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Airport "public transport" tax

enginedin

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It slightly irks me there's an airport public transport tax at Edinburgh, with both the tram and and bus having an airport zone. Other airports don't feel the need to do this (e.g Liverpool, where you can get a standard network single to outside the terminal building). I assume this is the airport mandating this, rather than Lothian Transport / Edinburgh Trams?

Of course, what many people do is ignore the signs at Ingliston P&R which say "no pedestrian route to airport", which there clearly is, and walk the final km.
 
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overthewater

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It is the Airport that has this, hence why Stagecoach 747 has higher fares. The weekly and daily tickets are valid, and are used by the staff.

The old First Scotland East 21a which went to the Gyle didn't have the premium as it didn't terminate at the airport, but when it became 600 in came the higher fares.
 
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The exile

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Edinburgh is not unique in this. Bristol Airport has similar punitive “charges” - though of course no proper modern public transport to get you there.
 

CN04NRJ

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It slightly irks me there's an airport public transport tax at Edinburgh, with both the tram and and bus having an airport zone. Other airports don't feel the need to do this (e.g Liverpool, where you can get a standard network single to outside the terminal building). I assume this is the airport mandating this, rather than Lothian Transport / Edinburgh Trams?

Of course, what many people do is ignore the signs at Ingliston P&R which say "no pedestrian route to airport", which there clearly is, and walk the final km.

I believe the airport charges operators per departure, hence that being passed on to the customer.
 

Acfb

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They've changed this over the years, when the 35 ran to the airport there was a supplement which they even took away briefly so you could pay normal fares to the airport at one point IIRC.

Personally I don't mind the airport supplement/price of a return ticket as I have had the convenience of the 400 running directly to the airport for the past few years otherwise I will just have my bus pass topped up.

Thinking of English examples the 199 to Manchester Airport also seemed really good value a few years ago, something like £7.30 open return from Whaley Bridge IIRC.
 

Gaelan

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It slightly irks me there's an airport public transport tax at Edinburgh, with both the tram and and bus having an airport zone. Other airports don't feel the need to do this (e.g Liverpool, where you can get a standard network single to outside the terminal building). I assume this is the airport mandating this, rather than Lothian Transport / Edinburgh Trams?

Of course, what many people do is ignore the signs at Ingliston P&R which say "no pedestrian route to airport", which there clearly is, and walk the final km.
London Heathrow also has surcharges for the various rail routes in - on the Elizabeth Line an outright surcharge, on the Piccadilly line traveling to Heathrow is always a peak journey. Heathrow Express is just overpriced in the first place.

There’s also very many airports with a punitively priced shuttle train from a nearby station to the airport proper - offhand there’s Luton (£4.90), Paris Orly (€11), and New York JFK ($8.25).
 

The exile

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There’s also very many airports with a punitively priced shuttle train from a nearby station to the airport proper - offhand there’s Luton (£4.90), Paris Orly (€11), and New York JFK ($8.25).
In my experience in mainland Europe, the “punitively priced” service (be it train or bus) is an “extra” dedicated shuttle (like the Gatwick Express in its initial form), whereas “normal” services attract no premium.
 

185143

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In my experience in mainland Europe, the “punitively priced” service (be it train or bus) is an “extra” dedicated shuttle (like the Gatwick Express in its initial form), whereas “normal” services attract no premium.
Dublin is like that.

Jump on the regular Dublin Bus service and it'll set you back a couple of Euros. They accept Leap cards and are included in the daily cap. Catch the dedicated aircoach and it's about €10, I think. Admittedly the aircoach will be faster, and it's a coach rather than a bus, but still. I see no issue with that.
 

hexagon789

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I believe the airport charges operators per departure, hence that being passed on to the customer.
Lothian Buses pays Edinburgh Airport a fixed yearly charge for the privilege of serving the airport, plus a further amount linked to tickets sold I understand.

The fixed charge was due to be increased a few years ago, but was successfully maintained at the same figure after Loathian obtained an Interim Interdict against the airport owning company.
 

Teds

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London Heathrow also has surcharges for the various rail routes in - on the Elizabeth Line an outright surcharge, on the Piccadilly line traveling to Heathrow is always a peak journey. Heathrow Express is just overpriced in the first place.
TfL imposed the 'peak fare at anytime' charges to Heathrow to help with their post-Covid revenue shortfall. I think they only apply for journeys starting in zone 1. Fares on the Elizabeth Line to Heathrow seem to have an outright surcharge although zone 1-6 Travelcards and PAYG caps are valid. Heathrow wanted to charge TfL £400 per Elizabeth Line departure but ORR reduced the charge- sorry, I can't remember what it was reduced to. Unlike the Piccadilly Line, Heathrow Airport built and own the branch from the GW main line.

I think airport surcharges are quite common around the world. Transport operators seem to work on the basis that if they are travelling to or from an airport, the passengers can pay more. Sometimes, there is an enhanced service such as Gatwick Express but not always.
 

LBObserver

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It slightly irks me there's an airport public transport tax at Edinburgh, with both the tram and and bus having an airport zone. Other airports don't feel the need to do this (e.g Liverpool, where you can get a standard network single to outside the terminal building). I assume this is the airport mandating this, rather than Lothian Transport / Edinburgh Trams?

Of course, what many people do is ignore the signs at Ingliston P&R which say "no pedestrian route to airport", which there clearly is, and walk the final km.
Taxis are also charged for every drop off or pick up at the airport, which they are allowed to add to the fare.
 

Statto

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London Heathrow also has surcharges for the various rail routes in - on the Elizabeth Line an outright surcharge, on the Piccadilly line traveling to Heathrow is always a peak journey. Heathrow Express is just overpriced in the first place.

There’s also very many airports with a punitively priced shuttle train from a nearby station to the airport proper - offhand there’s Luton (£4.90), Paris Orly (€11), and New York JFK ($8.25).

Not only rail, but Heathrow has surcharges for coach routes too.

The Greenline 724 used to have the surcharge for Heathrow passengers too, was £10 adult single, but i see that's part of the £2 fare cap scheme.
 

Grumpy Git

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Arlanda airport in Sweden has a horrendous surcharge if you use the railway, which can be totally avoided by using the bus. I understand it's levied by the private owners of the airport station.

I was absolutely gobsmacked the first (and last) time I ever arrived there by train. IIRC, it's about the equivalent of £10 per passenger!
 

jfollows

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San Francisco airport on BART has more expensive tickets than Millbrae, even though the latter is one stop further away from San Francisco itself.
 
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markymark2000

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Not only rail, but Heathrow has surcharges for coach routes too.

The Greenline 724 used to have the surcharge for Heathrow passengers too, was £10 adult single, but i see that's part of the £2 fare cap scheme.
Heathrow certainly seem to charge a fee but is it that high as other bus companies have kept Heathrow in the normal fare zones for a while and not charged a much higher fee. The exception to that being intercity coaches who do seem to happily charge a lot extra for using Heathrow and attempt to refuse to let you alight early if you buy a cheaper ticket to Victoria.



In general, I think it's absolutely appalling that airports 'tax' public transport so heavily, it's clear that they want the parking revenue and are willing to attempt to kill off/outprice public transport options in a bid to get more people to drive there.
 

Watershed

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Heathrow certainly seem to charge a fee but is it that high as other bus companies have kept Heathrow in the normal fare zones for a while and not charged a much higher fee. The exception to that being intercity coaches who do seem to happily charge a lot extra for using Heathrow and attempt to refuse to let you alight early if you buy a cheaper ticket to Victoria.
Don't see how that can be enforced unless you have luggage in the hold? Just get off when it stops at Heathrow! Obviously a different matter "starting late" in the opposite direction.

In general, I think it's absolutely appalling that airports 'tax' public transport so heavily, it's clear that they want the parking revenue and are willing to attempt to kill off/outprice public transport options in a bid to get more people to drive there.
It's marked based pricing at the end of the day. Public transport is often still the cheapest option unless you are travelling in a big group, for a very short trip (where parking would be cheap) or departing/arriving at a time of day when you'd need a hotel to use public transport.
 

Nym

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On the flip side. Buses pay road tax, trains pay access fees. Airports provide infrastructure, are they not entitled to payment for the use of that infrastructure…?
 

Towers

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On the flip side. Buses pay road tax, trains pay access fees. Airports provide infrastructure, are they not entitled to payment for the use of that infrastructure…?
I would suggest that depends on how much you think an airport ought to the appreciate services which bring in its customers!

It’s interesting that Heathrow is currently running a TV and billboard advertising campaign, and so clearly feels it needs to compete with other airports. Some might suggest that not hammering every poor sod who goes anywhere near the place in a greedy cashgrab may help their cause somewhat!
 

markymark2000

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Don't see how that can be enforced unless you have luggage in the hold? Just get off when it stops at Heathrow! Obviously a different matter "starting late" in the opposite direction.
If you don't have any luggage in the lockers, yes it works. In most cases though, if you are going to the Airport, you will have an item of luggage which requires to be in the locker.

It's marked based pricing at the end of the day. Public transport is often still the cheapest option unless you are travelling in a big group, for a very short trip (where parking would be cheap) or departing/arriving at a time of day when you'd need a hotel to use public transport.
Public transport isn't always the cheapest option, especially when you consider that people don't tend to see the full cost of using a car, they see the immediate costs which come with that journey, in the case of driving to the Airport, they would see the cost as a bit of fuel and the parking. Even if the car is more expensive, if the cost difference is low, people will just go for the car for the convenience. You've also got to consider family/friends giving lifts as again, that will be cheaper than public transport. Public Transport has to be cheap to be attractive and the fees the Airport push onto companies makes it not attractive and is rather anti competitive as the high fees mean that there are limited companies willing to pay the fees to serve the Airport. Bristol for example could have a good few additional buses there if the fees weren't so high, Edinburgh similarly wouldn't have companies serving Ingliston Park and Ride to avoid paying the silly fees, they would just serve the Airport.

Airports provide infrastructure, are they not entitled to payment for the use of that infrastructure…?
That depends if the infrastructure is good enough to be paid for. Edinburgh Airport is just a few random bus shelters, that's all that bus companies get. Whoopie doo. Bristol the bus station is nothing more than a car park with a few barriers in it and a portacabin for waiting (though be willing to be the last on the bus if you wait in here, and possibly left behind if the bus is full).

I'd add as well, charging a normal departure fee is completely justified and this is how almost all bus stations in the UK cover their cost of operating. The issue is the extremely high departure fee or the access charge, however it is charged, which makes fares significantly higher than they need to be. For a tram fare to jump by £5.50 for a single stop is just bonkers and suggests that the fees are astronomical.


Sadly both airports I have found to be extremely secretive over their fees so it's hard information to get hold of, if anyone can give the actual fees, it would be very helpful.
 

Statto

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Don't see how that can be enforced unless you have luggage in the hold? Just get off when it stops at Heathrow! Obviously a different matter "starting late" in the opposite direction.
The coach station at Heathrow has barriers at the stands now, & theirs always someone at the stand checking tickets from those alighting the coach.
 

Watershed

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The coach station at Heathrow has barriers at the stands now, & theirs always someone at the stand checking tickets from those alighting the coach.
What are they going to do if you don't get back on the coach? They can't hold you hostage; there isn't a coach equivalent of a Penalty Fare or Regulation of Railways Act!
 

sk688

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Brussels Zaventem has the Diabolo fee , which while the airport stresses is not an " airport surcharge ", given it is levied due to the tunnel construction to the airport it defacto is one

In Vienna the City Airport train has a surcharge, but this is easily avoided by catching a Railjet instead which is much cheaper
 

JonathanH

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What are they going to do if you don't get back on the coach? They can't hold you hostage; there isn't a coach equivalent of a Penalty Fare or Regulation of Railways Act!
Presumably charge the extra fare for alighting at the airport? There are terms and conditions for National Express which quite clearly state that boarding or alighting at an airport stop having not paid to do so breaches their terms and conditions of travel. If asked by the driver or other National Express member of staff an additional charge is payable.

See https://www.railforums.co.uk/thread...throw-pricing-to-swindon.253413/#post-6373781 and https://www.railforums.co.uk/thread...hort-on-national-express.256937/#post-6476271
 
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Watershed

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Presumably charge the extra fare for alighting at the airport? There are terms and conditions for National Express which quite clearly state that boarding or alighting at an airport stop having not paid to do so breaches their terms and conditions of travel. If asked by the driver or other National Express member of staff an additional charge is payable.

See https://www.railforums.co.uk/thread...throw-pricing-to-swindon.253413/#post-6373781 and https://www.railforums.co.uk/thread...hort-on-national-express.256937/#post-6476271
My point is that breaching their terms and conditions wouldn't entitle them to detain you, as unlike the railways it's a civil matter. I agree it's probably not a great idea though.
 

Jamesrob637

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Thinking of English examples the 199 to Manchester Airport also seemed really good value a few years ago, something like £7.30 open return from Whaley Bridge IIRC.

Is Whaley Bridge to Manchester Airport £2 each way nowadays?
 

jfollows

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I don't think there's a tax for Manchester Airport; at least not on Wilmslow-Manchester tickets for which it's a permitted route. Tickets with origin Manchester Airport may incur it.
 

gordonthemoron

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Sydney Airport has an AUD16.68 station access fee added to the train fare, there’s also a weekly cap of AUD33.84. If you use the bus there’s no access fee added
 

Watershed

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I don't think there's a tax for Manchester Airport; at least not on Wilmslow-Manchester tickets for which it's a permitted route. Tickets with origin Manchester Airport may incur it.
I can't think of any (interavailable) tickets valid between Wilmslow and Manchester that wouldn't also be valid via Manchester Airport, but in that sense it's no different to Stansted Airport in relation to tickets valid between Bishops Stortford and Audley End (or similar) along the West Anglia Main Line.

In a similar vein, fares to Manchester Airport are higher than those to Manchester for a lot of journeys from the south. For example, Northern's Advance tickets from Crewe to Manchester Airport range from £5 to £8.50, whilst equivalent Advances to Manchester Piccadilly range from £3.50 to £6.50. It's simply market based pricing in action.
 

OscarH

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Of course, what many people do is ignore the signs at Ingliston P&R which say "no pedestrian route to airport", which there clearly is, and walk the final km.
Bournemouth Airport has a similar sign right at the entrance saying no pedestrian access, despite their being a path not far before or after. Complete cash grab to get people to pay the drop-off/pick-up fee, especially as there's no public transport at all
 

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