Atlantic Coast Express coach formations

[RPI]

I wonder if anyone can point me towards a source for the above, but also of the one or two relief trains that ran. Am I right in thinking that the whole train would mostly be formed of BCK vehicles? The time period im interested in is from around 1960-64.

Thanks in advance.

 

[hexagon789]

I wonder if anyone can point me towards a source for the above, but also of the one or two relief trains that ran. Am I right in thinking that the whole train would mostly be formed of BCK vehicles? The time period im interested in is from around 1960-64.

Thanks in advance.

Try Robert Caroll's former Yahoo Group, now on groups . io:

main groups.io Group

A group for railway enthusiasts, professionals (past and present) historians and modellers to discuss and share information about the locomotive-hauled coaching stock of British Railways from nationalisation (1948-present). Multiple units are outside the scope of the group. The group covers...

brcoachingstock.groups.io

You will find Carriage Marshalling books for the period you want and you can also pose questions to other members who may be able to assist.

 

[Taunton]

I wonder if anyone can point me towards a source for the above, but also of the one or two relief trains that ran. Am I right in thinking that the whole train would mostly be formed of BCK vehicles? The time period im interested in is from around 1960-64.

Thanks in advance.

Each destination section would indeed have a BCK, plus as many SK as required. There was also the centre of the train, with the restaurant cars, which came off at Exeter.

When reliefs were run, typically on summer Saturdays, the various destinations would be divided between the trains, which would have additional SKs. Platform staff at Waterloo had the task of ensuring everyone was in the right coaches, and those for Salisbury or Exeter were put in the section likely to have the most available seats. A travelling ticket collector then worked through the train after Salisbury double-checking everyone was still in the right coach. It worked ... most of the time!

The BCK was needed as much for heavy luggage and parcels in the van to the final destinations as for the first class, which with mostly leisure passengers there was little demand for.

 

[RPI]

Each destination section would indeed have a BCK, plus as many SK as required. There was also the centre of the train, with the restaurant cars, which came off at Exeter.

When reliefs were run, typically on summer Saturdays, the various destinations would be divided between the trains, which would have additional SKs. Platform staff at Waterloo had the task of ensuring everyone was in the right coaches, and those for Salisbury or Exeter were put in the section likely to have the most available seats. A travelling ticket collector then worked through the train after Salisbury double-checking everyone was still in the right coach. It worked ... most of the time!

The BCK was needed as much for heavy luggage and parcels in the van to the final destinations as for the first class, which with mostly leisure passengers there was little demand for.

A great insight, thank you. My main interest is of the Bude/Padstow portions and the formations west of Okehampton, I have many books but the captions are never hugely detailed. Would the through coach(es) be attached to a local set? I seem to remember seeing a picture of a West Country somewhere in the wilds of North Cornwall with a couple of Maunsells and a BCK on the rear, the caption went into no detail. The ACE and the North Cornwall line are two subjects that fascinate me.

Try Robert Caroll's former Yahoo Group, now on groups . io:

main groups.io Group

A group for railway enthusiasts, professionals (past and present) historians and modellers to discuss and share information about the locomotive-hauled coaching stock of British Railways from nationalisation (1948-present). Multiple units are outside the scope of the group. The group covers...

brcoachingstock.groups.io

You will find Carriage Marshalling books for the period you want and you can also pose questions to other members who may be able to assist.

Thank you, I have just requested to join.

 

[30907]

A great insight, thank you. My main interest is of the Bude/Padstow portions and the formations west of Okehampton, I have many books but the captions are never hugely detailed. Would the through coach(es) be attached to a local set? I seem to remember seeing a picture of a West Country somewhere in the wilds of North Cornwall with a couple of Maunsells and a BCK on the rear, the caption went into no detail. The ACE and the North Cornwall line are two subjects that fascinate me.

Generally the various BCKs would be attached to a local set, but the ACE, unusually, was Padstow/Ilfracombe rather than Plymouth/Ilfracombe, so the Bulleid 2-R set was the North Cornwall train, with a loose SK attached at Exeter and the Bude BCK detached at Halwill.

Thank you, I have just requested to join.

1960 is available and is typical for the "traditional" ACE and all the reliefs for the 1950s.

The accelerated version from 1962 or 63 was a complete change: 3-set Ilfracombe, 5-set including Restaurants Exeter, 3-set Padstow, and not a BCK to be seen!

 

[Harvester]

There is an interesting photograph in the November 1962 issue of Modern Railways showing 34023 Chard leaving Padstow tender first with a single BCK on the 6:26 pm to Wadebridge in 1962. I suspect this was the one coach Padstow portion of the ACE returning to Wadebridge for overnight stabling and servicing!

 

[30907]

There is an interesting photograph in the November 1962 issue of Modern Railways showing 34023 Chard leaving Padstow tender first with a single BCK on the 6:26 pm to Wadebridge in 1962. I suspect this was the one coach Padstow portion of the ACE returning to Wadebridge for overnight stabling and servicing!

Quite possibly.

Related point - I should have mentioned that the winter train ran as a stopper west of Okehampton, and with only a BCK from London plus the Exeter SK.

 

[Big Jumby 74]

I wonder if anyone can point me towards a source for the above, but also of the one or two relief trains that ran. Am I right in thinking that the whole train would mostly be formed of BCK vehicles? The time period im interested in is from around 1960-64.

First off, apologies to any one else above who may well have given the answer(s) you need, but have just grabbed my summer 1963 CWN (I believe the ACE was withdrawn as a through named train at the end of summer 64? - the CWN for that period I don't have).
Also, I do not possess the relevant Appendix to the CWN to give details of actual carriage types within the various 'Set' formations, so this can only be a guide;

The ACE itself (11 a.m. Waterloo) shown formed thus from Waterloo;

FX, until 25/7 and from 26/8, also FO

Ilfracombe 3 Set L, (in my time, 1970's BR Mk 1's, these were formed BSK/CK/BSK if my memory is correct, but this varied over the years).
Padstow 5 Set,
Exeter Ctl 1 RKB, 1 RCO,
Exmouth 1 BCK,
Sidmouth 1 BCK

FX, 29/7 to 22/8

Ilfracombe 2 Set R, 3 Set L,
Exeter Ctl 1 RKB, 1 RCO,
Exmouth 3 Set L,
Sidmouth 2 BCK

Then the 11.05 Relief, FX, 29/7 to 22/8 as follows from Waterloo;

Padstow 5 Set
Exeter Ctl 1 RB, 1 RUO, 2 Set R, 3 Set L (MO), 2 Set R (ThO).

Basically a bit of a minefield taking all various dates and formation variations in to account!

 

[30907]

First off, apologies to any one else above who may well have given the answer(s) you need, but have just grabbed my summer 1963 CWN (I believe the ACE was withdrawn as a through named train at the end of summer 64? - the CWN for that period I don't have).
Also, I do not possess the relevant Appendix to the CWN to give details of actual carriage types within the various 'Set' formations, so this can only be a guide;

The ACE itself (11 a.m. Waterloo) shown formed thus from Waterloo;

FX, until 25/7 and from 26/8, also FO

Ilfracombe 3 Set L, (in my time, 1970's BR Mk 1's, these were formed BSK/CK/BSK if my memory is correct, but this varied over the years).
Padstow 5 Set,
Exeter Ctl 1 RKB, 1 RCO,
Exmouth 1 BCK,
Sidmouth 1 BCK

FX, 29/7 to 22/8

Ilfracombe 2 Set R, 3 Set L,
Exeter Ctl 1 RKB, 1 RCO,
Exmouth 3 Set L,
Sidmouth 2 BCK

Then the 11.05 Relief, FX, 29/7 to 22/8 as follows from Waterloo;

Padstow 5 Set
Exeter Ctl 1 RB, 1 RUO, 2 Set R, 3 Set L (MO), 2 Set R (ThO).

Basically a bit of a minefield taking all various dates and formation variations in to account!

Thanks. My reply upthread relates to the winter service, and my memory is of BR standard stock; 2R sets were Bulleid (BCK/BSK) as were the BCKs (which, to annoy modellers, Bulleid designed differently from the ones in the 2R). The RKB would have been a Mk1 probably by then, but the RCO an ex-Tavern saloon. 5-sets were a 3-set with two extra SKs.