Once a train driver can you relocate?

LKS · 8 Apr 2024

Sorry if this has been asked before, couldn't find answers in search function.

As a train driver, is this something you can easily do in a new location I.e with a new TOC if your TOC doesn't cover new area of living?

I have no plans to relocate, but you never know what the future may hold. Hopefully will get a start date with my TOC very soon, but just thought this is something to consider.

If you have a standard pass but go to relocate elsewhere and the new toc is enhanced, would you have to resit tests? Or does being a qualified driver for a long period override?

If you then fail, does that mean you can't work at all as a driver as you technically failed assessment centre? And then loose the job you are currently in?

RailUK Forums

skyhigh · 8 Apr 2024

You can apply as a qualified driver anywhere in the UK. You don't have to resit psychometrics if you are qualified. I wouldn't call relocation 'easy' though.

tiptoptaff · 8 Apr 2024

World used to be your oyster as a Qualified.

Not so much these days

LKS · 8 Apr 2024

skyhigh said:
You can apply as a qualified driver anywhere in the UK. You don't have to resit psychometrics if you are qualified. I wouldn't call relocation 'easy' though.

Thought that might be the case... Luckily there is no intention of moving. But, reassured that if it ever happened, there wouldn't be the risk of loosing job if for instance failing a "advanced" test that was never taken to originally get in.

tiptoptaff said:
World used to be your oyster as a Qualified.

Not so much these days

That's a shame. Any idea why?

tiptoptaff · 8 Apr 2024

LKS said:
That's a shame. Any idea why?

cynical view is that TOCs can claim apprenticeship money for trainees but not for qualifieds

dk1 · 8 Apr 2024

At my TOC you are only allowed one internal depot move as a driver.

LKS · 8 Apr 2024

tiptoptaff said:
cynical view is that TOCs can claim apprenticeship money for trainees but not for qualifieds

Ah I see! Although you would think there would still be a long term saving but not putting drivers through training... Am I right in saying it's a very high amount for the cost of one person to train up? 90k?

dk1 said:
At my TOC you are only allowed one internal depot move as a driver.

So internal would be fine? But without keep moving around

dk1 · 8 Apr 2024

LKS said:
So internal would be fine? But without keep moving around

No, external is fine ie if you leave and transfer to another operator. We currently have a driver who is desperate to move to another depot for personal reasons but as they have already moved once internally it’s been blocked as they are the rules.

baz962 · 8 Apr 2024

tiptoptaff said:
cynical view is that TOCs can claim apprenticeship money for trainees but not for qualifieds

Very much changing back we believe.
Adverts for qualified very recently include Hull trains, OAO of course. Avanti , Thameslink/Great Northern , Northern , Lner , EMR , Wmt , TFW , Chiltern , ScotRail.
I don't know if it's true but rumours around our mess are that with the added time of street to seat and apparently more likely to have incidents that it's not worth it.

greatkingrat · 8 Apr 2024

LKS said:
So internal would be fine? But without keep moving around

Although even with internal moves, some depots are more popular than others and you might be waiting for many years until you get to the top of the list.

357 · 8 Apr 2024

My current TOC accepted relocation but my offer letter stated I needed to provide a suitable address before my start date

LKS · 8 Apr 2024

dk1 said:
No, external is fine ie if you leave and transfer to another operator. We currently have a driver who is desperate to move to another depot for personal reasons but as they have already moved once internally it’s been blocked as they are the rules.

Blimey! So guess they either stay, move toc or resign?

baz962 said:
Very much changing back we believe.
Adverts for qualified very recently include Hull trains, OAO of course. Avanti , Thameslink/Great Northern , Northern , Lner , EMR , Wmt , TFW , Chiltern , ScotRail.
I don't know if it's true but rumours around our mess are that with the added time of street to seat and apparently more likely to have incidents that it's not worth it.

Interesting....

(Although hope I get to start before that wave fully comes in

)

greatkingrat said:
Although even with internal moves, some depots are more popular than others and you might be waiting for many years until you get to the top of the list.

Do internal transfers take president over new starters? As in if they need drivers, would they take from talent pool before going to internal transfer list?

357 said:
My current TOC accepted relocation but my offer letter stated I needed to provide a suitable address before my start date

I guess that's to ensure you're within the travel time limit?

dk1 · 8 Apr 2024

LKS said:
Blimey! So guess they either stay, move toc or resign?

Probably. You have to draw the line somewhere I suppose. These things are very controlled between management & staff side.

whoosh · 8 Apr 2024

If you want to move location you have to:

Hope you can transfer within your TOC without there being a massive transfer list (40-50 on the list for Bedford Thameslink for example).

Hope you can get a job at another TOC/FOC at the location you want, both by having an acceptable Safety of the Line record (clear of incidents), and pass their other selection criteria and interview processes. (Although don't worry about the psychometric tests for trainees now you're qualified. Although saying that - don't know if they still do, but Trans Pennine Express made you do them all again!)

If you can't get nearby with another TOC, you might have to change TOC, then be 'productive' with them for a certain amount of years, and endure the burden of travelling there, before you can then go on the transfer list for the location that you actually wanted all along - then hope the list isn't too long!

So no, it isn't easy really! It took me three years of stepping stones to get where I wanted after I decided I wanted to relocate - and there was no-one on any transfer list.

LKS · 8 Apr 2024

whoosh said:
If you want to move location you have to:

Hope you can transfer within your TOC without there being a massive transfer list (40-50 on the list for Bedford Thameslink for example).

Hope you can get a job at another TOC/FOC at the location you want, both by having an acceptable Safety of the Line record (clear of incidents), and pass their other selection criteria and interview processes. (Although don't worry about the psychometric tests for trainees now you're qualified. Although saying that - don't know if they still do, but Trans Pennine Express made you do them all again!)

If you can't get nearby with another TOC, you might have to change TOC, then be 'productive' with them for a certain amount of years, before you can then go on the transfer list for the location that you actually wanted all along - then hope the list isn't too long!

So no, it isn't easy really! It took me three years of stepping stones to get where I wanted after I decided I wanted to relocate - and there was no-one on any transfer list.

Thanks for that. Appreciate it.

Glad you got to where you wanted to be, shame it took so long!

irish_rail · 8 Apr 2024

baz962 said:
Very much changing back we believe.
Adverts for qualified very recently include Hull trains, OAO of course. Avanti , Thameslink/Great Northern , Northern , Lner , EMR , Wmt , TFW , Chiltern , ScotRail.
I don't know if it's true but rumours around our mess are that with the added time of street to seat and apparently more likely to have incidents that it's not worth it.

Indeed. I think it's been realised it's a false economy for a TOC to take an apprentice which the Government help to fund, when , said apprentice won't be productive for about 18 months or so, and even then they are totally unproven. Compare that with a qualified driver , quite possibly productive within 3 months and a proven track record. You can see why TOCs are looking again at this "trainee obsession" we have seen. Although of course you do need fresh blood coming in, I'm not for one minute suggesting we need to do away with trainees all together!!!

357 · 8 Apr 2024

LKS said:
I guess that's to ensure you're within the travel time limit?

Yes. Where I was living when I applied for my current job was about a 5 hour commute each way!

In this case it was obvious I was going to have to move, however I do know of cases at other TOCs where people said they would move and then didn't, resulting in those companies no longer entertaining people who want to relocate.

ComUtoR · 9 Apr 2024

dk1 said:
but as they have already moved once internally it’s been blocked as they are the rules.

We have a similar rule in place but it only applies to 'clause' moves. We also offer, Hardship, Business benefit, and mutual exchange moves. There have been cases where a clause move has been declined but granted as a Hardship move. Well worth looking into alternative ways to move depots if it becomes necessary.

Smelliott · 9 Apr 2024

whoosh said:
(Although don't worry about the psychometric tests for trainees now you're qualified. Although saying that - don't know if they still do, but Trans Pennine Express made you do them all again!)

Was relatively recently offered a job as a qualified driver with TPE, and didn't have to resit any psychometrics, so presumably no longer the case.

driver9000 · 9 Apr 2024

whoosh said:
Hope you can get a job at another TOC/FOC at the location you want, both by having an acceptable Safety of the Line record (clear of incidents), and pass their other selection criteria and interview processes. (Although don't worry about the psychometric tests for trainees now you're qualified. Although saying that - don't know if they still do, but Trans Pennine Express made you do them all again!)

That was purely for TPEs own purposes and had no bearing on your existing employment or competency. Failing their tests just meant you didn't get the job and it wasn't the full suite of tests anyway.

Horizon22 · 9 Apr 2024

357 said:
My current TOC accepted relocation but my offer letter stated I needed to provide a suitable address before my start date

Sounds rather chicken & egg; don't want to move before an offer, but can't get an offer before you move!

whoosh said:
If you want to move location you have to:

Hope you can transfer within your TOC without there being a massive transfer list (40-50 on the list for Bedford Thameslink for example).

LKS said:
Thanks for that. Appreciate it.

Glad you got to where you wanted to be, shame it took so long!

Yes, there are many depots around the country which are seen to have 'better' work (e.g. Bedford for Thameslink) and/or are more desirable places to live (e.g. West Country depots for GWR) that the waiting list can easily stack up to the point it could be many years - if ever - before you can move. This is often why certain depots rarely have trainee vacancies because they are seen as "dead man's shoes"

357 · 9 Apr 2024

Horizon22 said:
Sounds rather chicken & egg; don't want to move before an offer, but can't get an offer before you move!

No, the offered me a job but with the long notice period required by most companies these days just made it a conditional offer on me giving them a new address before I start.

Considering the commute from my old address is 5 hours each way, I don't think they were overly concerned!

Horizon22 · 9 Apr 2024

357 said:
No, the offered me a job but with the long notice period required by most companies these days just made it a conditional offer on me giving them a new address before I start.

Considering the commute from my old address is 5 hours each way, I don't think they were overly concerned!

Ah that makes a lot more sense!

Efini92 · 10 Apr 2024

LKS said:
Sorry if this has been asked before, couldn't find answers in search function.

As a train driver, is this something you can easily do in a new location I.e with a new TOC if your TOC doesn't cover new area of living?

I have no plans to relocate, but you never know what the future may hold. Hopefully will get a start date with my TOC very soon, but just thought this is something to consider.

If you have a standard pass but go to relocate elsewhere and the new toc is enhanced, would you have to resit tests? Or does being a qualified driver for a long period override?

If you then fail, does that mean you can't work at all as a driver as you technically failed assessment centre? And then loose the job you are currently in?

Once you’re qualified the only time your psychometrics would be looked at again is if you were involved in a serious incident and the ORR were looking at your record.

If you want to change TOC the only barrier is the other candidates. You need to be the best on the day to guarantee the job. Especially if they are only recruiting for 1 or two vacancies.

387star · 10 Apr 2024

Horizon22 said:
Sounds rather chicken & egg; don't want to move before an offer, but can't get an offer before you move!

Yes, there are many depots around the country which are seen to have 'better' work (e.g. Bedford for Thameslink) and/or are more desirable places to live (e.g. West Country depots for GWR) that the waiting list can easily stack up to the point it could be many years - if ever - before you can move. This is often why certain depots rarely have trainee vacancies because they are seen as "dead man's shoes"

I'm not sure dead man's (woman's) shoes depots exist anymore. Most depots have seen huge influxs of trainees since the apprenticeship programme.

Moving as a Qualified is possibly harder than it was as a result of a preference for trainees although this is guess work and reading above it seems the tide is changing again.

Some coastal depots fill their depots via internal transfers hence you rarely may see Qualified vacancies at Ramsgate etc

Being able to move easily assuming you have a great safety record seemed like a wonderful bonus of the job that's perhaps worsened over the years although moving within your TOC is still very doable.

Horizon22 · 11 Apr 2024

387star said:
I'm not sure dead man's (woman's) shoes depots exist anymore. Most depots have seen huge influxs of trainees since the apprenticeship programme.

Moving as a Qualified is possibly harder than it was as a result of a preference for trainees although this is guess work and reading above it seems the tide is changing again.

Some coastal depots fill their depots via internal transfers hence you rarely may see Qualified vacancies at Ramsgate etc

Being able to move easily assuming you have a great safety record seemed like a wonderful bonus of the job that's perhaps worsened over the years although moving within your TOC is still very doable.

What I mean is while qualified roles may be harder to obtain, internal transfers may often trump trainee vacancies at certain depots, hence why they are often not advertised whilst the “metro” depots are constantly advertising for trainees as interals move over for the “better work”.

It’s not a phenomenon that occurs everywhere, but it’s also not uncommon.

Once a train driver can you relocate?

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