Bank Holiday Engineering Works

[Furrball]

Hearing from various people travelling today that trains are very overcrowded.

Given the chaos that ensued on Saturday with East Coast and the fortunate fact that planned engineering works that would have affected Virgin services it is time to reconsider weekends, or especially Bank Holidays being 'quiet' periods in which line closures can take place?

Alternatively much better diversionary routes need to be in place or single line working rather than dramatic reductions in services/train replacement services?

(I dislike the term rail replacement - you are providing a service to replace a train, not a rail therefore it is a train replacement service!)

 

[Cherry_Picker]

Bank Holidays are by far and away the quietest days of the year even when there is no engineering works in my experience of working on the railways.
Plus there is the obvious fact that if you dig up the track on a weekend or a bank holiday you are inconveniencing people who travel with you once or twice a year instead of five times a week.

 

[SS4]

Bank Holidays are by far and away the quietest days of the year even when there is no engineering works in my experience of working on the railways.
Plus there is the obvious fact that if you dig up the track on a weekend or a bank holiday you are inconveniencing people who travel with you once or twice a year instead of five times a week.

Agreed, there are far fewer people travelling during the week than there is at bank holidays. Same applies for weekends. Maintenance work cannot be done overnight all the time.

Perhaps cancelling the engineering work due to ECML delays would have been a nice gesture due to problems there before (like Virgin did re the ash cloud) yet by the time it was known the contractors would have been nearby

 

[Furrball]

Ok - points made - but it would appear that the balance is not correct.

Overcrowding levels in places that rival that of weekday services.

Paying the same as a weekday service only to be transported around the country on a coach rather than a train.
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Plus there is the obvious fact that if you dig up the track on a weekend or a bank holiday you are inconveniencing people who travel with you once or twice a year instead of five times a week.

For the journey in question they may be paying the same fare.

If you went into a restaurant and the person sat next to you was served a perfectly cooked meal but you got something that looked like it was taken out of the rubbish and thrown onto the plate would you accept

'Well that gentleman eats with us every day of the week whereas we have no idea who you are'

as acceptable logic?

If the operators are offering what in effect is a B grade service should the fares being charged not reflect this?

On a Bank Holiday I would imagine that whilst Saturday and Sunday may be quieter the volume of passengers traveling on Monday afternoon/evening may be considerable.

 

[SS4]

For the journey in question they may be paying the same fare.

Very unlikely. Off-Peak tickets are valid all day on Public Holidays. In addition there is no minimum fare on railcards. That being said

If you went into a restaurant and the person sat next to you was served a perfectly cooked meal but you got something that looked like it was taken out of the rubbish and thrown onto the plate would you accept

'Well that gentleman eats with us every day of the week whereas we have no idea who you are'

as acceptable logic?

A spurious comparison. Everyone who travels on a bank holiday is subjected to the same conditions regardless of ticket type. To use your restaurant analogy: if you walk into a restaurant who have clearly signposted for weeks that due to maintenance of the kitchen facilities only cold food is on offer and normal service will be resumed the day after it doesn't matter whether you go there daily or annually, you'll both receive cold food.

If the operators are offering what in effect is a B grade service should the fares being charged not reflect this?

In a way they are. Like I said before off-peak tickets are valid all day - you have to remember that Anytime fares are the "main" fares and other fares are discounted from those. In addition we're told weeks in advance what is going to happen.

On a Bank Holiday I would imagine that whilst Saturday and Sunday may be quieter the volume of passengers traveling on Monday afternoon/evening may be considerable.

Travelling*. You may wish to install an en_GB dictionary to spell check your browser

That is true (particularly with the off-peak easement) yet would the volume of passengers on a Bank Holiday Monday exceed those travelling on the equivalent services on a normal Monday?

 

[Cherry_Picker]

If you went into a restaurant and the person sat next to you was served a perfectly cooked meal but you got something that looked like it was taken out of the rubbish and thrown onto the plate would you accept

'Well that gentleman eats with us every day of the week whereas we have no idea who you are'

as acceptable logic?

If the operators are offering what in effect is a B grade service should the fares being charged not reflect this?

On a Bank Holiday I would imagine that whilst Saturday and Sunday may be quieter the volume of passengers traveling on Monday afternoon/evening may be considerable.

Classic straw man there, and while I have sympathy for your point, the truth is that its good practice to look after your regular customers on the railway.
My point of view might be skewed because I work on what is very much a commuter railway serving the two biggest cities in the country, but in 15+ years of working on the railway have never seen a bank holiday where passenger numbers can compare to a typical Monday-Friday morning/evening peak.
Commuters are the lifeblood of the railways and its only fair that engineering works are scheduled to suit their needs first.

 

[Furrball]

Ok, I will accept some of the points above.

However on numerous occassions it has been necessary to purchase full price tickets rather than advance due to engineering works. Why should the paying passenger be penalised due to issues between the TOC and NR?

Was it also not the case that in BR days additional services were provided in the form of reliefs rather than actually reducing the number of seats available.

Having been at Euston this evening to meet my girlfriend, service arriving were very busy. The service my girlfriend was travelling on (Glasgow - Euston) was packed with people sitting on the floor in 1st class.

On a separate but related note the guard was not seen after leaving Penrith - nor was their an announcement declassifying the train. The only announcement in 1st class was that due to H&S reasons the trolley would not be coming through - this being made at Lancaster.

 

[Greenback]

My two penn'orth:

Not all commuters are off on a bank holiday.

Some trains are much busier on a bank holiday, but most are quieter.