I do respect this may not be practical for East Coast.

I didn't try them last year when it first started, but hopefully it will settle down to the levels I experienced.

 

[38Cto15E]

Virgin trains First class food thread, 2 pages, East Coast 184, I think that may well give EC management a clue that all is not well with their First class food service.

 

[calc7]

Virgin trains First class food thread, 2 pages, East Coast 184, I think that may well give EC management a clue that all is not well with their First class food service.

2 pages of enquiries, not complaints, too!

 

[ainsworth74]

Virgin trains First class food thread, 2 pages, East Coast 184, I think that may well give EC management a clue that all is not well with their First class food service.

Or that the VT thread started one week ago and the EC thread started one year ago

 

[JB1601]

Another thing is that VT has had a lot longer to become "the norm" even though from what I understand they dropped similar facilities that EC did soon after privatisation.

Wasn't there a change to the VT 1st service at the end of 2008 when the hot meals were scaled right back to a few hours a day and it became sarnies or bust for other hours? Or am I imagining it...