Bristol rail improvements

Pat31 · 1 Feb 2024

Some interesting things in here, notably;

1. Funding for electrification of Filton bank
See para 75.

"Network Rail has recommended that funding is initially prioritised towards demonstrating the feasibility and affordability of electrifying the rail network between Bristol Parkway station and Bristol Temple Meads station (Filton Bank). Filton Bank, between Bristol Temple Meads and Bristol Parkway, is a core transport corridor within the region. Electrifying this section will enable electric rolling stock from Bristol Temple Meads towards London and Wales, while filling a further gap for electric trains heading north out of our region. Electric rolling stock exists for London and Wales bound services, however today operating with inefficient diesel motive power. Delivering this section of electrification enables the region to better consider decarbonisation of our regional branch line services, for example Battery / Electric rolling stock on the Seven Beach branch, and potentially to Henbury"

2. Branch line study for improved frequency of services

see 51.4

"This project will look at the feasibility and business case for operating increased services on a number of lines in the region, for example, 2/3tph on the proposed new Henbury line and 3tph on the existing Severn Beach Lines. This will take advantage of work currently being undertaken by Network Rail to assess the feasibility of an uplift in capacity on our sub-regional branch lines. The scope of the study will also be informed by the New Stations Study referred to above."

3. Rail service uplift on the bristol to weston line
51.5

"MetroWest Connectivity South (Bristol – Exeter rail corridor) – This project was a core recommendation from the Greater Bristol Strategic Rail Study, which promoted the likely connectivity, economic and operational benefits of improvements to the railway corridor to the south of Bristol. Subject to the West of England Mayoral Combined Authority being able to secure contributions from at least two other interest parties, the West of England Mayoral Combined Authority’s funding is proposed to be used to test the high-level business case, including economic and demand analysis, of the project, and will then include design and development works required in support of a Strategic Outline Business Case submission and funding request for future development works. The initial development work will build on previous design work by Network Rail which identified likely infrastructure enhancements required to enable a rail service uplift between Bristol Temple Meads and Weston-super-Mare. Further V-Sept23 development work and greater understanding of the likely business case and benefits will support future discussions with other potential funders, such as Highways England (who are interested due to the potential release of capacity on the M5), about longer-term development and delivery funding."

Obviously this is all very early doors but looks promising in regards to getting the electrification side of things rolling again, after it's gone quiet for a period.

https://westofengland-ca.moderngov.co.uk/documents/s7726/Item%2015%20-%20Transport%20Infrastructure%20Projects.pdf

RailUK Forums

thomalex · 3 Feb 2024

It remains insane that not one line into Temple Meads is electrified

zwk500 · 3 Feb 2024

Also being discussed here: https://www.railforums.co.uk/thread...ads-electrification-plan.262129/#post-6618992

Not sure if this thread should stay open as the overall plan is wider than just electrification.

thomalex said:
It remains insane that not one line into Temple Meads is electrified

AIUI part of the problem was the need to line up various ducks such as Bristol East and West Jns remodelling, Bristol TM resignalling, and the Filton Bank 4-tracking. Bristol West remains to be finished off, and given the service pattern means Filton Bank knitting would be of limited utility to existing stock, the business case process remains difficult to forge a path through. Certainly will have a good strategic case though, especially with the Bristol CAZ.

Parham Wood · 3 Feb 2024

Is there anything proposed to stop the ridiculous stopping of trains so far down the west end of some platforms that it is a long long walk to reach them even if only a three car? This to my mind is not passenger friendly and a problem for anyone with any mobility issues or heavy baggage. Not to mention the time it takes to do this.

JamieL · 3 Feb 2024

3 trains per hour on the Severn Beach line would surely be difficult given the long stretches of single track? Also, isn't the line heavily subsidised - I remember using it a few times and the tickets were very cheap.

Brissle Girl · 4 Feb 2024

It’s certainly not possible without another loop or short section of double tracking, as the stretch between Clifton Down and Avonmouth takes longer than 10 mins to pass through. (You could just about get away with the stretch between Clifton Down and Narroways Jn, but whether that would allow a resilient timetable is another matter - probably not).

QueensCurve · 5 Feb 2024

zwk500 said:
Also being discussed here: https://www.railforums.co.uk/thread...ads-electrification-plan.262129/#post-6618992

Not sure if this thread should stay open as the overall plan is wider than just electrification.

AIUI part of the problem was the need to line up various ducks such as Bristol East and West Jns remodelling, Bristol TM resignalling, and the Filton Bank 4-tracking. Bristol West remains to be finished off, and given the service pattern means Filton Bank knitting would be of limited utility to existing stock, the business case process remains difficult to forge a path through. Certainly will have a good strategic case though, especially with the Bristol CAZ.

It would also be useful to tie it in to electrification from Chippenham through Bath.

Pat31 · 6 Feb 2024

Brissle Girl said:
It’s certainly not possible without another loop or short section of double tracking, as the stretch between Clifton Down and Avonmouth takes longer than 10 mins to pass through. (You could just about get away with the stretch between Clifton Down and Narroways Jn, but whether that would allow a resilient timetable is another matter - probably not).

Agreed, I think some form of doubling along the route is an absolute must as this point. Trains are now delayed every day when delays around temple meads knock on. Doubling the whole route to Avonmouth may not be necessary as most passenger flows are no further than Clifton really.

Busaholic · 6 Feb 2024

Pat31 said:
Agreed, I think some form of doubling along the route is an absolute must as this point. Trains are now delayed every day when delays around temple meads knock on. Doubling the whole route to Avonmouth may not be necessary as most passenger flows are no further than Clifton really.

Are you suggesting that not all of the trains need reach Avonmouth then?

Pat31 · 6 Feb 2024

Busaholic said:
Are you suggesting that not all of the trains need reach Avonmouth then?

No, I'm suggesting that for a business case doubling the whole line as far as Avonmouth may not be necessary

Busaholic · 6 Feb 2024

Pat31 said:
No, I'm suggesting that for a business case doubling the whole line as far as Avonmouth may not be necessary

But to run a 3tph service it would, assuming Brissle Girl is right.

Pat31 · 6 Feb 2024

Busaholic said:
But to run a 3tph service it would, assuming Brissle Girl is right.

Yeah a passing loop may be enough though?

Brissle Girl · 6 Feb 2024

Busaholic said:
But to run a 3tph service it would, assuming Brissle Girl is right.

And just to clarify, it wouldn't need full double tracking, just enough additional track at one end of the section to enable trains to get through in less than 10 mins. Depending on the state of Clifton Down Tunnel (which I presume was originally double tracked?), it could be possible that would be the easier option, as experience elsewhere suggests redoubling a line long singled tends to involve considerable work on embankments and cuttings where a lack of maintenance has meant the original width trackbed is no longer sound.

However, in determining what enhancement is necessary to move to a 20 min frequency, you also need to think about what stock will deliver the service. If it were intended to use stock that is more fleet of foot than the current Class 165s then that changes how much additional track, and where it might be optimally placed. So like so many things, there is no simple answer.

Taunton · 6 Feb 2024

Network Rail has recommended that funding is initially prioritised towards demonstrating the feasibility and affordability of electrifying the rail network between Bristol Parkway station and Bristol Temple Meads station (Filton Bank).

Um ... this was all designed and planned in detail at the start of the GWML electrification project, given up to minimise the budget, and now we are to have another feasibility study to go over the same ground (literally) again? Presumably the study will be given to a different consultancy, who always outright refuse to look at any drawing prepared by a rival consultancy.

As most London trains go via Bath anyway, there's no benefit to the services currently provided, surely?

Busaholic · 6 Feb 2024

Brissle Girl said:
So like so many things, there is no simple answer.

In Bristol there never is!!

Brissle Girl · 6 Feb 2024

Taunton said:
Um ... this was all designed and planned in detail at the start of the GWML electrification project, given up to minimise the budget, and now we are to have another feasibility study to go over the same ground (literally) again? Presumably the study will be given to a different consultancy, who always outright refuse to look at any drawing prepared by a rival consultancy.

As most London trains go via Bath anyway, there's no benefit to the services currently provided, surely?

The only feasibility should be whether any bridge reconstructions can be avoided by using the same technology first used at the Cardiff Intersection bridge. Which really shouldn't take too long.

oglord · 6 Feb 2024

Taunton said:
As most London trains go via Bath anyway, there's no benefit to the services currently provided, surely?

Except for all the 800/802s that turn up on Taunton/Penzance services. A lot of the 2Uxx services from Bristol TM to Cardiff and 2Cxx in the other direction are also 800/802 operated and therefore could be entirely electric.

simonw · 6 Feb 2024

Brissle Girl said:
And just to clarify, it wouldn't need full double tracking, just enough additional track at one end of the section to enable trains to get through in less than 10 mins. Depending on the state of Clifton Down Tunnel (which I presume was originally double tracked?), it could be possible that would be the easier option, as experience elsewhere suggests redoubling a line long singled tends to involve considerable work on embankments and cuttings where a lack of maintenance has meant the original width trackbed is no longer sound.

However, in determining what enhancement is necessary to move to a 20 min frequency, you also need to think about what stock will deliver the service. If it were intended to use stock that is more fleet of foot than the current Class 165s then that changes how much additional track, and where it might be optimally placed. So like so many things, there is no simple answer.

The whole line to Avonmouth was double track, until it was singled in the 1970s as part of the resignalling of the Bristol area.

zwk500 · 6 Feb 2024

Taunton said:
Um ... this was all designed and planned in detail at the start of the GWML electrification project, given up to minimise the budget, and now we are to have another feasibility study to go over the same ground (literally) again? Presumably the study will be given to a different consultancy, who always outright refuse to look at any drawing prepared by a rival consultancy.

As most London trains go via Bath anyway, there's no benefit to the services currently provided, surely?

If the designs are provided to the consultants who get the contract, they'll certainly make use of them. And if the designs aren't provided, that's not the fault of the most recent consultants! Either way, design would be the easy bit - the massive question now is how the money all adds up now that 1. It's split out from the original GW project, 2. Services have shifted round and 3. COVID has altered travel patterns.

As to your second point, there's a few benefits to a couple of services on the Filton Bank and plenty of ECS moves using IETs that can pan up, as well as (possibly) the Filton Abbey Wood stopper. The main benefits would likely be allowing trains to clear Bristol East Jn faster, thus improving performance.

Sean Emmett · 6 Feb 2024

Brissle Girl said:
The only feasibility should be whether any bridge reconstructions can be avoided by using the same technology first used at the Cardiff Intersection bridge. Which really shouldn't take too long.

IIRC the only overbridges that still need doing are at Lawrence Hill (the biggie) and Constable Road (3m 29c from Temple Meads). Possibly also the footbridge 1/4 mile south of Filton Abbey Wood?

The exile · 6 Feb 2024

simonw said:
The whole line to Avonmouth was double track, until it was singled in the 1970s as part of the resignalling of the Bristol area.

So that’s 50 years for bits of substructure to have quietly deteriorated

simonw · 6 Feb 2024

The exile said:
So that’s 50 years for bits of substructure to have quietly deteriorated

I don't doubt it.

Bristol rail improvements

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