Elon Musk - the world's "greatest" spiv?

[brad465]

Confirmation staff are locked out of offices until next week:

Twitter locks staff out of offices until next week

It comes amid reports that large numbers of workers have resigned from the social media platform.

www.bbc.co.uk

Twitter has told employees that the company's office buildings will be temporarily closed, effective immediately.
In a message seen by the BBC, workers were told that the offices would reopen on Monday 21 November.
It did not give a reason for the move.
The announcement comes amid reports that large numbers of staff were quitting after new owner Elon Musk called on them to sign up for "long hours at high intensity" or leave.
The message went on to say: "Please continue to comply with company policy by refraining from discussing confidential company information on social media, with the press or elsewhere."

Twitter did not immediately respond to a request for comment from the BBC.
This week Mr Musk told Twitter staff that they had to commit to working long hours and would "need to be extremely hardcore" or leave the company, according to reports.
In an email to staff, the firm's new owner said workers should agree to the pledge if they wanted to stay, the Washington Post reported.
Those who did not sign up by Thursday 17 November would be given three months' severance pay, Mr Musk said.
Earlier this month the company said that it was cutting around 50% of its workforce.
Today's announcement that Twitter had temporarily closed its offices came amid signs that large numbers of workers have now also resigned as they have not accepted Mr Musk's new terms.
Employees have been tweeting using the hashtag #LoveWhereYouWorked and a saluting emoji to show they were leaving the firm.
One former Twitter worker who wished to remain anonymous told the BBC: "I think when the dust clears today, there's probably going to be less than 2,000 people left."
They added that everyone in their team had been terminated.
"The manager of that team, his manager was terminated. And then that manager's manager was terminated. The person above that was one of the execs terminated on the first day. So there's nobody left in that chain of command."
Before Mr Musk took control of Twitter the company had around 7,500 staff. The firm was also reported to have employed thousands of contract workers, the majority of which are understood to have been laid off.
Another person said they had resigned even though they had been prepared to work long hours.
"I didn't want to work for someone who threatened us over email multiple times about only 'exceptional tweeps should work here' when I was already working 60-70 hours weekly," they said.
The world's richest person became Twitter's chief executive after buying the firm last month in a $44bn (£37bn) deal.
In response to a question about concerns that Twitter was on the brink of shutting down after the message about Twitter's offices being closed was sent Mr Musk tweeted:
"The best people are staying, so I'm not super worried".
In separate posts he tweeted a skull and crossbones emoji and a meme showing a gravestone with the Twitter logo on it.

 

[Dent]

Hopefully someone is looking at how it's been used to great effect for customer services, though, and is considering developing a platform for that using its best features solely for that purpose. Going back to the only way to get anything out of the railway being to send a paper letter and wait three months would be seriously retrograde.

Is it really a good thing that so many companies have made basic customer service the sole reserve of customers of one particular proprietary network with dodgy ethics, or at lease given customers of that network preferential service over the general public?

Who said anything about going bach to paper letters being the only means of communication? Communication methods other than Twitter and paper letters do exist.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Is it really a good thing that so many companies have made basic customer service the sole reserve of customers of one particular proprietary network with dodgy ethics

It's only had dodgy ethics since Musk bought it.

or at lease given customers of that network preferential service over the general public?

It's free and anybody can use it.

Who said anything about going bach to paper letters being the only means of communication? Communication methods other than Twitter and paper letters do exist.

Email is your other one and it's as slow as paper with the railway. Phone is expensive to manage. The great thing about Twitter is that it offers the immediacy of phone but the staff efficiency of email or letter. WhatsApp/text could be a viable replacement, that said.

What Twitter also offers is a "subscription JourneyCheck", which is quite neat.

 

[43096]

You’d think that the various lenders behind the Twitter takeover are going to take the new toy out of Elon’s pram at some point.

 

[adc82140]

Perhaps a return to emailing customer services will also be a return to some basic common courtesy. For some reason people think it's OK to hurl insults at customer services reps on Twitter. I doubt people do that on email. The reason? Email is private, Twitter is public, and a good chunk of the Twitterati are just there to draw attention to themselves.

 

[Dent]

It's free and anybody can use it.

It is still proprietary and can only be used on terms unilaterally dictated by Twitter, which include handing over personal data to a dodgy company with no guarantee that they will never abuse your data for their own benefit.

 

[takno]

It's only had dodgy ethics since Musk bought it.



It's free and anybody can use it.



Email is your other one and it's as slow as paper with the railway. Phone is expensive to manage. The great thing about Twitter is that it offers the immediacy of phone but the staff efficiency of email or letter. WhatsApp/text could be a viable replacement, that said.

What Twitter also offers is a "subscription JourneyCheck", which is quite neat.

By focusing all of their in-house customer service on twitter the rail companies have abdicated their wider responsibilities and excluded a huge proportion of their customers who don't want to, don't know how to, or are legitimately fearful to engage with the platform. Its existence as a minimum possible support crutch has prevented responsible development of better websites and platforms.

Twitter is not the customer's friend.

 

[Bletchleyite]

It is still proprietary and can only be used on terms unilaterally dictated by Twitter

So is your mobile phone service and your Internet access.

, which include handing over personal data to a dodgy company

Until Musk was involved it wasn't dodgy.

with no guarantee that they will never abuse your data for their own benefit.

Hardly any personal data is collected, I think it's just name, email and handle.

By focusing all of their in-house customer service on twitter the rail companies have abdicated their wider responsibilities and excluded a huge proportion of their customers who don't want to, don't know how to, or are legitimately fearful

Paranoid

to engage with the platform. Its existence as a minimum possible support crutch has prevented responsible development of better websites and platforms.

It's killed off JourneyCheck which was good. But other than that...

Twitter is not the customer's friend.

It very much is.

 

[Cloud Strife]

Now things are getting very interesting. A Twitter user has posted a lengthy thread, where they provide strong evidence that Musk was in the US illegally at some point while probably not even finishing university. It's a long read, but well worth it:

https://twitter.com/capitolhunters/status/1593307541932474368

Someone has to say it: Elon Musk has lied for 27 years about his credentials. He does not have a BS in Physics, or any technical field. Did not get into a PhD program. Dropped out in 1995 & was illegal. Later, investors quietly arranged a diploma - but not in science.

Wow.

 

[Dent]

So is your mobile phone service and your Internet access.

First of all that is whatboutery - a problem also existing somewhere else does not make it not a problem. Secondly, this is a false parallel since train companies are not saying they will only provide customer service if you the phone you call them from is on one particular mobile network.

 

[Bletchleyite]

First of all that is whatboutery - a problem also existing somewhere else does not make it not a problem. Secondly, this is a false parallel since train companies are not saying they will only provide customer service if you the phone you call them from is on one particular mobile network.

This is just pure Luddism, as is common on this social media platform (which is why I find it strange that anyone here is opposed to other social media platforms and online services!)

Musk may have made moving to another platform desirable, but prior to him Twitter was doing the job very well indeed. And he might just give up and sell it, in which case it'll go back to doing so.

 

[yorksrob]

Musk may have made moving to another platform desirable, but prior to him Twitter was doing the job very well indeed. And he might just give up and sell it, in which case it'll go back to doing so.

It was doing ok, until it started forcing people to log on to see business profiles etc. Went rapidly down the pan in terms of usefulness after that.

 

[Bletchleyite]

It was doing ok, until it started forcing people to log on to see business profiles etc. Went rapidly down the pan in terms of usefulness after that.

Just log on, then. It doesn't require much PI. Handle name, display name, date of birth (for legal reasons) and phone number (use a burner?) appear to be it.

 

[yorksrob]

Just log on, then. It doesn't require much PI. Handle name, display name, date of birth (for legal reasons) and phone number (use a burner?) appear to be it.

I preferred it when you didn't have to log on or have "an account" like everything seems to insist on these days.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I preferred it when you didn't have to log on or have "an account" like everything seems to insist on these days.

There are cases where it's annoying, I agree, but to follow your preferred TOCs and send them messages you clearly need some sort of account.

 

[yorksrob]

There are cases where it's annoying, I agree, but to follow your preferred TOCs and send them messages you clearly need some sort of account.

To be fair, most of them I'll look at the website now, and occasionally send an email.

 

[Dent]

This is just pure Luddism, as is common on this social media platform (which is why I find it strange that anyone here is opposed to other social media platforms and online services!)

Musk may have made moving to another platform desirable, but prior to him Twitter was doing the job very well indeed. And he might just give up and sell it, in which case it'll go back to doing so.

What are you on about? None of the points you were quoting have anythign to do with "Luddism", whatever that may mean.

 

[Bletchleyite]

What are you on about? None of the points you were quoting have anythign to do with "Luddism", whatever that may mean.

"Luddism" is the rejection of technology, essentially, usually used perjoratively for groundless rejection of it, e.g. suggesting that pre-Musk Twitter was some sort of threat to the tiny amount of personal information you have to give it to register.

 

[pdeaves]

If I understand this correctly:
Twitter staff were told you must work in the office (not at home);
Twitter staff were locked out of the office.

What on earth is the 'big cheese' doing? (I know, no one knows).

 

[yorksrob]

What on earth is the 'big cheese' doing? (I know, no one knows).

Having a go at the "will I outlast a lettuce" challenge by the looks of it.

Seems popular amongst high fliers these days !

 

[Dent]

"Luddism" is the rejection of technology, essentially, usually used perjoratively for groundless rejection of it, e.g. suggesting that pre-Musk Twitter was some sort of threat to the tiny amount of personal information you have to give it to register.

None of the points I have raised in any way constitute "as rejection of technology", and your attempt to misrepresent them as such0 is obviously a strawman.

It's interesting that you mention "usually used pejoratively", because that certainly looks like what you were doing by using that term - ie. you were resorting to random insults when couldn't think of any valid response to the points I raised.

 

[Bletchleyite]

when couldn't think of any valid response to the points I raised.

Indeed I can't, because they aren't really valid points. Anyone who can use an e-mail client can use Twitter, it isn't in the slightest bit complex - follow your preferred TOCs and direct message them when you have an issue. Anyone who can't use an e-mail client can use the telephone or a paper letter as before.

TOCs using Twitter, pioneered by David Whitley at Chiltern and LM, has provided a massive upgrade to its ease and accessibility, and because of how it works it is staff-efficient too.

 

[RichJF]

Various tech sites/sources saying that the the payroll & tech teams have walked out en masse. So if the team who develops the site & the team that pays you have both gone, what on earth does that leave?

 

[Dent]

Indeed I can't, because they aren't really valid points. Anyone who can use an e-mail client can use Twitter, it isn't in the slightest bit complex - follow your preferred TOCs and direct message them when you have an issue. Anyone who can't use an e-mail client can use the telephone or a paper letter as before.

My point was nothing to do with complexity, that is another strawman you are trying to fabricate.

My concern was about basic customer service, which should be available to all customers, becoming the sole reserve of people who hand over personal data to a private company with no guarantee that they will never abuse it for their own gain. Why is that not a valid point?

 

[Bletchleyite]

My point was nothing to do with complexity, that is another strawman you are trying to fabricate.

My concern was about basic customer service, which should be available to all customers

It is available by telephone and letter if you don't do tech. If you do do tech, use Twitter!

becoming the sole reserve of people who hand over personal data to a private company with no guarantee that they will never abuse it for their own gain. Why is that not a valid point?

You'd best not use any company, then. Even the postman could open and read your letter or it could be misdelivered, probably more likely than someone bothering to trawl the private messages in Twitter or find something to do with the very small amount of PI required to register on it.

 

[Dent]

It is available by telephone and letter if you don't do tech.

But the service available via those means is inferior. Also, misrepresenting people with legitimate concerns about a private company's use of personal data as "don't do tech" is rather disingenuous, and is basically your previous "Luddism" strawman all over again.

You'd best not use any company, then. Even the postman could open and read your letter or it could be misdelivered, probably more likely than someone bothering to trawl the private messages in Twitter or find something to do with the very small amount of PI required to register on it.

You are resorting to whataboutery again.

 

[Bletchleyite]

But the service available via those means is inferior.

Of course non-tech methods are inferior. It's inferior to have to go to a station to buy a ticket in advance with cash compared to buying one online, too.

Also, misrepresenting people with legitimate concerns about a private company's use of personal data as "don't do tech" is rather disingenuous, and is basically your previous "Luddism" strawman all over again.

Pre Musk there was no such concern, or no more than your phone or email provider who have more data (e.g. Twitter doesn't want your address).

 

[Dent]

Of course non-tech methods are inferior.

But why should not blindly handing over data to this particular company mean that someone receives inferior customer service? Companies could provide an acceptable level of service via means of communication available to the general public.

It's inferior to have to go to a station to buy a ticket in advance with cash compared to buying one online, too.

Does that have any relevance, or it is more whataboutery?

Pre Musk there was no such concern,

It was still proprietary, and using is still required handing over personal data to a private company with no guarantees, so of course there were concerns.

or no more than your phone or email provider who have more data

Yet again, more whataboutery.

 

[OuterDistant]

I find watching all this quite amusing. I've had little time for Elon Musk since the "sorry pedo guy" incident, and even less time since he's revealed himself to be a sort of Victorian mill owner with ADHD.

 

[Fragezeichnen]

But why should not blindly handing over data to this particular company mean that someone receives inferior customer service? Companies could provide an acceptable level of service via means of communication available to the general public.

To use twitter you need an networked device, a contract with an internet provider, and a twitter account. Your internet company has your full personal details and knows which sites you visit.

To make a phone call you need a phone and contract with a phone company who carries the call. The phone company has your personal details and records who you phoned and when.

To send a letter you need buy a stamp from the Royal Mail, and Royal Mail knows who you got letters from, if the return address in on the envelope.

Why is one of those not available to the general public, and not the others? I genuinely am baffled what the difference is here. Please explain and don't just dismiss it as 'whataboutery'.