1970 Paddington - Ilfracombe / Minehead train consists

[Nacht-Zug-Fahr]

Good evening all ,

I’m going to model the Ilfracombe line and base it in the year 1970. Does anyone know what the likely consist would of been on a through Paddington to Ilfracombe service ?

 

[John Webb]

You might find http://www.disused-stations.org.uk/i/ilfracombe/index.shtml of interest.
The station closed on the 5th of October 1970, so modelling it in 1970 is to do so at the end of its life?

 

[Nacht-Zug-Fahr]

You might find http://www.disused-stations.org.uk/i/ilfracombe/index.shtml of interest.
The station closed on the 5th of October 1970, so modelling it in 1970 is to do so at the end of its life?

Yes that’s correct , the last summer in fact !

 

[Gloster]

Nine coaches: RU leading from Paddington, BSK second and ninth, SO third, fourth, seventh and eighth, and two CK in the middle.

 

[Nacht-Zug-Fahr]

Nine coaches: RU leading from Paddington, BSK second and ninth, SO third, fourth, seventh and eighth, and two CK in the middle.

Brilliant

 

[randyrippley]

Nine coaches: RU leading from Paddington, BSK second and ninth, SO third, fourth, seventh and eighth, and two CK in the middle.

Warship or Hymek? Or had the 47s moved in?

 

[John Webb]

Nine coaches: RU leading from Paddington, BSK second and ninth, SO third, fourth, seventh and eighth, and two CK in the middle.

I'm curious as to why the Restaurant car was placed right at the front of the train rather than being 'inside'?

 

[Ash Bridge]

Warship or Hymek? Or had the 47s moved in?

Most likely a Warship then Hymek I think, although if my memory serves me correctly I’m sure @Cowley found a photo not so long ago of a Western at Barnstaple Junction working this service roughly around this period in time.

 

[Nacht-Zug-Fahr]

Warship or Hymek? Or had the 47s moved in?

I think Warships mainly hauled the through Pad services in 1969/70 .

 

[Sir Felix Pole]

Ilfracombe had been severely rationalised by the end - singled to Barnstaple and just the main platform and run-round loop left. Ideal, I guess, if you have space restrictions for the model.

 

[Gloster]

Warship or Hymek? Or had the 47s moved in?

I would expect Warships, but there will probably be photographic evidence.

I'm curious as to why the Restaurant car was placed right at the front of the train rather than being 'inside'?

The seated coaches were one of the sets used by the WR for weekend reliefs, while the RU was a loose vehicle.

 

[Cowley]

Most likely a Warship then Hymek I think, although if my memory serves me correctly I’m sure @Cowley found a photo not so long ago of a Western at Barnstaple Junction working this service roughly around this period in time.

Yes I’ve found a couple of photos of Westerns at Barnstaple Junction on Ilfracombe services but I think that was pretty rare and I’ve never seen one at Ilfracombe so I’m not even sure if they were allowed across the bridge?

I’d definitely say that it was a fairly solid Warship working in that time period, although Hymeks weren’t uncommon a couple of years before.

 

[Gloster]

Yes I’ve found a couple of photos of Westerns at Barnstaple Junction on Ilfracombe services but I think that was pretty rare and I’ve never seen one at Ilfracombe so I’m not even sure if they were allowed across the bridge?

I’d definitely say that it was a fairly solid Warship working in that time period, although Hymeks weren’t uncommon a couple of years before.

I very much doubt that a Western would get across the bridge: if it did there would probably be a flurry of ‘Please Explains’. I have my doubts whether a Hymek could take nine heavily loaded coaches out of Ilfracombe, even on a dry day.

 

[Cowley]

I have my doubts whether a Hymek could take nine heavily loaded coaches out of Ilfracombe, even on a dry day.

There’s a few photos online from the green diesel/maroon stock era showing them heading that way on some services. Here’s a photo from the Cornwall Railway Society site with the caption “A lovely shot of Hymek D7006 with 08:10 Paddington to Ilfracombe June 1970 (copyright David Tozer)”:

 

[Gloster]

There’s a few photos online from the green diesel/maroon stock era showing them heading that way on some services. Here’s a photo from the Cornwall Railway Society site with the caption “A lovely shot of Hymek D7006 with 08:10 Paddington to Ilfracombe June 1970 (copyright David Tozer)”:
View attachment 139207

Well, well. But did it get back again?

 

[Cowley]

Well, well. But did it get back again?

Maybe it’s still there?

 

[Magdalia]

I very much doubt that a Western would get across the bridge: if it did there would probably be a flurry of ‘Please Explains’.

My recollection is that Westerns were not passed to Barnstaple Junction, never mind over the bridge to Barnstaple Town?

 

[Ash Bridge]

My recollection is that Westerns were not passed to Barnstaple Junction, never mind over the bridge to Barnstaple Town?

I’ve a feeling that Mr Cowley will return shortly with another one of his lovely photographs to disprove that!

 

[Cowley]

I’ve found a couple of photos of them up there but this is the only one I can find on my phone at the moment. Unfortunately I haven’t a clue who took it or where it came from so no details of the date etc.

 

[32475]

There’s some good footage on YouTube featuring Warships with Mk 1 stock and DMUs. Sorry I can’t do a link but look at:
Barnstaple and Ilfracombe railway 1970
and
Winter train to Ilfracombe

 

[Ash Bridge]

I was hoping you would dig that one out again Mr C, what an absolute gem! From what I can gather the track through the platform on the extreme left of the image was lifted sometime during the first half of 1971 (certainly gone by July) so this perhaps dates this shot to sometime after that. There’s some interesting footage from 1970 contained in the link below….

Barnstaple to Ilfracombe - 1970 | You won't need to be a railway buff to love this video I've had sent in. I've posted posted part of it before, but here's a much longer version of a... | By Barnstaple History | Facebook

You won't need to be a railway buff to love this video I've had sent in. I've posted posted part of it before, but here's a much longer version of a...

www.facebook.com

Edit: beaten to it by @32475 I see!

 

[Magdalia]

I’ve found a couple of photos of them up there but this is the only one I can find on my phone at the moment. Unfortunately I haven’t a clue who took it or where it came from so no details of the date etc.

Thanks. I know there were a few workings, but my understanding is that they were very rare, and possibly required some sort of approval? One such instance was D1055 on 30 June 1973.

There are some clues to the date in the picture. The loco has air brakes, and it looks like the track has already been removed from the back platform. I suspect that it is after Ilfracombe closed.

 

[ChiefPlanner]

I would expect Warships, but there will probably be photographic evidence.



The seated coaches were one of the sets used by the WR for weekend reliefs, while the RU was a loose vehicle.

Would a full meal service be available (or necessary) down there ? - probably handily placed for quick detachment at Exeter and getting another trip out of car and crew.

(Much like West Wales where similar attaching and detaching was done at Swansea in most cases)

Some expert will come forward to be sure.

 

[hexagon789]

Would a full meal service be available (or necessary) down there ? - probably handily placed for quick detachment at Exeter and getting another trip out of car and crew.

(Much like West Wales where similar attaching and detaching was done at Swansea in most cases)

Some expert will come forward to be sure.

The 1970 WR CWN has the restaurant car as being attached throughout.

 

[Nacht-Zug-Fahr]

The 1970 WR CWN has the restaurant car as being attached throughout.

Is it possible to view the 1970 WR CWN online ?

 

[ChiefPlanner]

The 1970 WR CWN has the restaurant car as being attached throughout.

Thank you ! - but one wonders if the car was staffed throughout. !!!

(a quick search on the usual source indicates a through "luncheon car" working from the terminus in 1905 - and even better a slip working at Taunton for I/fracombe via Barnstaple , which included a dining car at a later date.)

Every day a learning day.

 

[Gloster]

Ilfracombe had been severely rationalised by the end - singled to Barnstaple and just the main platform and run-round loop left. Ideal, I guess, if you have space restrictions for the model.

On 17 December 1967 the box was closed and ground-frames provided. The same day the layout was reduced to a run-round loop, headshunt and one siding: the loop was accessed at the south end by going into the the head shunt. On 5 May 1968 the south end connection was reversed and both the loop and siding were abolished.

The back platform at Barnstaple was put out of use on 21 May 1971.

(Source: Cooke’s diagrams, section 15.)

Thank you ! - but one wonders if the car was staffed throughout. !!!

(a quick search on the usual source indicates a through "luncheon car" working from the terminus in 1905 - and even better a slip working at Taunton for I/fracombe via Barnstaple , which included a dining car at a later date.)

Every day a learning day.

The Ilfracombe timetable of the 1969-1970 WR book shows it as available through to Ilfracombe. However, it is counter service only.

 

[hexagon789]

Is it possible to view the 1970 WR CWN online ?

In a fashion - if you are interested, there is a long-running e-mail group of Robert Carroll's formerly on Yahoo Groups but on groups . io:

CoachingStock groups.io Group

This group is for the posting of coach formations running on the railways within the UK. Posts about Rolling Stock news also welcome Postings about: - Charter train coaching stock numbers - HST / Mk4 set formations - ECS moves - Network Rail Test Train Numbers - Scotrail & GWR Sleeper stock

groups.io

If you sign-up, as well as the ability to pose questions to the membership, there is a very large collection of Carriage Working Book scans from all the BR Regions and some from the Big 4, plus various associated files to view.

Thank you ! - but one wonders if the car was staffed throughout. !!!

I suspected perhaps not, but @Gloster has helpfully touched on that.

On 17 December 1967 the box was closed and ground-frames provided. The same day the layout was reduced to a run-round loop, headshunt and one siding: the loop was accessed at the south end by going into the the head shunt. On 5 May 1968 the south end connection was reversed and both the loop and siding were abolished.

The back platform at Barnstaple was put out of use on 21 May 1971.

(Source: Cooke’s diagrams, section 15.)



The Ilfracombe timetable of the 1969-1970 WR book shows it as available through to Ilfracombe. However, it is counter service only.

Seems a bit of an overkill using an RU for just a counter service.

 

[DarloRich]

I am always surprised the line closed so late - a year or two more and we might still be running trains up that way although that curved bridge in Barnstaple always looks like a closure waiting tpo happen!

As an aside when we lived in North Devon 25 ish years ago my mum worked at the former Town station from time to time - wish I had paid more interest

 

[Gloster]

Seems a bit of an overkill using an RU for just a counter service.

The carriage working book shows it as doing nothing during the whole week other than the Ilfracombe, so if you have got a vehicle spare, better one that isn’t entirely suitable than two. Of course, whether it earned its costs in this one journey is another question, but it may have been available for charters, etc. at other times (and they aren’t popular with the Operating Department on summer Saturdays).

The last public timetable, on the Cornish Railways Society site, also shows it as buffet open throughout.