80,000 at Wembley tonight

[anti-pacer]

I'm currently watching the Tottenham v Ghent match on TV and there's over 80,000 in the stadium, which tonight is Wembley.

It got me thinking, what a logistical nightmare that will be to move all that lot after the game - a large proportion I'm guessing will use the Underground.

How does LU cope with these numbers and what will be in place to move them quickly and safely?

 

[yorksrob]

I went to a concert at Wembley Arena once and we were heading back to the tube, but we noticed a Chiltern train to Marylebone and hopped on that. Managed to overtake the scrum on the Bakerloo.

 

[anti-pacer]

I went to a concert at Wembley Arena once and we were heading back to the tube, but we noticed a Chiltern train to Marylebone and hopped on that. Managed to overtake the scrum on the Bakerloo.

I'm guessing from the stadium though most will use the Met and Jubilee lines to head back into town.

 

[yorksrob]

I'm guessing from the stadium though most will use the Met and Jubilee lines to head back into town.

I'm not sure. The Bakerloo doesn't look much further in the opposite direction on a map.

 

[Hadders]

There's the Met, Jubilee, Bakerloo and Ovreground (via Wembley Central) plus Chiltern from Wembley Stadium stations.

With trains running every few minutes and the trains capable of carrying over a thousand passengers each it's relatively straightforward.

LU is well used to moving large crowds of people - just look at the rush hour on any day of the week.

Cardiff when there's a match at the Millennium Stadium is a far more fraught although to be fair they do have the queuing system well organised.

 

[anti-pacer]

I'm not sure. The Bakerloo doesn't look much further in the opposite direction on a map.

It depends which exit you leave from, but either way, the three Wembley stations will still have to deal with thousands of people in a small space of time.

How do they manage?

 

[Kite159]

When I last went to Wembley for a show, Chiltern were running a 10 minute frequency from Wembley Stadium station to Marylebone which soaks up a few passengers

Wembley Park for the Jubilee & Met which is probably where most of the crowd head to, it can take a good 45 minutes+ to board.

Wembley Central is a bit further to walk for the Bakerloo/LO services.

 

[Shaw S Hunter]

It depends which exit you leave from, but either way, the three Wembley stations will still have to deal with thousands of people in a small space of time.

How do they manage?

They use the same sort of crowd control measures as used at Cardiff. But as has been said with high capacity trains running at pretty frequent intervals the queues are dealt with in a relatively short space of time. And people coming from longer distances are far more likely to arrive by road though that may mean parking at a suitable railhead a little further away. It's worth remembering that the original stadium was built nearly a hundred years ago so there's a fairly substantial "corporate memory" available to railway operators.

 

[anti-pacer]

Looking at RTT it seems that combined with trains coming through from the Midlands, Oxfordshire and Buckinghamshire, some trains are starting at Wembley Stadium on journeys to Marylebone.

 

[Bald Rick]

Firstly, not everyone uses rail. I forget the percentage, but a rather significant number drive, parking up to a couple of miles away.

That leaves 50-60k to get away by rail. Not everyone leaves at the same time - a notable proportion of people leave before the end, and the rest can take up to 20 mins just to get out of the stadium.

Wembley Park will take around 30-40k an hour southbound on its own. A decent proportion head north, having parked at various stations on the Met and Jubilee. A queuing system is in place.

Then between the Chiltern at Stadium, LO, the Bakerloo and LM calling specially (at Central), everyone gets away easily within an hour of the finish.

 

[AM9]

Stanmore is a major railhead for Wembley events. The large car park starts emptying out at just the right time for arrivers from the M1, A1 and A41, to take the empty trains south to Wembley Park. Wembley Park station is well organised to take the departing crowds with a large footbridge at the country end of the platforms. They sometimes hold the flow back for up to a minute to allow a platform to clear and let the train depart. The majority of passengers do travel southbound though on both the Met and Jubilee. Quite a few alight at West Hampstead to walk over to the Thameslink trains, whilst many of the rest go to Baker St, Kings Cross or Waterloo.
All in all, a pretty efficient operation, an example of what a well organised metro service can do

 

[theblackwatch]

I went to a concert at Wembley Arena once and we were heading back to the tube, but we noticed a Chiltern train to Marylebone and hopped on that. Managed to overtake the scrum on the Bakerloo.

A lot of 'normals' tend not to think of alternatives, and just go with the crowds. I remember going to a concert at Finsbury Park once - the masses all headed for the Underground after it, while three of us went to the main line station and waited on a relatively quiet platform for the 313 unit to King's Cross.

 

[Statto]

Hillingdon Tube is a good P&R for Wembley, being just off the M40/A40 plus you're going against majority of the traffic, ideal for quick getaways after a Wembley event. If only using Tube to/from Central London, then head to in the other direction to Harrow then double back to Central London, purchasing a Travelcard comes in handy for this.

 

[Jordeh]

There's carefully managed crowd management along Wembley Way (or Olympic Way to be precise) from the stadium up to Wembley Park station. Large numbers of stewards hold big "stop" and "go" signs and the crowds are pulsed through the station to prevent overcrowding. As previously mentioned, it can take around 45 minutes to get on a train after leaving the stadium due to the queueing.

Typically London Underground run extra trains on the Jubilee and Metropolitan lines too as well as opening an additional Metropolitan platform at Wembley Park.

 

[hassaanhc]

A lot of 'normals' tend not to think of alternatives, and just go with the crowds. I remember going to a concert at Finsbury Park once - the masses all headed for the Underground after it, while three of us went to the main line station and waited on a relatively quiet platform for the 313 unit to King's Cross.

Remember, if it's not on the Tube map, many people don't realise it exists! Especially if LUL services are at the same station or nearby, so TfL journey planner rarely shows them. For example, years ago family members on multiple occasions did Hounslow area to East Croydon using Piccadilly and District Lines via Victoria, instead of SWT via Clapham Junction! Indeed, the first time I used the south London suburban network (with an enthusiast I'd met for the first time), I went back from Crystal Palace to Hounslow area via Victoria and Hammersmith instead of changing at Clapham Junction!

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

I'm currently watching the Tottenham v Ghent match on TV and there's over 80,000 in the stadium, which tonight is Wembley.

The final match result means that this particular Tottenham Hotspur use of Wembley Stadium will not be repeated in any further Europa matches this season.

 

[Clip]

Looking at RTT it seems that combined with trains coming through from the Midlands, Oxfordshire and Buckinghamshire, some trains are starting at Wembley Stadium on journeys to Marylebone.

Bald Rick has covered most of the best parts but I know from experience that Chiltern have a very well planned queuing system and have extra trains going in both directions and as you have discovered some Wembley starters back into London.

And going towards the likes of Denham and GX where a lot of people park and ride into Wembley.

 

[BanburyBlue]

I went to Wembley a couple of years ago to see the Charity Shield with my lad. I was travelling back to Banbury so was taking the Chiltern line, whereas my so was heading for Liverpool Street so was departing from Wembley Park.

My lad was on his train way before me. I guess the frequency of tube trains meant his queue was quite quick.

The issue with Chiltern is there were additional trains put on to get people into Central London, but trains heading north were existing services with an additional stop at Wembley Stadium. I was very surprised no additional trains were put on Northbound. Had to wait ages while loads of London bound trains were put on. When we did get on the platform, had to squeeze onto trains that were already mostly full with late Saturday afternoon traffic.

 

[telstarbox]

Who was playing?

 

[Tetchytyke]

Who was playing?

Spuds against Gent, and the Spuds lost

I've been to Wembley a few times, to see England play and also to see Bradford in the League Cup final a few years ago. It's never that bad getting down Wembley/Olympic Way, because of how big the footprint of the stadium is you end up with a steady stream of people rather than one big deluge, because it takes so long to get out and round. Which way I went depended on where in the stadium I was; if you're in the south west corner the quickest way back to town is from Wembley Stadium station on Chiltern. The walk down Wembley High Road to Central is sufficiently annoying to not be worth it.

 

[BanburyBlue]

Who was playing?

And if you meant when I went with my lad, it was Chelsea vs Man U.

Looking back in the records it was 2009, when the mighty Blues thrashed Man U in a penalty shoot out.

 

[Shaw S Hunter]

The final match result means that this particular Tottenham Hotspur use of Wembley Stadium will not be repeated in any further Europa matches this season.

I take it you are aware that it seems almost certain that both Spurs and Chelsea will be playing their home games at Wembley next season? Every likelihood that both will qualify for Europe at the end of this season so even more European club fans could be visiting Wembley next season.

 

[BanburyBlue]

I take it you are aware that it seems almost certain that both Spurs and Chelsea will be playing their home games at Wembley next season? Every likelihood that both will qualify for Europe at the end of this season so even more European club fans could be visiting Wembley next season.

Can't see Chelsea moving out of Stamford Bridge just yet. Think the planning process has got a fair way to go. Perhaps 2018/19 season?

 

[Shaw S Hunter]

Can't see Chelsea moving out of Stamford Bridge just yet. Think the planning process has got a fair way to go. Perhaps 2018/19 season?

Planning permission already granted. Chelsea have to move out for four seasons with work due to start before the end of this year. Twickenham are not very interested so Wembley is very likely the answer. Nothing has been formally agreed yet as Chelsea had hoped for exclusive use but already there has been talk of which events will not be hosted at Wembley as well as a reduction in off-season events to avoid going over the limits imposed by the operating "license".

 

[didcotdean]

Can't find the documents at the moment, but as I recall the public transport plan from Wembley Stadium is based on getting everyone away by 90 minutes after the end of an event and in general this is achieved by some margin.

 

[BanburyBlue]

I take it you are aware that it seems almost certain that both Spurs and Chelsea will be playing their home games at Wembley next season? Every likelihood that both will qualify for Europe at the end of this season so even more European club fans could be visiting Wembley next season.

Doesn't Mr Khan have to give the nod? How long will that take? And the press release did say long way to go in gaining other approvals (not sure what these are though?). That's why I was assuming fair way to go until the JCBs turn up.

Aren't there restrictions on how many events are held at Twickenham?

 

[Scotty]

And if you meant when I went with my lad, it was Chelsea vs Man U.

Looking back in the records it was 2009, when the mighty Blues thrashed Man U in a penalty shoot out.

Went to that one, too. I used Wemley Stadium station, and remember seeing Chris de Burgh (and his lovely daughter - not wearing red ) in the queue.

 

[Shaw S Hunter]

Doesn't Mr Khan have to give the nod? How long will that take? And the press release did say long way to go in gaining other approvals (not sure what these are though?). That's why I was assuming fair way to go until the JCBs turn up.

Aren't there restrictions on how many events are held at Twickenham?

Don't think Khan has any say, planning permission has been granted by Fulham & Hammersmith council. The rebuild is almost entirely within the existing footprint (hence the 4 season absence) apart from covering over the WLL and building a direct link to Fulham Broadway station (which will probably be enough to deal with concerns about larger crowds).

Twickenham already looks dead in the water. Wembley's operating license has some definite restrictions, in particular a limit on the number of "major events": these are defined as crowds over 50,000. So if a PL club (whoever they are) play there then most games will be restricted to that number. Wembley have already said that they will honour their existing contracts with the likes of RFL & NFL but if two clubs end up there for any period that some existing events would have to re-locate. In particular the non-league finals (Trophy & Vase) as well as England friendlies. The other approvals will relate to these as well as coming to an understanding that's agreed by both Chelsea and Spurs.

 

[philthetube]

Extra midweek games will delay the Mon-Wed evening Finchley Road blockade.

 

[SpacePhoenix]

Don't think Khan has any say, planning permission has been granted by Fulham & Hammersmith council. The rebuild is almost entirely within the existing footprint (hence the 4 season absence) apart from covering over the WLL and building a direct link to Fulham Broadway station (which will probably be enough to deal with concerns about larger crowds).

Twickenham already looks dead in the water. Wembley's operating license has some definite restrictions, in particular a limit on the number of "major events": these are defined as crowds over 50,000. So if a PL club (whoever they are) play there then most games will be restricted to that number. Wembley have already said that they will honour their existing contracts with the likes of RFL & NFL but if two clubs end up there for any period that some existing events would have to re-locate. In particular the non-league finals (Trophy & Vase) as well as England friendlies. The other approvals will relate to these as well as coming to an understanding that's agreed by both Chelsea and Spurs.

Does the Olympic Stadium have any restrictions on the number of major events that it's allowed to hold?